Thoughts about Dr Richard/Alice Novic

[Erika1487]

My thoughts are as follows Alice in Genderland: A Crossdresser Comes of Age I saw much of myself in Alice's story. My struggle with self-acceptance continues even after 8 months of HRT and reading her book was like opening a window in a darkend room. To hear her speak with such honesty, clarity, openness, reason is truly inspiring! I bought this book in summer of 2009 a full year before I strarted transition. No book I have read before or after has had such an impact on my trans life.
On a scale from 1/10 I give it a solid 10!! If you are trans/tv/cd this is a must read.

Here is an opposing veiw from a psychologist from the U.K

This book is one of the most sexist, gender-stereotypical books I have ever read. The author categorises interests, personalities, hobbies, activities, etc. as being EITHER masculine/male OR feminine/female, and doesn't seem able to consider the possibility that a single individual can possess both 'sides' simultaneously (literally, at the same time). Instead, in order to engage in supposedly 'feminine' behaviour (an issue I will come to in a moment), one has to look/act like a woman, and vice versa for 'masculine' behaviour. The two 'sides' never comfortably co-exist for this author.

The blatant sexism really steps to the fore with the author's notions regarding those activities/interests/behaviours that are supposed to belong exclusively to women. Apparently, we women spend our time "fussing" over each other's clothes, lying back with our tousled, long hair, giggling, being coy about sex, and waiting - passively, of course - to be "taken." Apparently, we don't have hopes and dreams (let alone real lives) beyond those that pertain to men and our appearance.

To add fuel to the fire, the author seems boastful about that fact that s/he gets to pick and choose those aspects of (supposed) womanhood that s/he enjoys, leaving the dirty laundry (literally and figuratively) of being a woman to her/his wife. Who takes primary responsibility for the running of the household and the children?? Certainly not the author! When it comes time to deal with this kind of stuff, s/he is now a man and, therefore, not obliged to participate equally.

It seems to me that the author's understanding of what it is to be a woman is entirely derived from male (sexual) fantasy and a lack of understanding of real women's *complete* lives. Or if not a lack of understanding, than an explicit decision to ignore those other parts, because they just aren't so fun/sexy, are they?

And the icing on the cake is that the author uses psychological theory to justify his egocentrism. S/he claims everything s/he does falls under the auspices of "self-actualization" and is, therefore, beyond reproach. As a psychologist myself, I must point out that the author does not use this term very accurately. Self-actualization is NOT doing whatever you want, no matter its effects on everyone else. Self-actualization is: achieving an understanding of oneself and one's place in the world, knowing and accepting one's assets and faults (as well as the assets and faults of others), tolerating ambiguity (things don't have to be either/or), having compassion for others, being humble, being ethical (with respect to both means and ends), and finding meaning *outside oneself*.

Apple

Please share your own thoughts on Dr Novic.

[yodajazz]

I would not say the critic is entirely wrong, just overly negative. What is true of the Alice is partially true of everyone who has dreams. A boy dreams of being a quarterback, throwing the game winning touchdown, not necessarily hours of practice drills in the summer heat, or being knocked unconscious by an opposing lineman. People dream of the positive things, like winning the lottery and be able to decide to but whatever they want, not hearing from every distant acquaintance, who needs money.

Plus we know that the average t-person is one who wants to keep traditional gender boundries, vs a gender deconstuctionist, who wants to break down the rules. I do remember reading about Alice, that she had two distinct lives; one as a male who was a father, and another as a woman, who even had a boyfriend. But the lives were entirely separate. So Alice believed in having two lives, but only one gender at a time. I think that’s interesting.

Something makes me tink the reviewer is a woman, with feminist leanings.

[Nicole Dupre]

I didn't read the book, but the above criticism didn't mince words. lol I'll assume the author must've somewhat set themselves up for that, unless the references to the book are fake. But I don't see how any book could prepare you for womanhood, more than simply living as a woman does.

Transitioning is never easy or convenient, even if you don't get clocked early on, by doing "guy things". lol Cliff Notes aren't going to make or break the experience for you, I don't think.

And as I said in your other thread, I was somewhat athletic and healthy, but never played boys' sports, or was even remotely a "jock". lol To me, that would've been like saying "Where do I sign up to be a dude?" lol

Also, I think it's kinda weird you wouldn't wanna just lose whatever unhealthy weight you have on your upper body, and get real implants. To me, if you're doing it, you're doing it like yesterday. If not, you're a perv. :-P

[Nicole Dupre]

I also think the forced feminization fetish you wrote about in your email is somewhat questionable, if you're truly seeking womanhood.

[Mayrah]

Take her under your wing Nicole! :p

[Birgitta]

There are a lot of guys like that who pretend to know what its like to be a woman, and writing books about it, doing television shows etc, making life hard for the girls who are feminine, because gg /females arent stupid, and also will not believe the crap most twoman try to sell the world...

Most of the time, tswoman seem to be guys cultivating a fetish, not woman fighting with the fate of being born in the wrong body

[Nicole Dupre]

Let phobun do it. I don't want anyone under my wing. I'm just trying to understand it, I s'pose partially because I'm nosy. lol But there are a lot of unstable variations under the "TG" umbrella which can give trannys a worse name.

Recently someone spilled the beans to a few girls about bouncing back and forth with their F/T gender, for like the 5th or 6th time. To me, that means you have bigger issues. It's more like an identity crisis than a gender thing.

I think there are lots of guys who enjoy jerking off dressed as women, and they slip through the cracks into some type of quasi-transsexuality.

[Nowhere]

There are a lot of guys like that who pretend to know what its like to be a woman, and writing books about it, doing television shows etc, making life hard for the girls who are feminine, because gg /females arent stupid, and also will not believe the crap most twoman try to sell the world...

Most of the time, tswoman seem to be guys cultivating a fetish, not woman fighting with the fate of being born in the wrong body

Well, I think it's hard to gage how frequent or infrequent it is, since it's almost impossible to have stats on it, but just remember by making such statements, it undermines the legitimate trans women by putting the default perspective that it's a fetish "guys cultivating a fetish, not woman." This sort of feeds those people who are prejudice against trans women and makes it even harder than it already is to live their lives. Even if it was somehow true, it's not helping one bit, if not hurting all trans women to say it.

And, it'll never be provable, either way.

But, I do think Alice / Dr Richards is using the wrong terms. There's a sort of necessary seriousness that exists if someone is truly trans, making it truly impossible to live as a man (and weekends won't cut it) that she doesn't have. Now, I do believe gender identity is on a scale like kinsey had with sexuality, so maybe Alice / Dr Richards is somewhat in the middle, but she's still more a bi transvestite than a bi trans woman.

But that doesn't matter, to me. While one could argue that Alice / Dr Richards undermines 'real' trans women, I think it's the act of judgment that undermines trans women, and it's best to just not do it, in general. Everyone's got their own path in life, many people are for periods in some sort of mixed up purgatory and none of us truly know how it is to be in another shoes, so if this works for her and is how she sees herself for the moment, good for her.

[Erika1487]

I would not say the critic is entirely wrong, just overly negative. What is true of the Alice is partially true of everyone who has dreams. A boy dreams of being a quarterback, throwing the game winning touchdown, not necessarily hours of practice drills in the summer heat, or being knocked unconscious by an opposing lineman. People dream of the positive things, like winning the lottery and be able to decide to but whatever they want, not hearing from every distant acquaintance, who needs money.

Plus we know that the average t-person is one who wants to keep traditional gender boundries, vs a gender deconstuctionist, who wants to break down the rules. I do remember reading about Alice, that she had two distinct lives; one as a male who was a father, and another as a woman, who even had a boyfriend. But the lives were entirely separate. So Alice believed in having two lives, but only one gender at a time. I think that’s interesting.

Something makes me tink the reviewer is a woman, with feminist leanings.


Something makes me tink the reviewer is a woman, with feminist leanings :iagree: 100%
I think Dr Novic is/has experienced the Dual- role transvestism to the full tilt and even flirted with hormones a bit. It is interesting to think that "She is a father and full time psychiatrist in the LA area.
I have also heard she is fairly well known in some clubs in LA.

[Erika1487]

I didn't read the book, but the above criticism didn't mince words. lol I'll assume the author must've somewhat set themselves up for that, unless the references to the book are fake. But I don't see how any book could prepare you for womanhood, more than simply living as a woman does.

Transitioning is never easy or convenient, even if you don't get clocked early on, by doing "guy things". lol Cliff Notes aren't going to make or break the experience for you, I don't think.

And as I said in your other thread, I was somewhat athletic and healthy, but never played boys' sports, or was even remotely a "jock". lol To me, that would've been like saying "Where do I sign up to be a dude?" lol

Also, I think it's kinda weird you wouldn't wanna just lose whatever unhealthy weight you have on your upper body, and get real implants. To me, if you're doing it, you're doing it like yesterday. If not, you're a perv. :-P

And as I said in your other thread, I was somewhat athletic and healthy, but never played boys' sports, or was even remotely a "jock". lol To me, that would've been like saying "Where do I sign up to be a dude?" lol

Yes I was a former football player. I still enjoy watching football and supporting My HS team. I even donate to thier "travel fund"
So I have a hobby & interest in football does that make me less of a trans person....I think not.

Also, I think it's kinda weird you wouldn't wanna just lose whatever unhealthy weight you have on your upper body, and get real implants. To me, if you're doing it, you're doing it like yesterday. If not, you're a perv.

I am growing natural breasts under HRT. Whats wrong with that??? I know I need to shed a few pounds, but my breasts woult still be a full C cup even if I did! Like I said before my final breast size will be a FULL D CUP.
Why then would I want implants to make them a DD or DDD that makes no sense to me:confused: It must be a Jersey thing :)

[Yvonne183]

I didn't read the book nor do I know who Dr. Richards is. But in a way I do agree with the critic in that some tgirls do follow stereotypical ways of what they believe a woman should be.

GG's can act and dress any way they want, they can have any type of job or lifestyle yet for the most part they are still female. They don't lose being a woman cause they throw a football about. But to some tgirls there seems to be a sort of rule book on the things one can do or dress in order to be feminine.

I know this doesn't apply to all tgirls but quite a few fall into the belief that there is only one way to be a woman and there are certain things one does to be feminine and unlike the gg, if a tgirl wants to throw a football around this is perceived as being un-feminine or too masculine.

On a personal note, on some occasions i get labeled as being too masculine cause I wear sneakers and refuse to wear heeled shoes. Yet most gg's I see walking about are mostly wearing sneakers, yet they are females and they don't lose being a female cause they wear sneakers. Yet to some, I lose being a female cause I wear sneakers. It's cause some tgirls make rules on how one should live their lives.

[BellaBellucci]

I know Alice. I've talked to her a few times at various clubs. I find her to be very sincere in my limited experience with her, but I admit that I did not read her book nor ever meet Richard. I don't think her views can hurt the TS community either. She has been quite clear on what her gender identity is and that she is a crossdresser, so I don't see how there could be any confusion.

~BB~

[yodajazz]

Well, I think it's hard to gage how frequent or infrequent it is, since it's almost impossible to have stats on it, but just remember by making such statements, it undermines the legitimate trans women by putting the default perspective that it's a fetish "guys cultivating a fetish, not woman." This sort of feeds those people who are prejudice against trans women and makes it even harder than it already is to live their lives. Even if it was somehow true, it's not helping one bit, if not hurting all trans women to say it.

And, it'll never be provable, either way.

But, I do think Alice / Dr Richards is using the wrong terms. There's a sort of necessary seriousness that exists if someone is truly trans, making it truly impossible to live as a man (and weekends won't cut it) that she doesn't have. Now, I do believe gender identity is on a scale like kinsey had with sexuality, so maybe Alice / Dr Richards is somewhat in the middle, but she's still more a bi transvestite than a bi trans woman.

But that doesn't matter, to me. While one could argue that Alice / Dr Richards undermines 'real' trans women, I think it's the act of judgment that undermines trans women, and it's best to just not do it, in general. Everyone's got their own path in life, many people are for periods in some sort of mixed up purgatory and none of us truly know how it is to be in another shoes, so if this works for her and is how she sees herself for the moment, good for her.

To me, saying Alice is a bi tranvestite, is too much of trying to force people into an outdated label/psychairactric model. But it's a human thing to place people into categories. So I would say that, Alice fits under the transgnedered umbrella, and is closer to the Native American concept of being two-spirited. Allowing people to live as they choose, gives more validity to those that choose to have surgeries and to be fully ts. There is a percentage of those that have srs, that come to regret it. The percentage maybe between 10 and 15 percentage. Perhaps, some of those with regrets were undully influenced by the idea that one has to fit, in with too narrow of a definition, to be whole. This also applies to many other people. For example those, adults who are made to feel guilty for not becoming parents of children.


I didn't read the book nor do I know who Dr. Richards is. But in a way I do agree with the critic in that some tgirls do follow stereotypical ways of what they believe a woman should be.

GG's can act and dress any way they want, they can have any type of job or lifestyle yet for the most part they are still female. They don't lose being a woman cause they throw a football about. But to some tgirls there seems to be a sort of rule book on the things one can do or dress in order to be feminine.

I know this doesn't apply to all tgirls but quite a few fall into the belief that there is only one way to be a woman and there are certain things one does to be feminine and unlike the gg, if a tgirl wants to throw a football around this is perceived as being un-feminine or too masculine.

On a personal note, on some occasions i get labeled as being too masculine cause I wear sneakers and refuse to wear heeled shoes. Yet most gg's I see walking about are mostly wearing sneakers, yet they are females and they don't lose being a female cause they wear sneakers. Yet to some, I lose being a female cause I wear sneakers. It's cause some tgirls make rules on how one should live their lives.

I agree with this post also. But it seemed like the reviewer, would also be critical of 'girly girls'. It's about allowing people to choose what style they enjoy.

[Jericho]

I thought this thread was going somewhere.
Can we get back to the big tits in jerseys?

[SirCumsAlot]

somebody should start the world's first tranny football league, TFL. I want %30 of income for coming up with the idea