Just Saw Black Swan...

[stillies77]

Holy FUCK that movie was creepy as hell...from all the fingernail shit to Winona Ryder and a nail file and of course this...

http://media.tumblr.com/tumblr_ldretlZQ4R1qej5xj.gif


The part where the paintings eyes moved made me jump as well...What a crazy fuckin movie...



I think I loved it.

:)

[TsVanessa69]

It was a great fukkin movie! I didn't want to see it when I saw peviews, but went with friends and it was good!

[stillies77]

Yeah it was pretty awesome...when she said IT'S MY TURN! I was like OH SHIT!

[TsVanessa69]

Yeah it was pretty awesome...when she said IT'S MY TURN! I was like OH SHIT!
I like the fact that you were captivated and had to pay attention to get it.
The part with her on extacy and her lesbian dream was funny

[TSMichelleAustin]

Its a great movie.... she got so skinny for the movie, u can see her bones and rib cage. SHE Will probably win the OSCAR for this role, she was so spot on! All that guys movies are creepy and weird.

[stillies77]

I think she should win the oscar she went all out for this...I cant think of anyone else who could win it this year...not too many great female performances on par wth this one thats for sure.

And yeah the lesbo scene was good but the masterbation scene in her room when she flipped over on all fours took the cake for me...until her fuckin mom in the corner ruined it ahahaha

[TSMichelleAustin]

Her mom was creepy and crazy! I wish Wynonna was in movie longer, I loved seeing her back in a film! But ur right no woman actress went as far in their roles this year like she did. To train as a ballerina and to get that far into the role that it consumes you is amazing! Everyone in the movie was great! I didn't think I was going to like it, but Vanessa is right you have to really watch it to understand what is going on. I love the subtleness like when the lights go out in the dance room and she changes! MMMM SO GOOD!

[TsJennifer]

Loved the movie!

[rockabilly]

*wakes up* ... Did you say Natalie Portman masturbation scene? :)

[stillies77]

hell yeah dude and its amazing...there's two of em actually...her vag gets a lot of attention in this movie.


Edit:

Here ya go...





http://30.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lduzhnE2Xg1qa8ti8o1_r1_500.gif

http://26.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lej7n3dgEO1qb3u6ko1_500.gif




2.

[TsVanessa69]

I think she should win the oscar she went all out for this...I cant think of anyone else who could win it this year...not too many great female performances on par wth this one thats for sure.

And yeah the lesbo scene was good but the masterbation scene in her room when she flipped over on all fours took the cake for me...until her fuckin mom in the corner ruined it ahahaha
the mom was weird

[rockabilly]

hell yeah dude and its amazing...there's two of em actually...her vag gets a lot of attention in this movie.


Edit:

Here ya go...





http://30.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lduzhnE2Xg1qa8ti8o1_r1_500.gif

http://26.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lej7n3dgEO1qb3u6ko1_500.gif




2.

Giggitty Giggitty

[Jackal]

I heard it was an intense but great drama; of course, all three lead actresses are smoking hot too

[TsVanessa69]

I heard it was an intense but great drama; of course, all three lead actresses are smoking hot too
Totally agree!

[ELSAPO]

think I'm gunna take the ol gf to see this. She talks about about girl on girl shit. Hopefully this can get her one step closer.

[Stavros]

But is it ballet? UK paper The Guardian asked the experts for their views on the film:



What Britain's ballet stars made of Black Swan

Black Swan stars Natalie Portman as a ballerina hitting the big time. How realistic is the movie? We asked the cream of British ballet to give their verdicts


http://1.2.3.10/bmi/static.guim.co.uk/sys-images/Admin/BkFill/Default_image_group/2011/1/5/1294252408604/black-swan-natalie-portma-007.jpg Ruffling feathers ... Natalie Portman in Black Swan. Black Swan (http://www.guardian.co.uk/film/movie/137726/black-swan), directed by Darren Aronofsky (http://www.guardian.co.uk/film/darren-aronofsky), claims to penetrate to the romantic, obsessional heart of ballet (http://www.guardian.co.uk/stage/ballet). Based loosely on Swan Lake (http://www.guardian.co.uk/stage/2010/jul/14/swan-lake-review), the film follows Nina, its ballerina heroine, as she grapples with learning the dual role of Odette and Odile (the white and black swans in Swan Lake).


Black Swan
Production year: 2010
Country: USA
Runtime: 103 mins
Directors: Darren Aronofsky
Cast: Barbara Hershey, Mila Kunis, Natalie Portman, Vincent Cassel, Winona Ryder
More on this film (http://www.guardian.co.uk/film/movie/137726/black-swan)



Nina, played by Natalie Portman (http://www.guardian.co.uk/theobserver/2011/jan/02/observer-profile-natalie-portman), is bullied by her mother and director, works herself punitively hard and becomes violently paranoid about her rival, Lily. What tips her over the edge is the challenge of dancing the Black Swan (http://www.guardian.co.uk/film/movie/137726/black-swan). As Nina tackles the sexy, malevolent role, she unleashes dark forces within herself that plunge us into full-on cinematic horror (http://www.guardian.co.uk/film/horror).
Prior to the film's US release last month, the dance community had imagined Black Swan to be an update of Powell and Pressburger's ballet classic The Red Shoes (http://www.guardian.co.uk/film/2009/dec/10/the-red-shoes-film-review). As they've since discovered, the film has more in common with Roman Polanski's Rosemary's Baby (http://www.guardian.co.uk/film/2010/oct/22/rosemarys-baby-polanksi-horror): a terrifying portrayal of one woman's descent into madness, set in a world of claustrophobia and pain. Feathers have been ruffled: Robert Gottlieb, the New York Observer's dance critic, found (http://www.observer.com/2010/culture/dancing-dark-ballet-reduced-campy-cliches-black-swan) Aronofsky guilty of "recapitulating all the old ugly misrepresentations of ballet", and of portraying ballet as one great "sadomasochistic trip".
Certainly, from the vomiting of guilty calories to the torments inflicted by her sadistic choreographer (with a foreign accent, of course), Aronofsky runs with every stereotype. And the dance sections are brutal: the deliberately choppy style of filming isn't just alienating; it also robs those moving bodies of their true power and beauty.
Portman has been widely praised: she spent months in training, allowing her to do some reasonable faking with her upper body, arms and head. Her main dance material, though, is performed by body doubles.
But what do real dancers think of Black Swan? In Britain, the film isn't out for another fortnight, so the Guardian invited five of the biggest names in British ballet to an advance screening. Were their screams those of recognition, terror – or sheer hilarity?
Tamara Rojo (http://www.guardian.co.uk/stage/2010/dec/05/tamara-rojo-royal-ballet-interview) Principal dancer with the Royal Ballet (http://www.guardian.co.uk/stage/royal-ballet)
Natalie Portman needs to work on her port de bras (http://www.britannica.com/EBchecked/topic/470854/port-de-bras). I really have a problem with this film using an actress, not a dancer, to play Nina: the director seems to think that, in a few months, you can learn a profession that it takes years just to understand, let alone be good at. And in the film, Nina is supposed to be awesome.
This is a very lazy movie, featuring every ballet cliche going. If you want to look at the dark side of ballet, do it properly, don't just give us shots of a ballerina suddenly vomiting. Nina's mother was beyond the cliche of a ballet mum – she was a psychopath. And the only people who looked like they were having a good time were the ones having sex.
The ballet movies that dancers go back to are the ones that have had great dancers in them, like Mikhail Baryshnikov (http://www.guardian.co.uk/stage/2004/feb/18/dance), Moira Shearer (http://www.guardian.co.uk/news/2006/feb/02/guardianobituaries.filmnews), Roland Petit (http://www.guardian.co.uk/artanddesign/2009/sep/30/photography-willy-rizzo-best-shoot) and Zizi Jeanmaire (http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0419929/). Ballet isn't something you can just add on. The characters are important because they're dancers – and if they aren't very good ones, it doesn't make sense.
Lauren Cuthbertson (http://www.guardian.co.uk/stage/2004/dec/01/theatre3) Principal dancer with the Royal Ballet
I wish I wasn't a dancer looking at this film, so I could see it from another perspective. Portman is an incredible actress, and I can see why she jumped at this role. But, good as she is, it's impossible for her to look like a professional dancer. Maybe they needed her to sell the film, but [co-star] Vincent Cassel is a big name, too. And I'm sure they could have found a dancer of the right calibre to act the part.
Some of Nina's character felt accurate. We're all obsessive in how we approach a new role: it can dominate our thoughts for months. And some of us like to wear pastel colours sometimes. But in the film it's all so extreme. And Nina's such a good little girl; she wears pink all the time, and her hair in a bun, even when she's outside.
The film makes ballet look as though it's all blood, sweat, tears and sacrifice. Of course, that's suitable subject matter for a horror movie, but it doesn't show any of the pleasure.
Edward Watson (http://www.guardian.co.uk/stage/2007/apr/09/dance) Principal dancer with the Royal Ballet
The sad thing is that while this film shows the drive ballet dancers have to become perfect, it makes what we do look so naff and laughable. It doesn't show why ballet is so important to us – why we would want to try so hard.
The best part is the opening sequence, where you see Nina completely involved in her dancing. I didn't think Portman was bad: she had a good neck, face and focus. And the film was accurate about the stress levels in the profession. I've had those kind of dreams where I've missed performances, when I'm hearing the music, but I can't make it on to the stage in time.
But otherwise, it looked like they had taken all the cliches that they had been told about ballet and bundled them into a film. I've seen some choreographers play mindgames with dancers about who they are going to cast, but not with that kind of intensity.
The one cliche they didn't go for so much was the bitching. I thought there would be much more of it. I thought there would be dancers pushing each other down the stairs.
Elena Glurdjidze (http://www.guardian.co.uk/lifeandstyle/2009/may/30/chanel-tutu-glurdjidze-ballet) Principal dancer with English National Ballet
I was quite shocked by this; it wasn't at all what I expected. I thought Portman did quite well for someone who wasn't trained. She didn't look out of place at the barre, and I found it hard to tell when she was dancing and when it was the body double.
But so many scenes were exaggerated. And I didn't recognise anything about the ballet Swan Lake. When I was preparing for my first Odile [the Black Swan], I had a great dancer from the Mariinksy (http://www.mariinsky.ru/en/) telling me that I had to be seductive like a cat, but it was all within the context of the choreography. Yes, you have to use you imagination to get into a role – but not like Nina. I must say, though, I did like the Black Swan eye makeup they gave her. She looked amazing.
Cassa Pancho (http://www.balletblack.co.uk/company.html) Artistic director of Ballet Black
You can tell they did some research. Some of the smaller details, like the broken toenails and the way Nina works on her ballet shoes [scoring the soles, breaking down the blocked toes], were accurate. And I've seen dancers get paranoid, just like Nina, when they miss a rehearsal and find someone else has been standing in for them – although obviously not to the point where they smash the rival dancer in the mirror and drag her into the toilet by the ankles.
I hated the ballet director. He was ridiculously patronising and bullying. That scene when he comes into the class and starts telling the story of Swan Lake, then taps the shoulders of the dancers he doesn't want to use – if I tried that, my company would tackle me to the ground and send me to the hospital.
The most realistic character was Lily, who smokes and has fun. But even with her there are inaccurate details, like when she's rehearsing with her hair all loose. It's another cliche: "Look at me, I'm so relaxed because I don't put my hair into a bun."
Of course, this is a horror movie; it's meant to be extreme. There's been incredible feedback on Twitter, but what most people are saying is: don't worry about the ballet – go for the great lesbian action and the horror.

[TSMichelleAustin]

OMG Social Network beat out Black Swan for best director and picture.... Social Network SUCKED and was all based on fabricated lies. Black Swan was so artistic and original... sucks that blockbuster movie won over artistic.

[alyssaluxor]

this film is GORGEOUS!!!

[El Nino]

this film is GORGEOUS!!!

Um, no Alyssa... you are!!

[alyssaluxor]

Um, no Alyssa... you are!!
:kiss::kiss::kiss:

[Prospero]

Alyssa IS gorgeous - the fil on the other hand is deeply disturbing and very powerful and who cares if its not wholly accurate in the ballet stakes. That's hardly the point.

[alyssaluxor]

Alyssa IS gorgeous - the fil on the other hand is deeply disturbing and very powerful and who cares if its not wholly accurate in the ballet stakes. That's hardly the point.

mwahhhhhhhhhhhhh!

:kiss:

[bassman2546]

OMG Social Network beat out Black Swan for best director and picture.... Social Network SUCKED and was all based on fabricated lies. Black Swan was so artistic and original... sucks that blockbuster movie won over artistic.

I agree, they had a hardon for Social Network and Glee this year, but wait for the SAGs, the Screen Actors Guild members will give an accurate assessment of the movies.

[hwbs]

I saw it over the weekend.....good flick

[effigyc]

great movie

[Prospero]

Kings Speech is also a very good film

[Stavros]

Surely the Golden Globes are now known to be fixed, and with only a few hundred people voting they represent a small clique in Hollywood anyway; hard to believe a useless lump like Colin Firth can get an award for 'acting' but not surprising a woman pretending to be a ballerina-as-a-freak gets it, they love over the top hyperdrama in Hollywood...yawn...at least Ricky Gervais did what he could to trash it (deliberately I read somewhere)...

[TSMichelleAustin]

She deserved best actress hun, no other girl in that category has a chance. She trained for a long time, got super skinny and did that role. Thats what an actor is to do. Im sorry but she was amazing in that movie! Best I have ever seen her!

[Stavros]

The problem is that when you know something about the subject of a film it always has flaws -for all her training as Tamara Rojo put it her port de bras is wooden and would spoil any real ballet performance -if you go to a first class ballet company and see the difference you won't take Ms Portman seriously as anything other than a fake, which is what all actors and actresses are, as long as you acknowledge it has nothing much to do with ballet -or even Swan Lake for that matter. How many films with a transgendered character were representative of tg reality? Its fiction, and anyway awards have no meaning, you can list a hundred great films and performances that never won an award it doesnt diminish their quality, its just marketing for apes.

[bassman2546]

But is it ballet? UK paper The Guardian asked the experts for their views on the film:



What Britain's ballet stars made of Black Swan

Black Swan stars Natalie Portman as a ballerina hitting the big time. How realistic is the movie? We asked the cream of British ballet to give their verdicts


http://1.2.3.10/bmi/static.guim.co.uk/sys-images/Admin/BkFill/Default_image_group/2011/1/5/1294252408604/black-swan-natalie-portma-007.jpg Ruffling feathers ... Natalie Portman in Black Swan. Black Swan (http://www.guardian.co.uk/film/movie/137726/black-swan), directed by Darren Aronofsky (http://www.guardian.co.uk/film/darren-aronofsky), claims to penetrate to the romantic, obsessional heart of ballet (http://www.guardian.co.uk/stage/ballet). Based loosely on Swan Lake (http://www.guardian.co.uk/stage/2010/jul/14/swan-lake-review), the film follows Nina, its ballerina heroine, as she grapples with learning the dual role of Odette and Odile (the white and black swans in Swan Lake).


Black Swan
Production year: 2010
Country: USA
Runtime: 103 mins
Directors: Darren Aronofsky
Cast: Barbara Hershey, Mila Kunis, Natalie Portman, Vincent Cassel, Winona Ryder
More on this film (http://www.guardian.co.uk/film/movie/137726/black-swan)


Nina, played by Natalie Portman (http://www.guardian.co.uk/theobserver/2011/jan/02/observer-profile-natalie-portman), is bullied by her mother and director, works herself punitively hard and becomes violently paranoid about her rival, Lily. What tips her over the edge is the challenge of dancing the Black Swan (http://www.guardian.co.uk/film/movie/137726/black-swan). As Nina tackles the sexy, malevolent role, she unleashes dark forces within herself that plunge us into full-on cinematic horror (http://www.guardian.co.uk/film/horror).
Prior to the film's US release last month, the dance community had imagined Black Swan to be an update of Powell and Pressburger's ballet classic The Red Shoes (http://www.guardian.co.uk/film/2009/dec/10/the-red-shoes-film-review). As they've since discovered, the film has more in common with Roman Polanski's Rosemary's Baby (http://www.guardian.co.uk/film/2010/oct/22/rosemarys-baby-polanksi-horror): a terrifying portrayal of one woman's descent into madness, set in a world of claustrophobia and pain. Feathers have been ruffled: Robert Gottlieb, the New York Observer's dance critic, found (http://www.observer.com/2010/culture/dancing-dark-ballet-reduced-campy-cliches-black-swan) Aronofsky guilty of "recapitulating all the old ugly misrepresentations of ballet", and of portraying ballet as one great "sadomasochistic trip".
Certainly, from the vomiting of guilty calories to the torments inflicted by her sadistic choreographer (with a foreign accent, of course), Aronofsky runs with every stereotype. And the dance sections are brutal: the deliberately choppy style of filming isn't just alienating; it also robs those moving bodies of their true power and beauty.
Portman has been widely praised: she spent months in training, allowing her to do some reasonable faking with her upper body, arms and head. Her main dance material, though, is performed by body doubles.
But what do real dancers think of Black Swan? In Britain, the film isn't out for another fortnight, so the Guardian invited five of the biggest names in British ballet to an advance screening. Were their screams those of recognition, terror – or sheer hilarity?
Tamara Rojo (http://www.guardian.co.uk/stage/2010/dec/05/tamara-rojo-royal-ballet-interview) Principal dancer with the Royal Ballet (http://www.guardian.co.uk/stage/royal-ballet)
Natalie Portman needs to work on her port de bras (http://www.britannica.com/EBchecked/topic/470854/port-de-bras). I really have a problem with this film using an actress, not a dancer, to play Nina: the director seems to think that, in a few months, you can learn a profession that it takes years just to understand, let alone be good at. And in the film, Nina is supposed to be awesome.
This is a very lazy movie, featuring every ballet cliche going. If you want to look at the dark side of ballet, do it properly, don't just give us shots of a ballerina suddenly vomiting. Nina's mother was beyond the cliche of a ballet mum – she was a psychopath. And the only people who looked like they were having a good time were the ones having sex.
The ballet movies that dancers go back to are the ones that have had great dancers in them, like Mikhail Baryshnikov (http://www.guardian.co.uk/stage/2004/feb/18/dance), Moira Shearer (http://www.guardian.co.uk/news/2006/feb/02/guardianobituaries.filmnews), Roland Petit (http://www.guardian.co.uk/artanddesign/2009/sep/30/photography-willy-rizzo-best-shoot) and Zizi Jeanmaire (http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0419929/). Ballet isn't something you can just add on. The characters are important because they're dancers – and if they aren't very good ones, it doesn't make sense.
Lauren Cuthbertson (http://www.guardian.co.uk/stage/2004/dec/01/theatre3) Principal dancer with the Royal Ballet
I wish I wasn't a dancer looking at this film, so I could see it from another perspective. Portman is an incredible actress, and I can see why she jumped at this role. But, good as she is, it's impossible for her to look like a professional dancer. Maybe they needed her to sell the film, but [co-star] Vincent Cassel is a big name, too. And I'm sure they could have found a dancer of the right calibre to act the part.
Some of Nina's character felt accurate. We're all obsessive in how we approach a new role: it can dominate our thoughts for months. And some of us like to wear pastel colours sometimes. But in the film it's all so extreme. And Nina's such a good little girl; she wears pink all the time, and her hair in a bun, even when she's outside.
The film makes ballet look as though it's all blood, sweat, tears and sacrifice. Of course, that's suitable subject matter for a horror movie, but it doesn't show any of the pleasure.
Edward Watson (http://www.guardian.co.uk/stage/2007/apr/09/dance) Principal dancer with the Royal Ballet
The sad thing is that while this film shows the drive ballet dancers have to become perfect, it makes what we do look so naff and laughable. It doesn't show why ballet is so important to us – why we would want to try so hard.
The best part is the opening sequence, where you see Nina completely involved in her dancing. I didn't think Portman was bad: she had a good neck, face and focus. And the film was accurate about the stress levels in the profession. I've had those kind of dreams where I've missed performances, when I'm hearing the music, but I can't make it on to the stage in time.
But otherwise, it looked like they had taken all the cliches that they had been told about ballet and bundled them into a film. I've seen some choreographers play mindgames with dancers about who they are going to cast, but not with that kind of intensity.
The one cliche they didn't go for so much was the bitching. I thought there would be much more of it. I thought there would be dancers pushing each other down the stairs.
Elena Glurdjidze (http://www.guardian.co.uk/lifeandstyle/2009/may/30/chanel-tutu-glurdjidze-ballet) Principal dancer with English National Ballet
I was quite shocked by this; it wasn't at all what I expected. I thought Portman did quite well for someone who wasn't trained. She didn't look out of place at the barre, and I found it hard to tell when she was dancing and when it was the body double.
But so many scenes were exaggerated. And I didn't recognise anything about the ballet Swan Lake. When I was preparing for my first Odile [the Black Swan], I had a great dancer from the Mariinksy (http://www.mariinsky.ru/en/) telling me that I had to be seductive like a cat, but it was all within the context of the choreography. Yes, you have to use you imagination to get into a role – but not like Nina. I must say, though, I did like the Black Swan eye makeup they gave her. She looked amazing.
Cassa Pancho (http://www.balletblack.co.uk/company.html) Artistic director of Ballet Black
You can tell they did some research. Some of the smaller details, like the broken toenails and the way Nina works on her ballet shoes [scoring the soles, breaking down the blocked toes], were accurate. And I've seen dancers get paranoid, just like Nina, when they miss a rehearsal and find someone else has been standing in for them – although obviously not to the point where they smash the rival dancer in the mirror and drag her into the toilet by the ankles.
I hated the ballet director. He was ridiculously patronising and bullying. That scene when he comes into the class and starts telling the story of Swan Lake, then taps the shoulders of the dancers he doesn't want to use – if I tried that, my company would tackle me to the ground and send me to the hospital.
The most realistic character was Lily, who smokes and has fun. But even with her there are inaccurate details, like when she's rehearsing with her hair all loose. It's another cliche: "Look at me, I'm so relaxed because I don't put my hair into a bun."
Of course, this is a horror movie; it's meant to be extreme. There's been incredible feedback on Twitter, but what most people are saying is: don't worry about the ballet – go for the great lesbian action and the horror.


The so-called 'critics' need to realize that this is a motion picture not a tutorial for ballet. From the perspective of someone who doesn't know jack about ballet, the movie was extremely entertaining and Natalie Portman was amazing and sold her portrayal of a ballerina very well. And I agree with many, she deserves the SAG for this movie (I could care less what the Oscars think).

[NYBURBS]

*wakes up* ... Did you say Natalie Portman masturbation scene? :)

Don't talk about my woman like THAT!!!!!!!! :jerkoff

[ELSAPO]

I just saw it with my gf. It was more of horror/thiller towards the end. If you enjoyed The Wrestler, then you will love Black Swan. Plus the girl on girl scene and masterbation scene are crazy good!!!

[Stavros]

One cliche after another -pushy ballet mom, choreographer as terrorist, the pain of creating a dance routine: no room for Swan Lake really or the fact that most ballerinas and male dancers love what they do and enjoy it most of the time! If the film were called White Swan would it have been made? Take it as Hollywood fantasy but please dont confuse it with ballet; perhaps someone can answer why so many female figures in films are always problematic and disturbed...

[amberskyi]

i tricked a guy into taking me to see it bwaahhaaa,but then it backed fired when the girl started masturbating :( lol.

[bassman2546]

I just saw it with my gf. It was more of horror/thiller towards the end. If you enjoyed The Wrestler, then you will love Black Swan. Plus the girl on girl scene and masterbation scene are crazy good!!!

????
That's like saying if you enjoy Ice Cream, then you will love liver. The two movies are very different from one another.

[bassman2546]

I just saw it with my gf. It was more of horror/thiller towards the end. If you enjoyed The Wrestler, then you will love Black Swan. Plus the girl on girl scene and masterbation scene are crazy good!!!


One cliche after another -pushy ballet mom, choreographer as terrorist, the pain of creating a dance routine: no room for Swan Lake really or the fact that most ballerinas and male dancers love what they do and enjoy it most of the time! If the film were called White Swan would it have been made? Take it as Hollywood fantasy but please dont confuse it with ballet; perhaps someone can answer why so many female figures in films are always problematic and disturbed...

Again, it's not a course in ballet. It's a movie about a mentally ill ballerina, hence the title "The BLACK Swan". And the movie leads you to believe her mother was pushy but she really wasn't. Choreographer as a terrorit? (Wow, GWB really pounded that into the Americans' heads didn't he? Everyone's a terrorist!) As far as why so many females are problematic and disturbed? Well, the protagonist is always problematic otherwise we wouldn't root for him/her. That's part of moulding the character. As far as disturbed? I don't think you can limit it just to women as many men have been the same. Again, character development. The director did a fantastic job at taking these cliches and leaving them open for debate. My wife and I discussed that all the way home from the theatre and marvelled at how what we thought was going to happen, either didn't happen or was left as a subtlety that still left room for doubt. Awesome flick, but not sure it's awesome enough to covet the Oscar. Looks like the King's Speech is this year's hardon for the Academy, unless it's another "The Hurt Locker" year for some picture.