Amanda Knox. Guilty or not guilty?

[JamesHunt]

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/8394750.stm

American student Amanda Knox and her former boyfriend have been found guilty by an Italian court of the murder of British student Meredith Kercher.

Knox, 22, bowed her head and burst into tears as she was jailed for 26 years for murder and sexual violence.

Italian Raffaele Sollecito, 25, looked impassive as he was given 25 years.

[brickcitybrother]

All I can say is that innocent people do not implicate other innocent people. But I've seen alot of guilty people implicate anyone - even ole' mom - to get out of trouble. When she lied and said an innocent man was guilty ... what sympathy could I have. There are INNOCENT people in prison (and not all of them were framed by the police, so were framed by the truly guilty). To bad she won't get what she really deserves as Italian prisons are not as harsh as some.

[praetor]

guilty


Perugia, Italy (CNN) -- Family members of Meredith Kercher said Saturday that they were satisfied with the verdict that found American Amanda Knox and her Italian ex-boyfriend, Raffaele Sollecito, guilty in the fatal knifing of their loved one.

"Ultimately we are pleased with the decision," said Lyle Kercher, Meredith's brother. "But it was not a moment of celebration. We are here because our sister was brutally murdered."

Knox was given a 26-year sentence; Sollecito was sentenced to 25 years Friday for the murder of Kercher. Both will appeal, attorneys said.

Arline Kercher, Meredith's mother, said she believes the two are guilty.

"You have to go with the evidence," she said.
Knox and Sollecito were charged with murder and sexual violence in Kercher's death in November 2007. Knox and Kercher, both studying abroad, were roommates. A third suspect was found guilty in a separate trial.

http://www.cnn.com/2009/CRIME/12/05/italy.kercher.react/index.html

The two were convicted on all charges except theft and together must pay 5 million euros ($7.4 million) to the victim's family. In addition, Knox must pay 40,000 euros ($60,000) to a man whom she falsely accused of the killing.

The jury reached its verdict after deliberating nearly 11 hours on the 11 counts.

Prosecutors had asked for a sentence of life in prison. Italy does not have the death penalty.

Take a look at the evidence against Knox

The Kercher family made statements at a packed news conference in Perugia, their first public comments since the highly publicized convictions.

In a written statement Friday, Knox's parents said they were "extremely disappointed" with the verdict.

"While we always knew this was a possibility, we find it difficult to accept this verdict when we know that she is innocent, and that the prosecution has failed to explain why there is no evidence of Amanda in the room where Meredith was so horribly and tragically murdered," they said.

The victim's sister, Stephanie Kercher, talked about the grief her family experiences.

"Our lives have been on hold really. You can't really carry on as normal. You have to take each day as it comes," she said.

"Luckily, we have had support from a huge number of people -- close friends and family, and people all over the world. We can just hope that strength continues and do the best we can. It's not ever going to be the same without [Meredith]."

CNN's Richard Greene contributed to this report.

http://www.cnn.com/2009/CRIME/12/05/italy.kercher.react/index.html

[praetor]

Added On December 5, 2009
Sitting in for CNN's Larry King, Jim Moray talks with Janet Huff, Amanda Knox's aunt about the guilty verdict.

http://www.cnn.com/video/#/video/bestoftv/2009/12/05/lkl.knox.aunt.cnn

[Lobo]

I don't know much about this case but they were talking about it on cnn's headline news last night and the reporter they had covering it in Italy said that one of things that sunk her was admitting she was in the house when the murder happened (she heard the struggle and screams) and then changing her story and saying she wasn't there when it happened. That was the beginning of the end for her.

[arnie666]

You know there is a lesson to be learnt here. When in Rome do as the romans do. When you go to a foreign country you have to accept their laws and justice system as well as the cultural nature of that country.Too often people from the UK and the US have been caught short concerning this.

A combination of drug fueled sex orgies,knives contacts with druggies from the Ivory coast, and being in a rather moralist traditional country and certainly a small town mentality part of that country is a recipe for disaster. Knox thought she could live her life in the same way she did in the states.Whether she is guilty or not ,she is guilty of arrogance and stupidity.

That town in Italy probably had never seen a girl like Knox, no doubt sexed up even more by the media. The Police no doubt did judge her for her lifestyle. Finding condoms and a sextoy ,being a woman will not endear you to female Italian Police officers. Couple that with her framing an innocent man and changing her stories several times,and grinning in court as well as her family taking smiling holiday photos at the murder scene leaving aside the suspect DNA I think it didn't bode well for her.

Not sure of her guilt but she is fucking stupid. And people should remember the real victim in this,not some dumb Yank slut but a British girl called meridith who was sexually assaulted and had her throat cut.

[MDM23]

Well said mate.

[2009AD]

You know there is a lesson to be learnt here. When in Rome do as the romans do. When you go to a foreign country you have to accept their laws and justice system as well as the cultural nature of that country.Too often people from the UK and the US have been caught short concerning this.

A combination of drug fueled sex orgies,knives contacts with druggies from the Ivory coast, and being in a rather moralist traditional country and certainly a small town mentality part of that country is a recipe for disaster. Knox thought she could live her life in the same way she did in the states.Whether she is guilty or not ,she is guilty of arrogance and stupidity.

That town in Italy probably had never seen a girl like Knox, no doubt sexed up even more by the media. The Police no doubt did judge her for her lifestyle. Finding condoms and a sextoy ,being a woman will not endear you to female Italian Police officers. Couple that with her framing an innocent man and changing her stories several times,and grinning in court as well as her family taking smiling holiday photos at the murder scene leaving aside the suspect DNA I think it didn't bode well for her.

Not sure of her guilt but she is fucking stupid. And people should remember the real victim in this,not some dumb Yank slut but a British girl called meridith who was sexually assaulted and had her throat cut.

What the fuck are you babbling about? How's this for an idea: When in Rome, or wherever, DON'T MURDER. Knox could have done all the fucking, sucking and drugs she wanted to, it's when she took part in a murder that she crossed the line. :roll:

[Belial]

I don't know anything about the case, but she only got 26 years?
I'll bet she'll get out early on parole, too.
U Europeans are very limp-wristed about punishing murder.
I'm glad I don't live there.
:smh

[arnie666]

You know there is a lesson to be learnt here. When in Rome do as the romans do. When you go to a foreign country you have to accept their laws and justice system as well as the cultural nature of that country.Too often people from the UK and the US have been caught short concerning this.

A combination of drug fueled sex orgies,knives contacts with druggies from the Ivory coast, and being in a rather moralist traditional country and certainly a small town mentality part of that country is a recipe for disaster. Knox thought she could live her life in the same way she did in the states.Whether she is guilty or not ,she is guilty of arrogance and stupidity.

That town in Italy probably had never seen a girl like Knox, no doubt sexed up even more by the media. The Police no doubt did judge her for her lifestyle. Finding condoms and a sextoy ,being a woman will not endear you to female Italian Police officers. Couple that with her framing an innocent man and changing her stories several times,and grinning in court as well as her family taking smiling holiday photos at the murder scene leaving aside the suspect DNA I think it didn't bode well for her.

Not sure of her guilt but she is fucking stupid. And people should remember the real victim in this,not some dumb Yank slut but a British girl called meridith who was sexually assaulted and had her throat cut.

What the fuck are you babbling about? How's this for an idea: When in Rome, or wherever, DON'T MURDER. Knox could have done all the fucking, sucking and drugs she wanted to, it's when she took part in a murder that she crossed the line. :roll:

Oh yes, another individual with his arsehole where his mouth should be. :D

You really don't get it do you ,you dumb fuck. She tried to carry on her American existance in a foreign country ,which had a totally different legal system . If you want to do drugs, take part in sex romps with dodgy drug supplying african gentlemen . fuck about with knives while under the influence, writing silly rape fantasies on the net , don't come crying when it all goes pete tong, moaning about how 'inferior' Italian justice is compared to the good ol US.Remember OJ?


She's a fucking idiot, and you have just outed yourself as one too.

[2009AD]

You know there is a lesson to be learnt here. When in Rome do as the romans do. When you go to a foreign country you have to accept their laws and justice system as well as the cultural nature of that country.Too often people from the UK and the US have been caught short concerning this.

A combination of drug fueled sex orgies,knives contacts with druggies from the Ivory coast, and being in a rather moralist traditional country and certainly a small town mentality part of that country is a recipe for disaster. Knox thought she could live her life in the same way she did in the states.Whether she is guilty or not ,she is guilty of arrogance and stupidity.

That town in Italy probably had never seen a girl like Knox, no doubt sexed up even more by the media. The Police no doubt did judge her for her lifestyle. Finding condoms and a sextoy ,being a woman will not endear you to female Italian Police officers. Couple that with her framing an innocent man and changing her stories several times,and grinning in court as well as her family taking smiling holiday photos at the murder scene leaving aside the suspect DNA I think it didn't bode well for her.

Not sure of her guilt but she is fucking stupid. And people should remember the real victim in this,not some dumb Yank slut but a British girl called meridith who was sexually assaulted and had her throat cut.

What the fuck are you babbling about? How's this for an idea: When in Rome, or wherever, DON'T MURDER. Knox could have done all the fucking, sucking and drugs she wanted to, it's when she took part in a murder that she crossed the line. :roll:

Oh yes, another individual with his arsehole where his mouth should be. :D

You really don't get it do you ,you dumb fuck. She tried to carry on her American existance in a foreign country ,which had a totally different legal system . If you want to do drugs, take part in sex romps with dodgy drug supplying african gentlemen . fuck about with knives while under the influence, writing silly rape fantasies on the net , don't come crying when it all goes pete tong, moaning about how 'inferior' Italian justice is compared to the good ol US.Remember OJ?

She's a fucking idiot, and you have just outed yourself as one too.

Thanks for the laugh you clown.

" She tried to carry on her American existance in a foreign country ,which had a totally different legal system.

What part of her "American existence" or any normal American person's existence includes MURDER? Hey shit for brains, the drugs did not get her in trouble, the sex did not get her in trouble, MURDERING her roommate got her in trouble.

[Coroner]

She took part in a quite sadistic murder and is guilty.

[Thatiger23]

the girl was found guilty yet theres no physical evidence to proove it as well as the dna did NOT match...this just shows how corrupt the judicial system is SMDH.......

[waldo pepper]

the girl was found guilty yet theres no physical evidence to proove it as well as the dna did NOT match...this just shows how corrupt the judicial system is SMDH.......

Finally somebody who actually followed the case speaks up. To the rest of you so anxious to convict her, yes she's a fucking idiot and naive as fuck. But the prosecution concocted this bizarre sex fantasy story without any proof of her involvement. The British press, who of course is always known for its probity, picked up the theme and ran with it. All without anything to place her in the room where the murder occurred. The prosecutor also entered this case coming off a list of high profile cases with failures to convict so his motivation was very suspect and he was desperate for a professional success.

Personally I think she's a proxy for the justified hatred towards the US the Bushies engendered. This crime was committed during Bush's time. She was nearby and demonstrated that she was a clueless American. For this she got to be the poster girl for American excess in a world fed up with it. The world outside the US and a large chunk of Americans hated Bush/Cheney policies but especially in Italy there is a frustration with the arrogrance. USAF hijinx of flying low under ski lifts in the Italian Alps killed two citizens and the pilots were not punished. A month or so ago Italy convicted 26 CIA op's in absentia for their roles in snatching suspected terrorists on Italian soil without Italian consent. I'm sure there are more instances, too.

Justice should be about the case. Whether or not someone is a fucking idiot or the leader of their country is a douche nozzle is beside the point. She will be freed on appeal when more rational heads review the case.

[arnie666]

the girl was found guilty yet theres no physical evidence to proove it as well as the dna did NOT match...this just shows how corrupt the judicial system is SMDH.......

Finally somebody who actually followed the case speaks up. To the rest of you so anxious to convict her, yes she's a fucking idiot and naive as fuck. But the prosecution concocted this bizarre sex fantasy story without any proof of her involvement. The British press, who of course is always known for its probity, picked up the theme and ran with it. All without anything to place her in the room where the murder occurred. The prosecutor also entered this case coming off a list of high profile cases with failures to convict so his motivation was very suspect and he was desperate for a professional success.

Personally I think she's a proxy for the justified hatred towards the US the Bushies engendered. This crime was committed during Bush's time. She was nearby and demonstrated that she was a clueless American. For this she got to be the poster girl for American excess in a world fed up with it. The world outside the US and a large chunk of Americans hated Bush/Cheney policies but especially in Italy there is a frustration with the arrogrance. USAF hijinx of flying low under ski lifts in the Italian Alps killed two citizens and the pilots were not punished. A month or so ago Italy convicted 26 CIA op's in absentia for their roles in snatching suspected terrorists on Italian soil without Italian consent. I'm sure there are more instances, too.

Justice should be about the case. Whether or not someone is a fucking idiot or the leader of their country is a douche nozzle is beside the point. She will be freed on appeal when more rational heads review the case.

What you mean is, someone who followed the case on CNN speaks up. Which is of course the model of impartiality and isn't turning Amanda Knox as the main player in Midnight Express 2 (the Italian nightmare) .

Aw everything hates americans, which of course makes a white all american girl innocent. Obviously Italy isn't Alabama, where you can pin it on some 'nigger' and send him to be juiced up. Knox tried her best though... twice.CNN was even referring to the Black who was sent down along with knox as 'African American' ... excellent reporting that.

Italy isn't Somalia. It is a member of the European Union and a signitory of the European court of human rights.

I doubt she will be freed on appeal but she won't do anything like 26 yrs. Unless of course, jack ryan and the Navy Seals are sent in, which seems to be the level of intelligence most Yanks are expressing at the moment over this. Her family were posing outside the house where the murder took place in hot pants for fucks sake. What a bunch of muppets.

And a correction on the British press, the British tabloid press ran with the sex theme, but to be honest the rest of the British press have been far more even handed, than either you lot (free the knox one) or the Italian press (burn the dirty satanic whore)

I can't be arsed to get into legal arguments at this time of night, and I do question the extent of knox's involvement.But two things kind of leap out at me.Innocent people, don't tend to change their stories several times, they tend to say the same one time after time under intense Police questioning, and innocent people don't pin it on another person who turns out to be completely uninvolved. People who do those things tend to have something to hide.

[Nowhere]

the girl was found guilty yet theres no physical evidence to proove it as well as the dna did NOT match...this just shows how corrupt the judicial system is SMDH.......

I've followed it strongly. Yes, that's the case. I don't think it's necessarily anti-americanism as it is their faux "innocent before being proven guilty." I love Italy, but essentially Amanda was having a good ol' time sexing it up in Italy while smoking a little pot here and there and the Judge did NOT like that. So, they made this trumped up "sex game gone wrong" fantasy with zero evidence that it happened. Even the manga comics they referred to were about vampires which don't just slit people's throats. So, then when it was so obviously ridiculous, they went along the argument akin to "... uh, uh, uh.... she harbored hatred to her straight-laced roommate and it went to a boiling point" mid-stream, showing they were doing whatever they could to peg it in on her. They wouldn't even let her bring in proper witnesses to show that the DNA had been poorly harvested and thereby contaminated, which shows that it wasn't about the facts. It was about a preconceived notion by the judge (and community, as well) lynching the naive girl and her boyfriend.

I don't think America has even their court system as good as it should but this thing wouldn't even be brought TO court here, given the lack of evidence. And, that lack of evidence didn't change through the trial. Guilty or not (and I don't see anything even closely supporting such an argument that she did it, btw), there is NOT remotely enough evidence to convict her. It's a travesty and I feel sorry for her as well as the murdered lady. I do hope one day they find the actual murderer and clear this all up, but given how arrogant the judge is, it would be a shock he'd apologize, even after she'd spend her entire adulthood in jail...

[Azanti]

Sorry Waldo, and others, but I do not agree at all.

Some of the evidence was flimsy yes, which seems to be the basis of a great many people screaming out in here defence.

I don't look into anything half heartedly. I have been following this case very carefully and without prejeduice, attaining information from as many solid sources as possible, channel 4 also made an excellent documentary on this case which expressed also the doubts that you have about some of the evidence, and I always totally ignored all this Foxy Knoxy bollox and just concentrated on the facts and her statements.
I think the girl is guilty and just dismissing what she did in terms of trying initially to frame a totally innocent man for the crime as some have stated here was utterly disgusting, at the end of the day, if he had not have had a solid albi for his wareabouts, he would have been in deep shit. She also lied about her location and story, not once but three times, and subsequently only after learning of her appearance on cctv which blew her alibi. I don't think anyone intended to kill anyone that night, but I also do not think Guede acted alone. Sorry dude, we have to disagree on this one.
The fact is that killers are not always people from broken homes but they can come from very decent backgrounds, just as not all junkies are from underprivledged families, quite the opposite in fact. The media over here was pretty decent until the verdict (A couple of tabloids aside) and did not reach the normal levels of hysteria associated with the British press until after the verdict, in fact on the contary, some of them were critical of the Italian Justice system. I hope Merediths family get some peace of mind from the verdict, they are the ones living the biggest sentance of all.

I think you also need to consider that Knox's own eventual albi, that she was with her boyfriend, in his apartment at the time of the murder and that she never left it that night has been proven to be false beyond any reasonable certainty, she is seen leaving it with him and returning at times which fit with the murder and not her story, so it is actually impossible for her to have been there (At her boyfriends flat) when she claims to have been.
The facts that I have refererred to didn't come from snitches, but much of it is from Knox's own defence team. First of all she wasn't there at the scene, then she was there, but had too much weed and couldn't remember what happened because she was confused and stoned (Really?, Come on man, get real) then the bar owner was there and had a fight with Meredith, then he wasn't there, then Geude was there instead, but they weren't - but we know they were, not just from the dna but from CCTV, we also know they weren't where they said they were. Also you forget that people from the Sollecito family, among others, put the Police onto Geude, how would they know he was even there, if they weren't themselves?
Sorry, but I just don't believe it. And if she was so innocent, why didn't they, her own defence team, put Geude on the stand?? They could have done so, under law, after all, he was already convicted. I agree that there is much other evidence which is flimsy, but there are several things which are certain and one of those things is that Knox constantly lied and every story she has changed to, has been proven also to be a lie. I firmly believe she was complicite in the death of Meredith. Sorry man, don't hate me for it.

I am sure the USA media has gone into mass hysteria over this, but I have stuck to the facts, there is some ambiguity over much of the evidence, but Knox was her own worst enemy. She can't keep claiming she was scared everytime she changed her story and chaging it again when she realised the facts didnt fit.

Also I'm not defending the Italian Justice System, I also believe there is probably an equal amount of pressure for the Italians to have given a verdict oppositte to the one that came about, and you would have had an equally big outcry over there if the result had been reversed and I wonder how many people here would then be thinking, they got away with it. I don't think we will ever truly know what went on that night, but I am convinced that Knox and her boyfriend were part of it. She would not have been the first person her age, from her background to have killed someone, and she will not be the last. Her family saw fit to hire their own PR company to protest her innocence, so the mainstream media have not been the only ones to manipulate the images here.

If it has been trial by television, then everyone has had a hand in it, everyone that is, except Merediths family, who have been more dignified about it, than I would have been.

[daltx_m]

you left out the "who gives a fuck" option.

[JamesHunt]

Personally I think she's a proxy for the justified hatred towards the US the Bushies engendered. This crime was committed during Bush's time. She was nearby and demonstrated that she was a clueless American. For this she got to be the poster girl for American excess in a world fed up with it. The world outside the US and a large chunk of Americans hated Bush/Cheney policies but especially in Italy there is a frustration with the arrogrance. USAF hijinx of flying low under ski lifts in the Italian Alps killed two citizens and the pilots were not punished. A month or so ago Italy convicted 26 CIA op's in absentia for their roles in snatching suspected terrorists on Italian soil without Italian consent. I'm sure there are more instances, too.


Get fucking real

Do you honestly believe that the jury quietly said amongst themslelves, 'hey, she's innocent, but because George Bush is a prick and some US pilots killed some Italian citizens on a ski slope, and got away with it, we're gonna charge her guilty'

Your comments are an insult to Italy :evil:

[JamesHunt]

you left out the "who gives a fuck" option.

Have you ever met Glen Campbell. I love this song

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4qoymGCDYzU

[Azanti]

Well if you don't give a fuck, then the option is not to read or contribute to the topic in the first place.

[phobun]

All I can say is that innocent people do not implicate other innocent people. ... There are INNOCENT people in prison (and not all of them were framed by the police, so were framed by the truly guilty).
Bears repeating

[sugdaddie69]

All I can say is that innocent people do not implicate other innocent people. ... There are INNOCENT people in prison (and not all of them were framed by the police, so were framed by the truly guilty).
Bears repeating

that says alot..along with the i was/wasn't there.Even IF she didn't do it she deserves 26yrs.for lying and implicating someone who was really innocent.....fuck her.she'll b able to munch on some good iltalian pussy for the next few years.

[chefmike]

Personally I think she's a proxy for the justified hatred towards the US the Bushies engendered. This crime was committed during Bush's time. She was nearby and demonstrated that she was a clueless American. For this she got to be the poster girl for American excess in a world fed up with it. The world outside the US and a large chunk of Americans hated Bush/Cheney policies but especially in Italy there is a frustration with the arrogrance. USAF hijinx of flying low under ski lifts in the Italian Alps killed two citizens and the pilots were not punished. A month or so ago Italy convicted 26 CIA op's in absentia for their roles in snatching suspected terrorists on Italian soil without Italian consent. I'm sure there are more instances, too.


Get fucking real

Do you honestly believe that the jury quietly said amongst themslelves, 'hey, she's innocent, but because George Bush is a prick and some US pilots killed some Italian citizens on a ski slope, and got away with it, we're gonna charge her guilty'

Your comments are an insult to Italy :evil:

Fuck those greasy spaghetti-benders and fuck you too, Jimmy Cunt.

Amanda is guilty of nothing more than being young, naive, sexy, and American.

[2009AD]

Fuck those greasy spaghetti-benders

Wow Chef. Where did that come from? I thought you were a progressive dude.

[chefmike]

Fuck those greasy spaghetti-benders

Wow Chef. Where did that come from? I thought you were a progressive dude.

Don't take this the wrong way sport, but if you equate being progressive with being politically correct then I most certainly am not....and I'm sorely tempted to add that you can kiss my cracker ass while you're at it.
But I won't.

Fuck those backwards-ass dago fucks.

You wanna talk political correctness and progressives? The Italians that I've worked with and known are some of the most narrow-minded, judgmental and religiously superstitious mama's boys you ever wanna run across and I never trusted any of 'em as far as I could throw 'em...and don't get me started on the chickenshit frogs...who share an affinity with the cowardly Itialians for walking into battle with their hands over their heads...at least we can count on the limeys to fight....

[SpoogeMonkey]

.at least we can count on the limeys to fight....

Yeah. The french and the Italians, very silly nations. Although they do have some nice ladies.. and good food. Aside from the great buildings, art, cheese, the odd decent film, ladies, football, girls, women, boobies, sexy language, theres very little to get excited about really.

http://msp293.photobucket.com/albums/mm53/livolay/eva_green.jpg

I think Knox is innocent because the Italian legal system is pretty shonky. A bit like the British legal system, people want a conviction, so they will stick the first unlikely looking tart in jail. I bet they get out on appeal.

[Bobzz]

I object to the form of the question. It's compound and misleading, if not completely nonsensical. Yes or no, isn't the correct answer to "Guilty or Not Guilty" ...well, it's not the one that makes any sense, anyway.
Are you Hungry or Not Hungry? Yes (presupposes one or the other, or both).

FYI, I don't think she's guilty but then again, I was hoping that OJ wasn't the killer either

[uktlover]

Guilty as sin and for those of you who voted No, you must be stupid

[JamesHunt]

Personally I think she's a proxy for the justified hatred towards the US the Bushies engendered. This crime was committed during Bush's time. She was nearby and demonstrated that she was a clueless American. For this she got to be the poster girl for American excess in a world fed up with it. The world outside the US and a large chunk of Americans hated Bush/Cheney policies but especially in Italy there is a frustration with the arrogrance. USAF hijinx of flying low under ski lifts in the Italian Alps killed two citizens and the pilots were not punished. A month or so ago Italy convicted 26 CIA op's in absentia for their roles in snatching suspected terrorists on Italian soil without Italian consent. I'm sure there are more instances, too.


Get fucking real

Do you honestly believe that the jury quietly said amongst themslelves, 'hey, she's innocent, but because George Bush is a prick and some US pilots killed some Italian citizens on a ski slope, and got away with it, we're gonna charge her guilty'

Your comments are an insult to Italy :evil:

Fuck those greasy spaghetti-benders and fuck you too, Jimmy Cunt.

Amanda is guilty of nothing more than being young, naive, sexy, and American.

STFU! If it wasn't for the Italians & pizza, you'd be out of work 'cooking in some dive joint', now get back to your kitchen