Elvis vs Jacko

[JamesHunt]

who was the best?

Even though Elvis ended up a 42 yo overweight burger guzzling druggie, I still think he blows whacko Jacko off the planet. What say you lot???

[Quiet Reflections]

I say MJ since Elvis was a racist song thief but what does one base the comparison on. MJ has better sales, a bigger following and sung different music to a different generation.

[JohnnyWalkerBlackLabel]

I think you're out of your mind comparing Elvis to the King.........

think back to those Elvis movies, you'll find your answer

[2009AD]

I say MJ since Elvis was a racist song thief but what does one base the comparison on. MJ has better sales, a bigger following and sung different music to a different generation.

Q.R.

Elvis was not a racist...

http://www.snopes.com/music/artists/presley1.asp

http://www.nytimes.com/2007/08/11/opinion/11guralnick.html?_r=2&pagewanted=1&adxnnl=1&adxnnlx=1186837499-zwG24JJ7lPZObW+gceDVVA

For a racist he sure did hang around a lot of black blues, jazz, rock and gospel singers

Elvis and Fats Domino

http://www.fatsonline.nl/fats_elvis.jpg

Sammy Davis Jr.

http://www.morethings.com/music/elvis/pictures/sammy-davis-jr-elvis-presley.jpeg

B.B. King
http://www.elvisinfonet.com/image-files/BBKing-ClaudiaIvy.jpeg

Ali
http://www.boxing-memorabilia.com/images/alielvisP.jpg

I should remember the name of this buy, but right now it escapes me. he was a blues musician

http://blogs.ubc.ca/ross/files/2009/02/elvis3.jpg

Mahalia Jackson
http://elviswomen.greggers.net/images/bmepmj1.jpg

[2009AD]

double post

[fred41]

Apples and Oranges...two totally different types of performers belonging to different generations.

...but my preference would be Elvis. Michael Jackson might have him in the overall multiple talent dept....but come on..Elvis was a guy...with a guy's voice. Guys wanted to be Elvis. Seriously..how many normal guys wanted to be Michael Jackson?

[Star Angel 86]

Elvis Presley. 8)

[Ecstatic]

I say MJ since Elvis was a racist song thief but what does one base the comparison on. MJ has better sales, a bigger following and sung different music to a different generation.

Better sales? Of a single album, Thriller, yes: that album is the all-time best-selling album. But Elvis and the Beatles are all-time rivals for selling the most records, with over 1 billion sales each. Michael comes in third, at 750 million, and will likely pick up another 20 million or more following his death, but he remains behind the other two. Bing Crosby ranks 4th with over 500 million sales.

As for who was the better singer: Elvis. The better actor: Elvis. The better dancer: Michael. Who had the greater social impact? Probably a tie there. So it all depends on what you're comparing.

[alpha2117]

Elvis didn't have the broad talent base of Jackson so I think Jackson edges Presley.

[Quiet Reflections]

I say MJ since Elvis was a racist song thief but what does one base the comparison on. MJ has better sales, a bigger following and sung different music to a different generation.

Q.R.

Elvis was not a racist...

http://www.snopes.com/music/artists/presley1.asp

http://www.nytimes.com/2007/08/11/opinion/11guralnick.html?_r=2&pagewanted=1&adxnnl=1&adxnnlx=1186837499-zwG24JJ7lPZObW+gceDVVA

For a racist he sure did hang around a lot of black blues, jazz, rock and gospel singers

Elvis and Fats Domino

http://www.fatsonline.nl/fats_elvis.jpg

Sammy Davis Jr.

http://www.morethings.com/music/elvis/pictures/sammy-davis-jr-elvis-presley.jpeg

B.B. King
http://www.elvisinfonet.com/image-files/BBKing-ClaudiaIvy.jpeg

Ali
http://www.boxing-memorabilia.com/images/alielvisP.jpg

I should remember the name of this buy, but right now it escapes me. he was a blues musician

http://blogs.ubc.ca/ross/files/2009/02/elvis3.jpg

Mahalia Jackson
http://elviswomen.greggers.net/images/bmepmj1.jpg
Publicity photos don't mean shit we all know that. And 1 comment researched by snopes means not a lot either. Its funny people live and die by their public image and nobody ever considers what the people were like behind closed doors. I didn't know Elvis but growing up in the south i got to meet a lot of people with a lot of stories and i tend to believe those old guys rather than the publics stories we are told of this supposedly great man

[fred41]

Publicity photos don't mean shit we all know that. And 1 comment researched by snopes means not a lot either. Its funny people live and die by their public image and nobody ever considers what the people were like behind closed doors.

You're right - publicity photos don't necessarily mean shit...but if you're going to label the man a racist, then you should probably state what facts you base that on.

[Quiet Reflections]

I say MJ since Elvis was a racist song thief but what does one base the comparison on. MJ has better sales, a bigger following and sung different music to a different generation.

Better sales? Of a single album, Thriller, yes: that album is the all-time best-selling album. But Elvis and the Beatles are all-time rivals for selling the most records, with over 1 billion sales each. Michael comes in third, at 750 million, and will likely pick up another 20 million or more following his death, but he remains behind the other two. Bing Crosby ranks 4th with over 500 million sales.

As for who was the better singer: Elvis. The better actor: Elvis. The better dancer: Michael. Who had the greater social impact? Probably a tie there. So it all depends on what you're comparing.
All time sure but Elvis was out longer and given the same amount of time i think MJ will easily take that over especially now with his death(he will pick up way more than 20 million in sales). And Fuck Bing Crosby except in White Christmas and Danny Kaye was still better than him.

[Quiet Reflections]

Publicity photos don't mean shit we all know that. And 1 comment researched by snopes means not a lot either. Its funny people live and die by their public image and nobody ever considers what the people were like behind closed doors.

You're right - publicity photos don't necessarily mean shit...but if you're going to label the man a racist, then you should probably state what facts you base that on.
It not my label to give i just agree with it. He already had it before i was born

[2009AD]

You made a statement "Elvis was a racist" and what evidence did you provide to prove it? Nothing, nada, zip.

I provide a number of items. Don't like the pics? fine, Don't believe Snopes? Fine. Do you know who Peter Guralnick is? He's one of the most respected historians of modern American music. You might want to read his article (link below Snopes link.) Instead of simply asserting that "Elvis was a racist," please provide documentation: Quotes, news articles, whatever, to back up your claim. Recount one of the stories you heard about Elvis.




I say MJ since Elvis was a racist song thief but what does one base the comparison on. MJ has better sales, a bigger following and sung different music to a different generation.

Q.R.

Elvis was not a racist...

http://www.snopes.com/music/artists/presley1.asp

http://www.nytimes.com/2007/08/11/opinion/11guralnick.html?_r=2&pagewanted=1&adxnnl=1&adxnnlx=1186837499-zwG24JJ7lPZObW+gceDVV



Publicity photos don't mean shit we all know that. And 1 comment researched by snopes means not a lot either. Its funny people live and die by their public image and nobody ever considers what the people were like behind closed doors. I didn't know Elvis but growing up in the south i got to meet a lot of people with a lot of stories and i tend to believe those old guys rather than the publics stories we are told of this supposedly great man





Publicity photos don't mean shit we all know that. And 1 comment researched by snopes means not a lot either. Its funny people live and die by their public image and nobody ever considers what the people were like behind closed doors.

You're right - publicity photos don't necessarily mean shit...but if you're going to label the man a racist, then you should probably state what facts you base that on.

It not my label to give i just agree with it. He already had it before i was born

Not your "label to give," you just agree with it? Uh? That makes no sense. Neither does your statement "He already had it before I was born." Had what? So far, you're really failing at proving your point.

[timxxx]

"Elvis was a hero to most
But he never meant shit to me you see
Straight up racist that sucker was
Simple and plain
Mother fuck him and John Wayne"

Public Enemy - Fight The Power

If Chuck D says it's true then it must be true.
Chuck D's word is gospel :wink:

[2009AD]

"Elvis was a hero to most
But he never meant shit to me you see
Straight up racist that sucker was
Simple and plain
Mother fuck him and John Wayne"

Public Enemy - Fight The Power

If Chuck D says it's true then it must be true.
Chuck D's word is gospel :wink:

Repeat after me, "I will not learn history from music lyrics." :wink:

http://www.nytimes.com/2007/08/11/opinion/11guralnick.html?pagewanted=2&_r=1

"So why didn’t the rumor die? Why did it continue to find common acceptance up to, and past, the point that Chuck D of Public Enemy could declare in 1990, “Elvis was a hero to most... straight-up racist that sucker was, simple and plain”?

"Chuck D has long since repudiated that view for a more nuanced one of cultural history, but the reason for the rumor’s durability, the unassailable logic behind its common acceptance within the black community rests quite simply on the social inequities that have persisted to this day, the fact that we live in a society that is no more perfectly democratic today than it was 50 years ago. As Chuck D perceptively observes, what does it mean, within this context, for Elvis to be hailed as “king,” if Elvis’s enthronement obscures the striving, the aspirations and achievements of so many others who provided him with inspiration?"
:wink:

[Quiet Reflections]

You made a statement "Elvis was a racist" and what evidence did you provide to prove it? Nothing, nada, zip.

I provide a number of items. Don't like the pics? fine, Don't believe Snopes? Fine. Do you know who Peter Guralnick is? He's one of the most respected historians of modern American music. You might want to read his article (link below Snopes link.) Instead of simply asserting that "Elvis was a racist," please provide documentation: Quotes, news articles, whatever, to back up your claim. Recount one of the stories you heard about Elvis.




I say MJ since Elvis was a racist song thief but what does one base the comparison on. MJ has better sales, a bigger following and sung different music to a different generation.

Q.R.

Elvis was not a racist...

http://www.snopes.com/music/artists/presley1.asp

http://www.nytimes.com/2007/08/11/opinion/11guralnick.html?_r=2&pagewanted=1&adxnnl=1&adxnnlx=1186837499-zwG24JJ7lPZObW+gceDVV



Publicity photos don't mean shit we all know that. And 1 comment researched by snopes means not a lot either. Its funny people live and die by their public image and nobody ever considers what the people were like behind closed doors. I didn't know Elvis but growing up in the south i got to meet a lot of people with a lot of stories and i tend to believe those old guys rather than the publics stories we are told of this supposedly great man





Publicity photos don't mean shit we all know that. And 1 comment researched by snopes means not a lot either. Its funny people live and die by their public image and nobody ever considers what the people were like behind closed doors.

You're right - publicity photos don't necessarily mean shit...but if you're going to label the man a racist, then you should probably state what facts you base that on.

It not my label to give i just agree with it. He already had it before i was born

Not your "label to give," you just agree with it? Uh? That makes no sense. Neither does your statement "He already had it before I was born." Had what? So far, you're really failing at proving your point. Fred41 said I labeled him Racist but he already had the label of being a racist before i was born(true or not he had it) is what i meant and I'm not trying to prove a point. Its my choice to believe it and has become my opinion also. When i was younger i got to meet a lot of my grandpa friends that had stories to tell. Like i said i tend to believe them over the public image of him that the world likes to write about. There were a lot of racists from the south at that time if you want to believe that he wasn't one of them go for it but I don't and I'm not trying to get anyone else to think so either. Form your own opinion as i did. I just didn't read an article or look at pictures. hey call me crazy but I think the elderly are one of the greatest sources of firsthand knowledge. Nobody ever wants to bad mouth the dead but we all know not everybody famous was nice while they were alive.
Timxxx I do like that song but John Wayne was awesome

[Ryz]

No I'm not the first king of controversy
I am the worst thing since Elvis Presley
to do black music so selfishly
and used it to get myself wealthy

[Quiet Reflections]

DP

[2009AD]

Fred41 said I labeled him Racist but he already had the label of being a racist before i was born(true or not he had it) is what i meant and I'm not trying to prove a point. Its my choice to believe it and has become my opinion also. When i was younger i got to meet a lot of my grandpa friends that had stories to tell. Like i said i tend to believe them over the public image of him that the world likes to write about. There were a lot of racists from the south at that time if you want to believe that he wasn't one of them go for it but I don't and I'm not trying to get anyone else to think so either. Form your own opinion as i did. I just didn't read an article or look at pictures. hey call me crazy but I think the elderly are one of the greatest sources of firsthand knowledge. Nobody ever wants to bad mouth the dead but we all know not everybody famous was nice while they were alive.
Timxxx I do like that song but John Wayne was awesome

OK, so it is your opinion that Elvis was a racist. You are entitled to your opinion.

The stories you heard about Presley's racism, did you heard them from people who knew and interacted with him? First hand accounts?

[2009AD]

No I'm not the first king of controversy
I am the worst thing since Elvis Presley
to do black music so selfishly
and used it to get myself wealthy

Off the top of my head....

Rolling Stones, Jerry Lee lewis, Bill Hailey, Buddy Holly, the Beatles, Rod Stewart, Fleetwood Mac, Creedence Clearwater Revival, Van Morrison, Janis Joplin, Cream.

[SugaSweet]

How can anyone,especially the record labels known how many actual records or CD's anyone sold?US Copyright laws are not recognized in China and millions of burnt CD's and DVD's are sold in China and then distributed throught Asia and elsewhere.Capitol Records sent information to the Guiness Book of World records in 1994 documenting the Beatles sales as being 40,000,000 more than were credited for.It must have been true as the three living members of the group and John Lennon's estate sued for the 40 million in royalties they had been shorted and Capital paid it,no argement,no courts.You can not say that one group or artists is "the best".Music is not a sport.

[Quiet Reflections]

Fred41 said I labeled him Racist but he already had the label of being a racist before i was born(true or not he had it) is what i meant and I'm not trying to prove a point. Its my choice to believe it and has become my opinion also. When i was younger i got to meet a lot of my grandpa friends that had stories to tell. Like i said i tend to believe them over the public image of him that the world likes to write about. There were a lot of racists from the south at that time if you want to believe that he wasn't one of them go for it but I don't and I'm not trying to get anyone else to think so either. Form your own opinion as i did. I just didn't read an article or look at pictures. hey call me crazy but I think the elderly are one of the greatest sources of firsthand knowledge. Nobody ever wants to bad mouth the dead but we all know not everybody famous was nice while they were alive.
Timxxx I do like that song but John Wayne was awesome

OK, so it is your opinion that Elvis was a racist. You are entitled to your opinion.

The stories you heard about Presley's racism, did you heard them from people who knew and interacted with him? First hand accounts?
Of course they said they were. I believe the stories but who knows they could be untrue but so could any story about anybody. I don't know your age or history but I'm sure you have been around long enough to know that when people say something enough it becomes real. So everyone says he isn't racist it becomes true had everyone said he was then that would be the believed history and that is regardless of weather either story is true or not. Media creates the truth and the opposing view is always crazy no matter what it is. These guys i met were old salt of the earth southern black guys that worked with their hands all their lives and still said sir to people they didn't know even if they were younger than them. If one of these guys said he was treated poorly while working on a huge southern compound, or making a delivery,or filling up a Cadillac with gas and getting disrespected i trusted it. It not like they said he burned crosses or kicked their asses. Its the subtle underhanded racism that hurts and is remembered the most sometimes. I find these days when you say racism people tend to forget that its more than just physical and violent.

[eclipsemint]

I think it is meaningless to compare champions of different eras. Elvis, Jackson, they were both legends in their time.

Was Elvis really racist? Remember, he was a product of his culture - Mississippi born in 1935 and died 1977; legalised racial segregation in the US lasted right up to the 1960's and I'm sure Elvis was no more racist that the average white american, and that his views progressed as society changed during his lifetime.

[Cyclops]

Nope,neither one!


JOHN,Paul,George and Ringo!


IMAGINE!

[2009AD]

Nope,neither one!


JOHN,Paul,George and Ringo!


IMAGINE!

Nope, Each of these acts, Elvis, Beatles and MJ made music history, in their own way. Al three were influenced by earlier acts and all three influenced subsequent generations. All three acts are consider iconic, all three altered the course of music.

[62des]

this is no comparison michael jackson has no equal. did elvis have 7 top 10 hits on the same album? i think not.

[2009AD]

this is no comparison michael jackson has no equal. did elvis have 7 top 10 hits on the same album? i think not.

No Elvis did not, but Jackson still trails Elvis and The Beatles in the number of worldwide album sales... so. Anyways, argue with other if you want. i thin k you're all splitting hairs. Elvis and jackson both revolutionized American pop music in their own eras and their own way. C ya.

[atlantaguy4470]

Elvis clearly was a better musician/singer....hes out sold Jacko....he was the most influencial person in music history...as he was in fashion. He clearly is the KING OF ROCK-N-ROLL...while Jacko is just the King of POP.....sure you can have that...its like saying Elvis' the King of Sports and Jacko is the King of Hockey....its just facts

[2009AD]

Elvis was the most influencial person in music history...

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :roll:

[Cyclops]

Paul McCartney is listed in Guinness World Records as the most successful musician and composer in popular music history, with 60 gold discs and sales of 100 million singles.

I might add that he is also still active,performing in concerts at the the ripe old age of 67.Something that will never be said about Michael or Elvis

Here's a question for you all to ponder:

On all of the Beatles songs,how can you tell,just by listening,who wrote the song?(answer to follow)

[hippifried]

It's not about record sales. It's about quality of entertainment (subjective at best), showmanship, & innovation.

For pure showmanship, I've never seen anyone top James Brown. How come he never comes up in these conversations?

[Quiet Reflections]

ill take Led Zeppelin over anyone named in this thread so far

[Ecstatic]

On all of the Beatles songs,how can you tell,just by listening,who wrote the song?(answer to follow)
On most of their songs, the songwriter was the lead singer: George sang all his own songs, as did Ringo, and both were credited as solo writers. However, John and Paul had made an agreement (rather informal initially) that they would share credit on all their songs, regardless of who wrote the song or to what degree the song was co-written. John, being the elder and the band's founder and titular leader, had his name listed first (which led to a conflict between Paul and Yoko a few years ago when Paul wanted to list his name first--not remove John's name--on songs he wrote, and Yoko fought him legally and won).

Now, most of the time, if Paul was singing lead, it was his song, and likewise for John. However, they co-wrote several songs, often with one having the verses down and the other providing the middle eight, or even combining two songs into one (famous example: "A Day in the Life," which was mostly written by John but which features Paul's "woke up, fell out of bed, dragged a comb across my head" changeup in the middle). Also, you can't tell for certain by who's singing with songs written by John or Paul for Ringo to sing (e.g., "A Little Help from My Friends," "What Goes On," and "Yellow Submarine"); if you went by the singer, you'd think Ringo had written these songs.

[JamesHunt]

that's a great photo.

http://www.boxing-memorabilia.com/images/alielvisP.jpg

[bigcat1]

I dont think you can say either one was better, I would say they stand as equals as the two greatest entertainors of the 20th century, And when I mean greatest, as judged by their record sells, charisma, cultural impact, and overall entertainment ability these two giants are both king of there particular eras.
Elvis dominated the rock charts, sold millions of records under the country music genre, and won at least one grammy maybe more for his gospel music. Until he became a parady of himself in his later movies, for a time was the number box office draw in Hollywood, and at the time of his death was his image was the most reproduced figure in the world behind Mickey Mouse.
Micheal Jackson was the first black man on MTV, the biggest selling album of alltime he virtually revived the record industry single handidly, revolutionized MTV. He fuzed RnB with pop, and rock that changed what kind of music we listen to today influincing stars such as Usher, Justin Timberlake and many more..

[BellaBellucci]

Why is there no option for 'neither?'

~BB~

[dbev]

Before Elvis there was nothing.
John Lennon

[2009AD]

Before Elvis there was nothing.
John Lennon

So Elvis invented rock music? :lol: :roll:

[BellaBellucci]

Before Elvis there was nothing.
John Lennon

So Elvis invented rock music? :lol: :roll:

Nope. He ripped it off from black culture. ;)

~BB~

[Andrew Johnson]

I say Elvis, but it's all really subjective anyway.

I did find it interesting that some called Elvis out on alledgedly being a racist...but no one called out Jackson on his alledged sexual abuse of children.

I don't really think either accusation has anything to do with being a great entertainer, but...it was interesting to see that alledgedly being a racist was a worse accusation...on this board anyway.

[cookiepuss]

It's not about record sales. It's about quality of entertainment (subjective at best), showmanship, & innovation.

For pure showmanship, I've never seen anyone top James Brown. How come he never comes up in these conversations?

Agree with you there! Pretty fuckin' sad, as he blew both Elvis and Jacko away!

[cookiepuss]

Before Elvis there was nothing.
John Lennon

So Elvis invented rock music? :lol: :roll:

Nope. He ripped it off from black culture. ;)

~BB~

I don't know about rippin' off culture? But he (Elvis) did ripoff Black music and dance. Same later with Led Zeppelin and Eric Clapton.
Granted, they had talent, but give credit where credit is do!!!
And John Wayne was a Nazi!

[hippifried]

There was no ripoff. It's called influence. Rock 'n Roll is rhythmic blues for the most part, but it takes influence from all over. So does the blues really. It's just folk music. The genre of folk music is nearly indistinguishable between white & black. Listen to Robert Johnson or Nathan Beauregard, & tell me how that's a whole lot different from the Irish country folk music from Appalachia. Add the Afro-Latin rhythms to the various blues & country stuff, mix in classic symphonic keyings, show tunes, & jazz improvisation, & voila: Rock 'n Roll!

Music is eclectic by its very nature, & creates its own culture.

Toot, whistle, plunk, & boom!

[SugaSweet]

Again music is not a sport.Who was/is the best quarterback in the pros?Joe Montana,Brent Favre,Johnny Unitas,Warren Moon,Peyton,Eli,or Archie?
Again NO ONE has accurate record/CD sales figures since the Chinese have added CD and DVD copying to their conquests.
Here are a few things to consider:
Michael Jackson's metamorphis from child star to superstar (producer Quincy Jones).Elvis Presley original attempt at success in Nashville?Zero (go home kid).Enter Sun Records producer Sam Phillips=superstar.The Beatles audition at Decca records?Decca's chief A &R guy tells their manager "Mr Epstein,you really should stick to your families furniture business.Groups with guitars are on the way out"(1962).Beatles meet producer George Martin,and they are on their way.
Some of the most talented people you and I do not know are session musicians,who give the bite to the artists songs.
I can remember here in Nashville when Sheryl Crow was signing her CD's in front of Tootsies Orchid Lounge(maximum attendence 70).
I can remember talking to Kenny Chesney when he worked at EL Chico's restaurant.
I am a bit to young to remember when Jimi Hendrix was fired while backing Little Richard at the Embers club in Nashville for being too 'flamboyant" and taking away from Little Richards act(1967 I would have been nine).
My point is that any aspiring musicians,dancer,actor,actresses,or artists out there=get the right producer,manager,talent agent to help you move forward and forget one or two no's from the "experts".Hasta La Proxima gente.

[Quiet Reflections]

I say Elvis, but it's all really subjective anyway.

I did find it interesting that some called Elvis out on alledgedly being a racist...but no one called out Jackson on his alledged sexual abuse of children.

I don't really think either accusation has anything to do with being a great entertainer, but...it was interesting to see that alledgedly being a racist was a worse accusation...on this board anyway.
you must not be paying attention. there were about 3 threads where people were teeing of on mike about being a child molester
http://www.hungangels.com/board/viewtopic.php?t=46521
http://www.hungangels.com/board/viewtopic.php?t=46571
http://www.hungangels.com/board/viewtopic.php?t=46507
Don't act New. Around here we are equal opportunity haters

[giovanni_hotel]

ELvis was no racist; in that there is no shred of historical or anecdotal evidence that he believed Black people were inferior to White people based on the color of their skin.


The problem a lot of Black people can't help having with Mr. Presley is that he was annointed the King of Rock and Roll by performing Black music to white kids in the late 1950s and 60s.

Many Black artists from that period didn't have the opportunities to perform their own music to large white audiences, while Elvis and his producers were able to re-package that Black 'juke-house' blues/country sound into an acceptable White All American sex symbol and make millions.

Remember, when Elvis first started out, he caught hell for being too Black in his style and presentation.

When Elvis was in HS, in Memphis, most of his free time was spent socializing with Black performers and musicians.

Sure, he later developed his own style, but to call the man the King of Rock and Roll when he was merely performing music originated and innovated by others is a travesty.

But to call him a racist, from everything I've seen and read of him, is flawed.

He surrounded himself with Black folks, and was very Black friendy in his private and professional life.

How many 'racists' record songs like "In The Ghetto"?

The Black gospel group, the Sweet Inspirations, were Elvis's backup singers in the 1970s.

There is understandable resentment towards Elvis by many Black people, but I wouldn't go so far as to call him racist.

[BellaBellucci]

ELvis was no racist; in that there is no shred of historical or anecdotal evidence that he believed Black people were inferior to White people based on the color of their skin.


The problem a lot of Black people can't help having with Mr. Presley is that he was annointed the King of Rock and Roll by performing Black music to white kids in the late 1950s and 60s.

Many Black artists from that period didn't have the opportunities to perform their own music to large white audiences, while Elvis and his producers were able to re-package that Black 'juke-house' blues/country sound into an acceptable White All American sex symbol and make millions.

Remember, when Elvis first started out, he caught hell for being too Black in his style and presentation.

When Elvis was in HS, in Memphis, most of his free time was spent socializing with Black performers and musicians.

Sure, he later developed his own style, but to call the man the King of Rock and Roll when he was merely performing music originated and innovated by others is a travesty.

But to call him a racist, from everything I've seen and read of him, is flawed.

He surrounded himself with Black folks, and was very Black friendy in his private and professional life.

How many 'racists' record songs like "In The Ghetto"?

The Black gospel group, the Sweet Inspirations, were Elvis's backup singers in the 1970s.

There is understandable resentment towards Elvis by many Black people, but I wouldn't go so far as to call him racist.

Totally agreed!

~BB~

[Perverted Monk]

I have to say MJ. I'm a little biased though because I was born the same year Elvis died, which means I grew up in the MJ era. All I can remember seeing was MJ blowing it up from here to Hong Kong. I know Elvis was very big, but it just seemed that MJ's global popularity is unmatched.

[Intrepid]

who was the best?

Even though Elvis ended up a 42 yo overweight burger guzzling druggie, I still think he blows whacko Jacko off the planet. What say you lot???

Elvis didn't end up a 42 yo overweight burger guzzling druggie. He ended up a 42 yo overweight peanut butter, bacon, and banana sandwich guzzling druggie.

[hippifried]

Music has no color. Nobody's stealing anything from anybody. They're all influencing each other. Natural racial rhythm is a myth. Musicians hear things & put their own spin on it. Good musicians don't care who's playing what. They just want to sit in & play it too.

Back in the '50s & early '60s, black artists weren't allowed on the radio. There were lots of covers by white artists. It wasn't theft. It was the only way to get the music out there. Elvis paid Willa Mae Thornton for 'Hound dog', but his final version didn't resemble her's at all. 'Blue Suede Shoes' was a remake of Carl Perkins' hit. 'In the Ghetto' was written by Mac Davis. Well that was only fitting since Mac Davis' mother wrote 'Heartbreak Hotel'. It's all mixed up. Michael Jackson was all about James Bown. The moves. The vocal stops. Bar accent placement. Was he stealing? No. He was making music.

[giovanni_hotel]

Hippifriend, you're talking about performances by the actual artists; when I say 'steal', I'm specifically referring to the business side of the music industry.

If someone is perceived to be given an unfair opportunity to profit from an artform orginated within another culture/community, to the people or persons from that aggrieved group, it feels like theft.

At the time, in the late 50s and early 60s, many Black artists rightly felt Elvis Presley and his record companies were making coin co-opting Black music.

Thankfully that's not so much the case today.

Ultimately, at some point, Black music is still American music.

[SugaSweet]

Hippifried,actually Mae Axton was Hoyt Axton's mother.Hoyt scored one of those lifetime royalty success songs with Jeremiah Was a Bullfrog(or was it titled Joy to the World) for Three Dog Night.Mae is credited for writing Heartbreak Hotel along with Elvis and a guy named Durden.

[2009AD]

Elvis paid Willa Mae Thornton for 'Hound dog', but his final version didn't resemble her's at all.

He did not. Jerry Leiber and Milke Stoller, two white guys, wrote Hound Dog. Thornton recorded it before Presley, but she had nothing to do with the writing.

[Andrew Johnson]

I say Elvis, but it's all really subjective anyway.

I did find it interesting that some called Elvis out on alledgedly being a racist...but no one called out Jackson on his alledged sexual abuse of children.

I don't really think either accusation has anything to do with being a great entertainer, but...it was interesting to see that alledgedly being a racist was a worse accusation...on this board anyway.
you must not be paying attention. there were about 3 threads where people were teeing of on mike about being a child molester
http://www.hungangels.com/board/viewtopic.php?t=46521
http://www.hungangels.com/board/viewtopic.php?t=46571
http://www.hungangels.com/board/viewtopic.php?t=46507
Don't act New. Around here we are equal opportunity haters

Good! As long as there is hatin' goin on it better be equal opportunity hatin'!!!

I didn't see those other threads, I only scan the first page of topics when I stop by....and even then usually on the top 5 or 6.

[hippifried]

Ok ok... Whip me, beat me, make me write bad checks. Mea culpa & all that shit. I guess I should probably look this shit up before I spout off, but I'm just too damn lazy. Being more succinct & shortening my responses would probably have the same effect. Oh well. If everybody sends me a charity check, I promise to use it for therapy.

The point still stands though. White guys writing hit songs for black artists & vice versa. Record companies are out to sell records. They know the demographics. In the '50s, the AOL-Time-Warners hadn't taken over the industry. Yet. Everything was crossovers. There was no FM. The major markets had a few niche radio stations, & everybody else played whatever they could get their hands on. When I was a kid, you could listen to classics, grand ol' opry, rock n' roll, jazz, & showtunes without ever touching the dial.

Elvis was playing "hillbilly" music to start. So was Carl Perkins, Jerry Lee Lewis, & Chuck Berry. They were all fans of Bill Monroe & Bob Wills. Bill Haley recorded Rock Around the Clock in 1953, but a couple of decades ago, I heard an obscure (scratchy & badly preserved too) recording of Bill Haley & the Saddlemen from 1949. It was a song called Rock this Joint, & was Rock Around the Clock without the clock. These guys were fans of Duke Ellington, Benny Goodman, Count Basie, Louis Armstrong, & Xavier Cugat too. Music is eclectic. Everybody's taking from everybody else. As long as credit's given where due, nobody cares.

[beatmaker]

Elvis clearly was a better musician/singer....hes out sold Jacko....he was the most influencial person in music history...as he was in fashion. He clearly is the KING OF ROCK-N-ROLL...while Jacko is just the King of POP.....sure you can have that...its like saying Elvis' the King of Sports and Jacko is the King of Hockey....its just facts

Yeah sure, it's a fact. How is it a fact? Black man invented ROCK-N-ROLL and BLUES and Elvis stole that shyt and packaged it for White folks. There were Black men like Jackie Wilson that could sing and dance rings around Elvis, but never had a modicum of the success. Elvis was a handsome, charismatic entertainer who clearly got his style and swagger from Black musicians. He's admits this, like many legendary White musicians. Elvis has the inherent advantage being a White guy who could sing and dance like a Black soul/blues artist, but had the looks and charisma to put legions of White women in a trance. This made the White guys want to emulate and be Elvis, as a result. Since, Whites were like 70-75% of the U.S population at the time of Elvis' reign, he had a clear institutionalized advantage. Michael had to cross and destroy racial barriers, that Elvis never had to deal with. Michael had to come out with an album and video on the level of "Thriller" to topple the racial barrier at burgeoning music video empire "MTV". Prior to Michael, only rock groups and white pop singers got play on MTV and BET hadn't been founded yet. Whites always talk about BET being a reverse-racist concept, but they fail to realize MTV showed little love to Black artists in the 80's. Michael Jackson, Lionel Richie, RUN-DMC, Prince and a few other Black artists pushed thru, but most were getting no exposure until BET came along.

I'll think Elvis was half the talent of Michael Jackson. Michael has been a hit maker from childhood until his late 30's, when his career started to decline. Elvis had a smooth, distinct singing voice no doubt, but he never could sing a song with the raw emotion that Michael could, nor was he was the dancer or live entertainer that Michael was, even though Elvis was a great live showman in his own right. Nor did Elvis write songs that truly talked about the human condition. Go to Japan, China, Africa and the major Arab countries and ask everyone from 18-65 who they prefer and MJ would dominate those polls. Elvis could do lots of genres and so could Michael, so they were equal in that respect. If you include his hits while in the Jackson 5, Jacksons and as a solo artist, Elvis really couldn't fuch around. I can name MJ hits for days, whereas Elvis had about 8-10 solid hit records that I can think off. I even asked my father who is in his late 50's and he knew more MJ hits, than Elvis.

Atlantaguy4470, I doubt Elvis's record sales eclipsed Michael at the time of both of their deaths. To compare Elvis, whose been dead over 30 years and made into an American institution to Michael's present sales totals is idiotic. If MJ doesn't catch Elvis, it's only because rampant illegal music downloads and bootleg mixtapes have watered down record sales tremendously. Yet, in spite of this barrier and MJ being a Black man in a country still dominated by a White majority, I think he'll eclipse Elvis within 10 years. If you put Elvis and Michael Jackson on stage in their prime, Elvis would get schooled straight up. He couldn't deal with the power and intensity of Michael's voice and dancing ability at it's apex. Elvis was a bad boy no doubt, but he couldn't fuck around! Like the Republican party, primarily Whites from the Southern states are pulling this Elvis was a greater recording artist than Michael Jackson shyt.

Elvis couldn't hold Michael Jackson's artistic jockstrap when they were little boys and couldn't do it as a grown azz man. In terms of Elvis being a "real man", I'll give you that. Elvis was eccentric, whereas Michael was eccentric and self-hating, which caused him to be even more self destructive than Elvis, who became a fat druggie who was a shadow of his former self before his death. However, Michael was dealing with intense self-hatred of his Black skin and features and sought to change them due to whitewashing, that tends to happen to people of color living in a country in which all the best looking and hottest lists are always dominated by Whites, with some tokens sprinkled in. If Michael could have stopped with the eccentricities he had during "Thriller", he could have been a sex symbol in his own right, but his personal demons had other ideas. I heard Elvis would have a room full of women in his house, lecture out the Bible for hours, then leave them and go to bed, so he wasn't playing with a full deck either.

[Legend]

Elvis clearly was a better musician/singer....hes out sold Jacko....he was the most influencial person in music history...as he was in fashion. He clearly is the KING OF ROCK-N-ROLL...while Jacko is just the King of POP.....sure you can have that...its like saying Elvis' the King of Sports and Jacko is the King of Hockey....its just facts

Yeah sure, it's a fact. How is it a fact? Black man invented ROCK-N-ROLL and BLUES and Elvis stole that shyt and packaged it for White folks. There were Black men like Jackie Wilson that could sing and dance rings around Elvis, but never had a modicum of the success. Elvis was a handsome, charismatic entertainer who clearly got his style and swagger from Black musicians. He's admits this, like many legendary White musicians. Elvis has the inherent advantage being a White guy who could sing and dance like a Black soul/blues artist, but had the looks and charisma to put legions of White women in a trance. This made the White guys want to emulate and be Elvis, as a result. Since, Whites were like 70-75% of the U.S population at the time of Elvis' reign, he had a clear institutionalized advantage. Michael had to cross and destroy racial barriers, that Elvis never had to deal with. Michael had to come out with an album and video on the level of "Thriller" to topple the racial barrier at burgeoning music video empire "MTV". Prior to Michael, only rock groups and white pop singers got play on MTV and BET hadn't been founded yet. Whites always talk about BET being a reverse-racist concept, but they fail to realize MTV showed little love to Black artists in the 80's. Michael Jackson, Lionel Richie, RUN-DMC, Prince and a few other Black artists pushed thru, but most were getting no exposure until BET came along.

I'll think Elvis was half the talent of Michael Jackson. Michael has been a hit maker from childhood until his late 30's, when his career started to decline. Elvis had a smooth, distinct singing voice no doubt, but he never could sing a song with the raw emotion that Michael could, nor was he was the dancer or live entertainer that Michael was, even though Elvis was a great live showman in his own right. Nor did Elvis write songs that truly talked about the human condition. Go to Japan, China, Africa and the major Arab countries and ask everyone from 18-65 who they prefer and MJ would dominate those polls. Elvis could do lots of genres and so could Michael, so they were equal in that respect. If you include his hits while in the Jackson 5, Jacksons and as a solo artist, Elvis really couldn't fuch around. I can name MJ hits for days, whereas Elvis had about 8-10 solid hit records that I can think off. I even asked my father who is in his late 50's and he knew more MJ hits, than Elvis.

Atlantaguy4470, I doubt Elvis's record sales eclipsed Michael at the time of both of their deaths. To compare Elvis, whose been dead over 30 years and made into an American institution to Michael's present sales totals is idiotic. If MJ doesn't catch Elvis, it's only because rampant illegal music downloads and bootleg mixtapes have watered down record sales tremendously. Yet, in spite of this barrier and MJ being a Black man in a country still dominated by a White majority, I think he'll eclipse Elvis within 10 years. If you put Elvis and Michael Jackson on stage in their prime, Elvis would get schooled straight up. He couldn't deal with the power and intensity of Michael's voice and dancing ability at it's apex. Elvis was a bad boy no doubt, but he couldn't fuck around! Like the Republican party, primarily Whites from the Southern states are pulling this Elvis was a greater recording artist than Michael Jackson shyt.

Elvis couldn't hold Michael Jackson's artistic jockstrap when they were little boys and couldn't do it as a grown azz man. In terms of Elvis being a "real man", I'll give you that. Elvis was eccentric, whereas Michael was eccentric and self-hating, which caused him to be even more self destructive than Elvis, who became a fat druggie who was a shadow of his former self before his death. However, Michael was dealing with intense self-hatred of his Black skin and features and sought to change them due to whitewashing, that tends to happen to people of color living in a country in which all the best looking and hottest lists are always dominated by Whites, with some tokens sprinkled in. If Michael could have stopped with the eccentricities he had during "Thriller", he could have been a sex symbol in his own right, but his personal demons had other ideas. I heard Elvis would have a room full of women in his house, lecture out the Bible for hours, then leave them and go to bed, so he wasn't playing with a full deck either.


This troll only comes out when something racial comes up to stir the pot.Take your pathetic jesse jackson/al sharpton wanna ass and crawl back under your rock and fight the non existence power there.

[beatmaker]

ELvis was no racist; in that there is no shred of historical or anecdotal evidence that he believed Black people were inferior to White people based on the color of their skin.


The problem a lot of Black people can't help having with Mr. Presley is that he was annointed the King of Rock and Roll by performing Black music to white kids in the late 1950s and 60s.

Many Black artists from that period didn't have the opportunities to perform their own music to large white audiences, while Elvis and his producers were able to re-package that Black 'juke-house' blues/country sound into an acceptable White All American sex symbol and make millions.

Remember, when Elvis first started out, he caught hell for being too Black in his style and presentation.

When Elvis was in HS, in Memphis, most of his free time was spent socializing with Black performers and musicians.

Sure, he later developed his own style, but to call the man the King of Rock and Roll when he was merely performing music originated and innovated by others is a travesty.

But to call him a racist, from everything I've seen and read of him, is flawed.

He surrounded himself with Black folks, and was very Black friendy in his private and professional life.

How many 'racists' record songs like "In The Ghetto"?

The Black gospel group, the Sweet Inspirations, were Elvis's backup singers in the 1970s.

There is understandable resentment towards Elvis by many Black people, but I wouldn't go so far as to call him racist.

Totally agreed!

~BB~

You might be right, but many Blacks will tell you that admiration of Black culture doesn't negate one's racist pathologies. I attended an elementary school in an Italian neighborhood and they would drive by blasting rap music out of their cars, while yelling "ni@@er" to the Black students standing at the bus stop, so spare me the bulllshyt. The Elvis of Rap Music, Eminem has Black friends and clearly respects Black culture. He even went into a deep depression after his best friend Proof from D-12 (who's Black) was murdered. Yet, a recording of Eminem calling Black women all kinds of racist bullshyt was released by hip-hop magazine "The Source". a few years ago, when he got into a fued with the magazine's owners. Eminem got a court order to minimize how much they could release, but the 15-20 seconds they did release was bad enough. When asked, he claimed his Black girlfriend dumped him and he was angry and young. Well, dude was like 18-19 at the time and calling he was calling her stuff that made Imus look like a saint. So, spare me the "I Black friends" or "I love rap music" excuse. You have racist White men who are attracted and have sex with Black or Latin women all the time. To be fair, I know some Black men who aren't too fond of White people, who have banged they're fair share of White women, so race and racism is way to complex to be oversimplified by posting pictures of Elvis with Black entertainers.

[Silcc69]

“The only thing Negroes can do for me is buy my records and shine my shoes.” :lol:

[beatmaker]

Elvis clearly was a better musician/singer....hes out sold Jacko....he was the most influencial person in music history...as he was in fashion. He clearly is the KING OF ROCK-N-ROLL...while Jacko is just the King of POP.....sure you can have that...its like saying Elvis' the King of Sports and Jacko is the King of Hockey....its just facts

Yeah sure, it's a fact. How is it a fact? Black man invented ROCK-N-ROLL and BLUES and Elvis stole that shyt and packaged it for White folks. There were Black men like Jackie Wilson that could sing and dance rings around Elvis, but never had a modicum of the success. Elvis was a handsome, charismatic entertainer who clearly got his style and swagger from Black musicians. He's admits this, like many legendary White musicians. Elvis has the inherent advantage being a White guy who could sing and dance like a Black soul/blues artist, but had the looks and charisma to put legions of White women in a trance. This made the White guys want to emulate and be Elvis, as a result. Since, Whites were like 70-75% of the U.S population at the time of Elvis' reign, he had a clear institutionalized advantage. Michael had to cross and destroy racial barriers, that Elvis never had to deal with. Michael had to come out with an album and video on the level of "Thriller" to topple the racial barrier at burgeoning music video empire "MTV". Prior to Michael, only rock groups and white pop singers got play on MTV and BET hadn't been founded yet. Whites always talk about BET being a reverse-racist concept, but they fail to realize MTV showed little love to Black artists in the 80's. Michael Jackson, Lionel Richie, RUN-DMC, Prince and a few other Black artists pushed thru, but most were getting no exposure until BET came along.

I'll think Elvis was half the talent of Michael Jackson. Michael has been a hit maker from childhood until his late 30's, when his career started to decline. Elvis had a smooth, distinct singing voice no doubt, but he never could sing a song with the raw emotion that Michael could, nor was he was the dancer or live entertainer that Michael was, even though Elvis was a great live showman in his own right. Nor did Elvis write songs that truly talked about the human condition. Go to Japan, China, Africa and the major Arab countries and ask everyone from 18-65 who they prefer and MJ would dominate those polls. Elvis could do lots of genres and so could Michael, so they were equal in that respect. If you include his hits while in the Jackson 5, Jacksons and as a solo artist, Elvis really couldn't fuch around. I can name MJ hits for days, whereas Elvis had about 8-10 solid hit records that I can think off. I even asked my father who is in his late 50's and he knew more MJ hits, than Elvis.

Atlantaguy4470, I doubt Elvis's record sales eclipsed Michael at the time of both of their deaths. To compare Elvis, whose been dead over 30 years and made into an American institution to Michael's present sales totals is idiotic. If MJ doesn't catch Elvis, it's only because rampant illegal music downloads and bootleg mixtapes have watered down record sales tremendously. Yet, in spite of this barrier and MJ being a Black man in a country still dominated by a White majority, I think he'll eclipse Elvis within 10 years. If you put Elvis and Michael Jackson on stage in their prime, Elvis would get schooled straight up. He couldn't deal with the power and intensity of Michael's voice and dancing ability at it's apex. Elvis was a bad boy no doubt, but he couldn't fuck around! Like the Republican party, primarily Whites from the Southern states are pulling this Elvis was a greater recording artist than Michael Jackson shyt.

Elvis couldn't hold Michael Jackson's artistic jockstrap when they were little boys and couldn't do it as a grown azz man. In terms of Elvis being a "real man", I'll give you that. Elvis was eccentric, whereas Michael was eccentric and self-hating, which caused him to be even more self destructive than Elvis, who became a fat druggie who was a shadow of his former self before his death. However, Michael was dealing with intense self-hatred of his Black skin and features and sought to change them due to whitewashing, that tends to happen to people of color living in a country in which all the best looking and hottest lists are always dominated by Whites, with some tokens sprinkled in. If Michael could have stopped with the eccentricities he had during "Thriller", he could have been a sex symbol in his own right, but his personal demons had other ideas. I heard Elvis would have a room full of women in his house, lecture out the Bible for hours, then leave them and go to bed, so he wasn't playing with a full deck either.


This troll only comes out when something racial comes up to stir the pot.Take your pathetic jesse jackson/al sharpton wanna ass and crawl
back under your rock and fight the non existence power there.

Dude, fuck you! You are always arguing with the Black men in H.A who are conscious of their Blackness. You are weak and seem threatened by Black men who aren't walking around confused and self-hating like Michael Jackson. You're the typical fool who thinks they're liberal, but really isn't. A truly secure, racially comfortable White person doesn't get angered by Blacks who aren't happy with the status-quo. Legend is one of these idiots who thinks racism ended with the election of Barack Obama. He's also the type who won't jump down a Jewish person's throat for being proud and culturally aware, yet seems to obsessed with the character assassination of any Black person who isn't walking around in denial.

First off Legend, your whore mother is a troll!

Second off, your bytch azz posts in 99.9% of the HA threads dealing with racial issues, yet always want to accuse the culturally aware Blacks posting in those threads of being reverse racists and Whitey haters. You seem intent on telling Black men, how they should react to being a Black man, when you aren't one. Typical fake liberal arrogant azzhole, who only likes Blacks who know their place!

Thirdly, it always kills me when people criticize Al Sharpton and Jesse Jackson. I guess after the U.S government and J. Edgar Hoover assasinated Dr. King and locked up tons of Black civil rights activists on trumped up bullshyt, we reached the racial promise land and they're was no longer a need to push for civil rights and equality, in "The World According To Legend". Funny how, the activists for the Jewish and gay communities who agitate for change are never maligned like Al Sharpton or Jesse Jackson. Legend's reaction to strong Black men, reminds me of something I heard an old timer say. "If a Black civil rights leader is well liked by Whites, he's not doing his job". I love Barack Obama, but he's not comfortable addressing Black issues in front of Whites and he's not elected to be the Black leader anyway. That's why people like Al, Jesse or Farrakhan are necessary. When a Black teenager gets beat or shot by the police and they''re constantly getting off, what do you suggest we do Legend since you know so much about the Black man's struggle? People like you back in the day, labeled Dr. Martin Luther King as a "troublemaker" and said Blacks should be "patient", yet these same folks nowadays never have anything to say about the activists in the Jewish, gay or women's movement.

Fourthly, several White posters in this thread acknowledged how Elvis co-opted Black music and style just like I did, yet you ain't said shyt to them. Like I said before, typical bytch azz! The other half of my post dealt with comparing their talent and ability, yet your anger and pathological obsession with silencing outspoken Black men, made it seem like 100% of my post dealt with racism.

Fifth and last, Legend your existence on this planet is as meaningless to me and the roach I step on or the fly I swat. They're several Black men on HA who will wholeheartedly agree. I'm going to pull your bytch card AGAIN and show HA how full of shyt you are. Everytime you come at me with the battery in your back and try to put me on blast, I'm going to air out your hypocrisy AGAIN and AGAIN! This quivering dyckhead tried to defend this RubyTS chick in a thread several months ago and come at some other brothas who were getting at her, but then he tried to throw her under the bus to me via PM a few years ago and I never PM'd this fool EVER!

From: Legend
To: beatmaker
Posted: Sun Oct 01, 2006 3:21 am
Subject: Racist tranny Quote message
If you thought yasmin was racist there is awell known girl on here that states she is racist and call all black people bums in her youtube videos.


From: Legend
To: beatmaker
Posted: Sun Oct 01, 2006 3:24 am
Subject: rubyts Quote message
Just go watch her youtube videos and she says all black people are bums and another video she explains why she is racist.


THAT HYPOCRISY YOU'RE COOKING UP LEGEND IS STINKING UP THE KITCHEN, LOL!

[beatmaker]

Elvis clearly was a better musician/singer....hes out sold Jacko....he was the most influencial person in music history...as he was in fashion. He clearly is the KING OF ROCK-N-ROLL...while Jacko is just the King of POP.....sure you can have that...its like saying Elvis' the King of Sports and Jacko is the King of Hockey....its just facts

Yeah sure, it's a fact. How is it a fact? Black man invented ROCK-N-ROLL and BLUES and Elvis stole that shyt and packaged it for White folks. There were Black men like Jackie Wilson that could sing and dance rings around Elvis, but never had a modicum of the success. Elvis was a handsome, charismatic entertainer who clearly got his style and swagger from Black musicians. He's admits this, like many legendary White musicians. Elvis has the inherent advantage being a White guy who could sing and dance like a Black soul/blues artist, but had the looks and charisma to put legions of White women in a trance. This made the White guys want to emulate and be Elvis, as a result. Since, Whites were like 70-75% of the U.S population at the time of Elvis' reign, he had a clear institutionalized advantage. Michael had to cross and destroy racial barriers, that Elvis never had to deal with. Michael had to come out with an album and video on the level of "Thriller" to topple the racial barrier at burgeoning music video empire "MTV". Prior to Michael, only rock groups and white pop singers got play on MTV and BET hadn't been founded yet. Whites always talk about BET being a reverse-racist concept, but they fail to realize MTV showed little love to Black artists in the 80's. Michael Jackson, Lionel Richie, RUN-DMC, Prince and a few other Black artists pushed thru, but most were getting no exposure until BET came along.

I'll think Elvis was half the talent of Michael Jackson. Michael has been a hit maker from childhood until his late 30's, when his career started to decline. Elvis had a smooth, distinct singing voice no doubt, but he never could sing a song with the raw emotion that Michael could, nor was he was the dancer or live entertainer that Michael was, even though Elvis was a great live showman in his own right. Nor did Elvis write songs that truly talked about the human condition. Go to Japan, China, Africa and the major Arab countries and ask everyone from 18-65 who they prefer and MJ would dominate those polls. Elvis could do lots of genres and so could Michael, so they were equal in that respect. If you include his hits while in the Jackson 5, Jacksons and as a solo artist, Elvis really couldn't fuch around. I can name MJ hits for days, whereas Elvis had about 8-10 solid hit records that I can think off. I even asked my father who is in his late 50's and he knew more MJ hits, than Elvis.

Atlantaguy4470, I doubt Elvis's record sales eclipsed Michael at the time of both of their deaths. To compare Elvis, whose been dead over 30 years and made into an American institution to Michael's present sales totals is idiotic. If MJ doesn't catch Elvis, it's only because rampant illegal music downloads and bootleg mixtapes have watered down record sales tremendously. Yet, in spite of this barrier and MJ being a Black man in a country still dominated by a White majority, I think he'll eclipse Elvis within 10 years. If you put Elvis and Michael Jackson on stage in their prime, Elvis would get schooled straight up. He couldn't deal with the power and intensity of Michael's voice and dancing ability at it's apex. Elvis was a bad boy no doubt, but he couldn't fuck around! Like the Republican party, primarily Whites from the Southern states are pulling this Elvis was a greater recording artist than Michael Jackson shyt.

Elvis couldn't hold Michael Jackson's artistic jockstrap when they were little boys and couldn't do it as a grown azz man. In terms of Elvis being a "real man", I'll give you that. Elvis was eccentric, whereas Michael was eccentric and self-hating, which caused him to be even more self destructive than Elvis, who became a fat druggie who was a shadow of his former self before his death. However, Michael was dealing with intense self-hatred of his Black skin and features and sought to change them due to whitewashing, that tends to happen to people of color living in a country in which all the best looking and hottest lists are always dominated by Whites, with some tokens sprinkled in. If Michael could have stopped with the eccentricities he had during "Thriller", he could have been a sex symbol in his own right, but his personal demons had other ideas. I heard Elvis would have a room full of women in his house, lecture out the Bible for hours, then leave them and go to bed, so he wasn't playing with a full deck either.


This troll only comes out when something racial comes up to stir the pot.Take your pathetic jesse jackson/al sharpton wanna ass and crawl
back under your rock and fight the non existence power there.

Dude, fuck you! You are always arguing with the Black men in H.A who are conscious of their Blackness. You are weak and seem threatened by Black men who aren't walking around confused and self-hating like Michael Jackson. You're the typical fool who thinks they're liberal, but really isn't. A truly secure, racially comfortable White person doesn't get angered by Blacks who aren't happy with the status-quo. Legend is one of these idiots who thinks racism ended with the election of Barack Obama. He's also the type who won't jump down a Jewish person's throat for being proud and culturally aware, yet seems to obsessed with the character assassination of any Black person who isn't walking around in denial.

First off Legend, your whore mother is a troll!

Second off, your bytch azz posts in 99.9% of the HA threads dealing with racial issues, yet always want to accuse the culturally aware Blacks posting in those threads of being reverse racists and Whitey haters. You seem intent on telling Black men, how they should react to being a Black man, when you aren't one. Typical fake liberal arrogant azzhole, who only likes Blacks who know their place!

Thirdly, it always kills me when people criticize Al Sharpton and Jesse Jackson. I guess after the U.S government and J. Edgar Hoover assasinated Dr. King and locked up tons of Black civil rights activists on trumped up bullshyt, we reached the racial promise land and they're was no longer a need to push for civil rights and equality, in "The World According To Legend". Funny how, the activists for the Jewish and gay communities who agitate for change are never maligned like Al Sharpton or Jesse Jackson. Legend's reaction to strong Black men, reminds me of something I heard an old timer say. "If a Black civil rights leader is well liked by Whites, he's not doing his job". I love Barack Obama, but he's not comfortable addressing Black issues in front of Whites and he's not elected to be the Black leader anyway. That's why people like Al, Jesse or Farrakhan are necessary. When a Black teenager gets beat or shot by the police and they''re constantly getting off, what do you suggest we do Legend since you know so much about the Black man's struggle? People like you back in the day, labeled Dr. Martin Luther King as a "troublemaker" and said Blacks should be "patient", yet these same folks nowadays never have anything to say about the activists in the Jewish, gay or women's movement.

Fourthly, several White posters in this thread acknowledged how Elvis co-opted Black music and style just like I did, yet you ain't said shyt to them. Like I said before, typical bytch azz! The other half of my post dealt with comparing their talent and ability, yet your anger and pathological obsession with silencing outspoken Black men, made it seem like 100% of my post dealt with racism.

Fifth and last, Legend your existence on this planet is as meaningless to me and the roach I step on or the fly I swat. They're several Black men on HA who will wholeheartedly agree. I'm going to pull your bytch card AGAIN and show HA how full of shyt you are. Everytime you come at me with the battery in your back and try to put me on blast, I'm going to air out your hypocrisy AGAIN and AGAIN! This quivering dyckhead tried to defend this RubyTS chick in a thread several months ago and come at some other brothas who were getting at her, but then he tried to throw her under the bus to me via PM a few years ago and I never PM'd this fool EVER!

From: Legend
To: beatmaker
Posted: Sun Oct 01, 2006 3:21 am
Subject: Racist tranny Quote message
If you thought yasmin was racist there is awell known girl on here that states she is racist and call all black people bums in her youtube videos.


From: Legend
To: beatmaker
Posted: Sun Oct 01, 2006 3:24 am
Subject: rubyts Quote message
Just go watch her youtube videos and she says all black people are bums and another video she explains why she is racist.


THAT HYPOCRISY YOU'RE COOKING UP LEGEND IS STINKING UP THE KITCHEN, LOL!

[giovanni_hotel]

Beatmaker, I don't know if you're responding to me or Bella....

As for you Silc69, that unsubstantiated quote attributed to Elvis was refuted by him in a 1957 article in JET magazine!!!

As a Black man, beatmaker, my only point about Elvis was that it's popular in certain segments of the Black community to label him a racist out of hand with no evidence whatsover, when the reality of his career points to just the opposite point of view.

I don't think any of us knew the man personally, and I don't know why groups like Public Enemy and Living Colour felt the need to brand him as such, but IMHO, from what I've seen and read, to call him a straight out 'racist' is off the mark.

[Realgirls4me]

This troll only comes out when something racial comes up to stir the pot.Take your pathetic jesse jackson/al sharpton wanna ass and crawl back under your rock and fight the non existence power there.

One would have to be incredibly stupid, or in some heavy form of denial, to ever exchange posts with this forum's resident clown. I have repeatedly stated that this idiot is a bigot via the swipes/remarks he has made of Latinos, and yet a few (thankfully, the vast majority see him for what he is) in here still act as if bigotry and racism are acceptable and to be overlooked. Only the newest of members, a fool, or a subscriber of his backwoods bigoted stances or beliefs, would continue to correspond with this incredibly bigoted moron.
Look at his post here. He contributes nothing of substance whatsoever, but comes in to accuse another of doing the very thing he is doing -- stirring the pot. Go to almost every thread regarding race or ethnicity in this forum and odds are you won't find Beatmaker in them, but one is sure to find this forum's spittoon, LEGEND.

Hippiefried,

Yes, everyone borrows to a greater or lesser extent, whether the artists, or the artists' followers, defenders, and apologists like to admit it at times or not, but it is that rare artist or group (The Beatles, for example) that meshes their influences with their one-of-a-kind talent and carries it all to a rarefied, lofty stratum that only a few acts reach every generation or so. Sinatra(maybe), Elvis, The Beatles, and now Jackson, are in that elite group that are untouchable as to their body of work, influence, popularity, etc. ...Einstein borrowed from the work from his contemporaries, as well as his predecessors. He could not have come to his theories and discoveries had he not relied, borrowed or massaged the work of others, but it was ONLY Einstein that put it all together and take it to that next level, as did Jackson, the Beatles, or Elvis. I really don't know what you are trying to say.

Beatmaker,

I agree with the gist of your post. I too would argue that Presley introduced white America to R&B music. Elvis, and other white artists at the time such as Pat Boone and such, would probably not have made it out of the lounge circuit had it not been for how heavily they borrowed from African-American music influences at the time and prior. Don't forget the man (linked) who wrote some hits for Elvis, but was kept in the background by the Colonel himself.

http://www.elvis.com.au/presley/otis_blackwell.shtml

Where would Elvis's early career have been without songs such as "Don't Be Cruel", or "All Shook Up"?

[Realgirls4me]

Beatmaker,

You beat me to the punch on Legend. Is there a bigger clown and hypocrite in this forum?

I too would not go as far as labeling Presley a racist, but I would apply that to the colonel behind him pulling all the strings.

[2009AD]

“The only thing Negroes can do for me is buy my records and shine my shoes.” :lol:

Buzzz. Elvis never said that.

http://www.snopes.com/music/artists/presley1.asp

[Legend]

**********

Keep posting that message from five years ago an see if i care, i apologized to ruby because it was childish and immature and she has forgiven me and that is all that matters to me i can care less how some random cock bandit or whiner like you thinks of me.Letting stuff go is something you can't seem to do because you keep bringing up race in everything from escorts to jacko, you only bring up race when its unnecessary but when "real" racial issues come around your no where to be seen.I think it is f**king laughable that you would even compare dr. king to media whores like shapton and jackson.

[dbev]

http://ginavivinetto.files.wordpress.com/2009/01/15-elvis-presley-081407.jpg

http://chrisfiore5.files.wordpress.com/2009/04/elvis_presley_1970.jpg

http://images.nciku.com/sourcing_images/28/28040_getty_20080730182139.jpg

http://o.aolcdn.com/feedgallery/music/i/e/elvis_presley/12-elvis-presley-081407.jpg

http://www.otrstreet.com/Hollywood_Photos/Elvis%20Presley_05.jpg

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wOYbDLftHuw

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FEO7uu1Pp8I

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OFZ1Fiylh50

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j99qIlGFErY

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8XA1w90_UpY

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5D6b9yTtxeU

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xTYg2Q-vDJ0

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MyrQqmc5UT8

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dptfzlcGEvI

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QmsOdSC-A_Y

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rX54wh5delU

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=agZTP7I0994

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g5D41WNYKE4

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B3XdXEJEI4E

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TJS1vLTV_MA

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5XSlrGlkM6o

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kLYq0MhoZgY

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tEeVMINMRSs

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YrDgbBF8L8M

[Legend]

Beatmaker,

You beat me to the punch on Legend. Is there a bigger clown and hypocrite in this forum?

I too would not go as far as labeling Presley a racist, but I would apply that to the colonel behind him pulling all the strings.

I would be offended if that didn't come from a 50 year old loser who parades around those parties acting creepy looking to keep laid by some girl old enough to be his daughter.I may be childish and immature sometimes i'll admit but what is your excuse, your a 50 year old loser who can't let anything go, get a life dude.

[Realgirls4me]

Beatmaker,

You beat me to the punch on Legend. Is there a bigger clown and hypocrite in this forum?

I too would not go as far as labeling Presley a racist, but I would apply that to the colonel behind him pulling all the strings.

I would be offended if that didn't come from a 50 year old loser who parades around those parties acting creepy looking to keep laid by some girl old enough to be his daughter.I may be childish and immature sometimes i'll admit but what is your excuse, your a 50 year old loser who can't let anything go, get a life dude.

When you don't have anything, just resort to lies, huh? Why are you here, Dipshit? Tell everyone in here once and for all why you are here. From the get-go you have taken shots at just about every type of member here, so why are you here? What's your purpose other than to draw chuckles and disbelief from the members here who have become accustomed to your shit? Who the fuck made you the moral arbiter of what one should prefer or behave like? If you find this lifestyle, or some of the members of this forum so repulsive, why are you here? ANYONE can take cheap shots at another from the comfort and safety of anonymity, and when called to own up to it, run from it all. ANYONE can say something so incredibly irresponsible or stupid about another, and when called on it to defend it, run cowardly to the, "I don't care what you think of me" defense. Are you so hideously ugly, so stupid, and so strapped for any kind of feminine companionship that in your little mind the belief exists that the best you will ever do is frequent a transsexual forum to see what might bite? Who's bit, by the way?
What are "those parties" you are referring to, buffoon? You say that with a bit of inference and disdain. So, initially you came in here castigating the male members in broad swaths as "cock chasers" and "cock bandits", and now you're knocking the parties that are thrown and announced in here? What, are you envious? Is that it? What a lonely, incredibly pathetic life you must lead.

And, oh please, don't try to hide under the "I might be childish and immature" defense. The vast majority of the posters in here realize that it goes a lot deeper than that. How many different members of this forum have taken you to the woodshed and simply kicked your sorry ass? I've lost track. ...Here's the lowdown on you and why many in here can't stand you: You're a bigot, a hypocrite, a liar, a sycophant, and a coward. Did I miss any? That to me says LOSER.

I guess it's time to pull another lie out about me, huh? I'm sure the majority here will believe you before they believe yours truly. LOL!

[Legend]

When you don't have anything, just resort to lies, huh? Why are you here, Dipshit? Tell everyone in here once and for all why you are here. From the get-go you have taken shots at just about every type of member here, so why are you here? What's your purpose other than to draw chuckles and disbelief from the members here who have become accustomed to your shit? Who the fuck made you the moral arbiter of what one should prefer or behave like? If you find this lifestyle, or some of the members of this forum so repulsive, why are you here? ANYONE can take cheap shots at another from the comfort and safety of anonymity, and when called to own up to it, run from it all. ANYONE can say something so incredibly irresponsible or stupid about another, and when called on it to defend it, run cowardly to the, "I don't care what you think of me" defense. Are you so hideously ugly, so stupid, and so strapped for any kind of feminine companionship that in your little mind the belief exists that the best you will ever do is frequent a transsexual forum to see what might bite? Who's bit, by the way?
What are "those parties" you are referring to, buffoon? You say that with a bit of inference and disdain. So, initially you came in here castigating the male members in broad swaths as "cock chasers" and "cock bandits", and now you're knocking the parties that are thrown and announced in here? What, are you envious? Is that it? What a lonely, incredibly pathetic life you must lead.

And, oh please, don't try to hide under the "I might be childish and immature" defense. The vast majority of the posters in here realize that it goes a lot deeper than that. How many different members of this forum have taken you to the woodshed and simply kicked your sorry ass? I've lost track. ...Here's the lowdown on you and why many in here can't stand you: You're a bigot, a hypocrite, a liar, a sycophant, and a coward. Did I miss any? That to me says LOSER.

I guess it's time to pull another lie out about me, huh? I'm sure the majority here will believe you before they believe yours truly. LOL!

[Realgirls4me]

Another "substantive comeback". ... I wonder what it's like to realize at 18 that you're never going to get any. That three quarters of your life still lie before you and the best you'll ever do is whack off to anything remotely feminine on the Cartoon Network.

Never.

Ever.

... Ever!

[Legend]

Another "substantive comeback". ... I wonder what it's like to realize at 18 that you're never going to get any. That three quarters of your life still lie before you and the best you'll ever do is whack off to anything remotely feminine on the Cartoon Network.

Never.

Ever.

... Ever!

[Realgirls4me]

Yep, looks just like me. ...Uh, I noticed you dodged all of my questions. Hmmm, why might that be?

Never.

Ever.

Never.

LOL!

[Legend]

Yep, looks just like me. ...Uh, I noticed you dodged all of my questions. Hmmm, why might that be?

Never.

Ever.

Never.

LOL!

Some advice to the girls here if you see this creepy old bastard at a party or anywhere have the mace ready.

[Realgirls4me]

Why bring a picture of your mother into all this?

[Silcc69]

Elvis is a thief and here is the proof.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7e-S1xSlQxg

[hippifried]

Wow, such hatred! From what? Color had nothing to do with this shit. It was about the music. Now & then, genius springs up. When it does, the color of fthe artist is the loast thing on the mind of his/her peers. Here's some of the actual influences:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Amug2YDZGAc

[giovanni_hotel]

Tell that to Little Richard and Chuck Berry.

I'm not saying Elvis wasn't a bonafide superstar in his own right, but it sure helped to have a socially acceptable 'paint job' if you were going sing R&B/rock and roll to teenage white girls in the 1950s.

[hippifried]

Tell them what? That they were downtrodden? These guys were stars in their own right & had huge hits. They were emulated. There were racial tensions at the time because the Klan was at it's zenith in the '50s, but there were white artists doing covers so they could still get their residuals from places where they couldn't get on the radio & sell records. Covers were a workaround, not a ripoff.

I don't know why all this racial animosity. Seems to me that it's just a bunch of foolishness chasing stupid. Regardless of the pre-civil rights movement crap that went on in America, none of that touched Michael Jackson's career. The Jackson 5 were on TV as soon as they got air play. Everybody said "oh, aren't those negro Osmond-Cowsills cute?".

[Legend]

Why bring a picture of your mother into all this?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jHyU0craHKg

[beatmaker]

Beatmaker, I don't know if you're responding to me or Bella....

As for you Silc69, that unsubstantiated quote attributed to Elvis was refuted by him in a 1957 article in JET magazine!!!

As a Black man, beatmaker, my only point about Elvis was that it's popular in certain segments of the Black community to label him a racist out of hand with no evidence whatsover, when the reality of his career points to just the opposite point of view.

I don't think any of us knew the man personally, and I don't know why groups like Public Enemy and Living Colour felt the need to brand him as such, but IMHO, from what I've seen and read, to call him a straight out 'racist' is off the mark.

Giavanni, I was actually was talking to Atlantaguy. I can discuss this issue with you, because you're stating your opinion intelligently without name calling like Legend.

Anyway, I never said Elvis was a racist, nor do I think he was as liberal on race related issues as people think. People don't realize that Bobby Kennedy pushed his brother JFK on race and equality issues, even though JFK had gone down in history, as this great opponent of Jim Crow racism. Abraham Lincoln thought slavery was wrong, but he really wanted to end slavery because it would break the economy of the South and weaken them to the point where their resistance to joining the American Union would be futile and it worked. Lincoln also wanted to deport slaves back to Africa, Liberia specifically. I say this all to say, Elvis appreciated Black music and culture, but he was never outpsoken about the bigotry of that era, to get my respect as someone who truly considered Blacks his friends and equal. That's my opinion and I'm sticking to it, but I politely respect your opinion to disagree with me sir. When it comes to race, there is a lot of gray area, not everyone is this flaming liberal or hardcore racist, there is a lot of mixed emotions in-between. I've seen guys on HA lust after Black and Latina transsexuals, then turn right around and make racially insensitive comments about those groups in another HA thread, so things aren't always what they seem.

[LTR_Seeker]

Elvis is number 1 in my book

[darklord68]

Elvis rules supreme in my opinion

[beatmaker]

**********

Keep posting that message from five years ago an see if i care, i apologized to ruby because it was childish and immature and she has forgiven me and that is all that matters to me i can care less how some random cock bandit or whiner like you thinks of me.Letting stuff go is something you can't seem to do because you keep bringing up race in everything from escorts to jacko, you only bring up race when its unnecessary but when "real" racial issues come around your no where to be seen.I think it is f**king laughable that you would even compare dr. king to media whores like shapton and jackson.

You do realize that Jesse Jackson was one of Dr. King's right hand men in the Civil Rights Movement of the 60's and he was actually at the Lorraine Motel in Memphis with Dr. King, when he was assassinated. However, with that said, I think Jesse "use to be" a man with the character of Dr. King, but since Blacks are so disunified and unable to rally for any sustained and meaningful protest nowadays, as we have become content, apathetic and complacent, I guess he just said "fuck it" and started to use his bully pulpit to get ahead and curry political favor. However, make no mistake the young Jesse Jackson was about his business. As far as Al Sharpton, I highly disagree with your assessment wholeheartedly. He made a very good point in a NYC 1 interview I saw several years ago. He said the media and some in the White community always accuse him of "race baiting" and only supporting Black against White issues, but those same people never cover all the stuff he does for unions, poor people and disenfranchised workers outside of the Black community. The media doesn't cover this, because it would deflate the image they have erected of him, as some reverse racist, kill Whitey loudmouth, which sells newpapers. Many weak-minded, bamboozled Blacks have fallen victim to this character assassination also. For all the celebrity friends and political clout Al Sharpton has, he lives in a modest home, his "National Action Network" offices are located in an old fitness gym in Harlem, on 145th St in the heart of the community. When he ran for state office and the Presidency, he had less than 250K in his campaign coffiers, yet held his own with all the seasoned Presidential candidates in the debates on the issues facing America, not just Black America. Yet, Sarah Palin had the whole force of the GOP behind her with debate coaches and advisors 24/7, yet she still sucked in interviews and debates about simple stuff you learn in a H.S Civics class. On the otherhand, Jesse Jackson has a cushy downtown NYC office, a big home, cheated on his wife and has used his position to leverage for the financial gain of him and his family (i.e a Budweiser distributorship in Maryland, I think Baltimore). So, I can't defend the Jesse Jackson of today, as he has fallen victim to the trappings of power and influence and has become of the "poverty pimp", many Whites and the media has characterized him as for all these years. Yet, I know my history and know he "use to be" an honorable man of conviction, but somehow lost his way over the years. As they say, power corrupts! Al Sharpton and Jesse Jackson may both be the preeminent Civil Rights leaders in the Black community, but they are not adjoined at the hip and are not of the same moral fiber, irrespective of what you think Legend.

[beatmaker]

Tell them what? That they were downtrodden? These guys were stars in their own right & had huge hits. They were emulated. There were racial tensions at the time because the Klan was at it's zenith in the '50s, but there were white artists doing covers so they could still get their residuals from places where they couldn't get on the radio & sell records. Covers were a workaround, not a ripoff.

I don't know why all this racial animosity. Seems to me that it's just a bunch of foolishness chasing stupid. Regardless of the pre-civil rights movement crap that went on in America, none of that touched Michael Jackson's career. The Jackson 5 were on TV as soon as they got air play. Everybody said "oh, aren't those negro Osmond-Cowsills cute?".

I disagree. Look at how his sister Janet, a megastar in her own right has been damn near blackballed after the Super Bowl "Nipplegate" incident, while Justin Timberlake's career hasn't experienced a ripple. You do realize that his brilliant work from "Off The Wall" was not played on MTV. Maybe it was too R&B. It took tens of millions of albums and the groundbreaking videos, that accompanied "Thriller" for Michael to break the color barrier at MTV, so the Pollyana assumption that his skin color never hindered him, is misguided. Especially, since you didn't know or talk to him personally to know what he may or may not have had to deal with on his rise to mega-stardom. You had big Motown acts who couldn't stay at the hotels they performed at, couldn't swim in their pools or even eat at the restaurants. I'm sure Joe Jackson could recount some stories from the Jackson 5 days, that Michael may have been too young to really understand or remember.

Pretending thing didn't happen or exist, won't solve things either. It just allows things to fester and simmer under the surface, until things boil over. I remember Michael saying a White woman came up to him in his teen years and said "You used to be so cute, want happened to you", so MJ has encountered some of the bullshyt. I'll admit his father's and sibling's criticism of his nose and features, probably stung more, than those that came from that insensitive fan in the grand scheme of things.

[jjhill]

Did all the older people vote for Elvis, and all the young people like myself vote for MJ?

[LTR_Seeker]

Im only 35 voted for elvis

[sugdaddie69]

Did all the older people vote for Elvis, and all the young people like myself vote for MJ?

Naw,I voted for MJ

[Legend]

Beatmaker, I don't know if you're responding to me or Bella....

As for you Silc69, that unsubstantiated quote attributed to Elvis was refuted by him in a 1957 article in JET magazine!!!

As a Black man, beatmaker, my only point about Elvis was that it's popular in certain segments of the Black community to label him a racist out of hand with no evidence whatsover, when the reality of his career points to just the opposite point of view.

I don't think any of us knew the man personally, and I don't know why groups like Public Enemy and Living Colour felt the need to brand him as such, but IMHO, from what I've seen and read, to call him a straight out 'racist' is off the mark.

Giavanni, I was actually was talking to Atlantaguy. I can discuss this issue with you, because you're stating your opinion intelligently without name calling like Legend.

Anyway, I never said Elvis was a racist, nor do I think he was as liberal on race related issues as people think. People don't realize that Bobby Kennedy pushed his brother JFK on race and equality issues, even though JFK had gone down in history, as this great opponent of Jim Crow racism. Abraham Lincoln thought slavery was wrong, but he really wanted to end slavery because it would break the economy of the South and weaken them to the point where their resistance to joining the American Union would be futile and it worked. Lincoln also wanted to deport slaves back to Africa, Liberia specifically. I say this all to say, Elvis appreciated Black music and culture, but he was never outpsoken about the bigotry of that era, to get my respect as someone who truly considered Blacks his friends and equal. That's my opinion and I'm sticking to it, but I politely respect your opinion to disagree with me sir. When it comes to race, there is a lot of gray area, not everyone is this flaming liberal or hardcore racist, there is a lot of mixed emotions in-between. I've seen guys on HA lust after Black and Latina transsexuals, then turn right around and make racially insensitive comments about those groups in another HA thread, so things aren't always what they seem.


Your one of the biggest frauds on hungangels, you are always so vocal about race in all these celebrity gossip/escorts threads but real racial issues come up your no where to be seen.You're like the sharpton/jackson of hungangels, your an attention whore and rather then helping the racial tension, you make it worse.God never,ever put those two race baiting clowns jackson and sharpton in the same sentence with dr. king ever again.


TIME FOR JACKSON, SHARPTON
TO STEP DOWN.
By JASON WHITLOCK



I'm calling for Jesse Jackson and Al Sharpton, the president and vice president of Black America, to step down. Their leadership is stale. Their ideas are outdated. And they don't give a crap about us.



We need to take a cue from White America and re-elect our leadership every four years. White folks realize that power corrupts. That's why they placed term limits on the presidency. They know if you leave a man in power too long he quits looking out for the interest of his constituency and starts looking out for his own best interest. We've turned Jesse and Al into Supreme Court justices. They get to speak for us for a lifetime. Why?

If judged by the results they've produced the last 20 years, you'd have to regard their administration as a total failure. Seriously, compared to Martin [Luther King] and Malcolm [X] and the freedoms and progress their leadership produced, Jesse and Al are an embarrassment.
Their job the last two decades was to show black people how to take advantage of the opportunities Martin (Luther King) and Malcolm [X] won [for black Americans].
Have we [black Americans, taken advantage of those opportunities] at the level we should have? No.

Rather than inspire us to seize hard-earned opportunities, Jesse and Al have specialized in blackmailing white folks for profit and attention. They were at it again last week, helping to turn radio shock jock Don Imus' stupidity into a world-wide crisis that reached its crescendo Tuesday afternoon when Rutgers women's basketball coach Vivian Stringer led a massive pity party/recruiting rally. Hey, what Imus said, calling the Rutgers players "nappy-headed hos,"
was ignorant, insensitive and offensive. But so are many of the words that come out of the mouths of radio shock jocks/comedians. [Rutgers lost to Tennessee in the NCAA national championship game last week in Cleveland.]

Imus' words did no real damage. Let me tell you what damaged us this week: the sports cover of Tuesday's USA Today. This country's newspaper of record published a story about the NFL and crime and ran a picture of 41 NFL players who were arrested in 2006. By my count, 39 of those players were black. You want to talk about a damaging, powerful image, an image that went out across the globe? We're holding news conferences about Imus when the behavior of NFL players is painting us as lawless and immoral. Come on. We can do better than that. Jesse and Al are smarter than that.

Had Imus' predictably poor attempt at humor not been turned into an international incident by the deluge of media coverage, 97 percent of America would've never known what Imus said. His platform isn't that large and it has zero penetration into the sports world. Imus certainly doesn't resonate in the world frequented by college women. The insistence by these young women that they have been emotionally scarred by an old white man with no currency in their world is laughably dishonest. The Rutgers players are nothing more than pawns in a game being played by Jackson, Sharpton and Stringer [C. Vivian Stringer, the Rutgers women's basketball coach].
Jesse and Al are flexing their muscle and setting up their next sting. Bringing down Imus, despite his sincere attempts at apologizing, would serve notice to their next potential victim that it is far better to pay up than stand up to Jesse and Al James. [Jesse Jackson's long pattern of political and corporate extortion and blackmail is a matter of record. A Google search of 'jesse jackson extortion' should return plenty to keep you busy.]
Stringer just wanted her 15 minutes to make the case that she's every bit as important as Pat Summitt and Geno Auriemma [team members?]. By the time Stringer's rambling, rapping and rhyming 30-minute speech was over, you'd forgotten that Tennessee won the national championship and just assumed a racist plot had been hatched to deny the [Rutgers] Scarlet Knights credit for winning it all.

Maybe that's the real crime. Imus' ignorance has taken attention away from Candace Parker's and Summitt's incredible accomplishment. Or maybe it was Sharpton's, Stringer's and Jackson's grandstanding that moved the spotlight from Tennessee to New Jersey? None of this over-the-top grandstanding does Black America any good. We can't win the war over verbal disrespect and racism when we have so obviously and blatantly surrendered the moral high ground on the issue. Jesse and Al might win the battle with Imus and get him fired or severely neutered. But the war? We don't stand a chance in the war.

Not when everybody knows "nappy-headed hos" is a compliment compared to what we allow black rap artists to say about black women on a daily basis. We look foolish and cruel for kicking a man who went on Sharpton's radio show and apologized. Imus didn't pull a Michael Richards and schedule an interview on Letterman. Imus went to the Black vice president's house, acknowledged his mistake and asked for forgiveness. Let it go and let God [grant forgiveness].

We have more important issues to deal with than Imus. If we are unwilling to clean up the filth and disrespect we heap on each other, nothing will change with our condition. You can fire every Don Imus in the country, and our incarceration rate, fatherless-child rate, illiteracy rate and murder rate will still continue to skyrocket. A man who doesn't respect himself wastes his breath demanding that others respect him. We don't respect ourselves right now. If we did, we wouldn't call each other the N-word. If we did, we wouldn't let people with prison values define who we are in music and videos. If we did, we wouldn't call black women bitches and hos and abandon them when they have our babies. If we had the proper level of self-respect, we wouldn't act like it's only a crime when a white man disrespects us. We hold Imus to a higher standard than we hold ourselves. That's a (freaking) shame.

We need leadership that is interested in fixing the culture we've adopted. We need leadership that makes all of us take tremendous pride in educating ourselves. We need leadership that can reach professional athletes and entertainers and get them to understand that they’re ambassadors and play an important role in defining who we are and what values our culture will embrace.

It's time for Jesse and Al to step down. They've had 25 years to lead us. Other than their accountants, I'd be hard pressed to find someone who has benefited from their administration.

[giovanni_hotel]

Jason Whitlock is not the arbiter for the universal mind of Black consciousness.

He has good points on some issues, but he comes across as a bitter, odd cat on other discussions.

It is time for dudes like Sharpton and Jackson to hit the assisted living condominium, but I don't see too many brothas or sistas in line to replace them.

[Silcc69]

Wow I think there are more white people on here anyways. Hence why Elvis is dominating.

[HP1000]

If you hear a "loud rumble" tonite in the sky, don't worry. It's not thunder. It's Elvis beatin' the shit out of Micheal Jackson for marrying his daughter.

[Quiet Reflections]

Jason Whitlock is not the arbiter for the universal mind of Black consciousness.

He has good points on some issues, but he comes across as a bitter, odd cat on other discussions.

It is time for dudes like Sharpton and Jackson to hit the assisted living condominium, but I don't see too many brothas or sistas in line to replace them.
Replace them as what? Reverends neither holds any real position. if your looking for young black leadership check out Benjamin Jealous. He is the New President/CEO of the NAACP at age 35

[Silcc69]

Jason Whitlock is not the arbiter for the universal mind of Black consciousness.

He has good points on some issues, but he comes across as a bitter, odd cat on other discussions.

It is time for dudes like Sharpton and Jackson to hit the assisted living condominium, but I don't see too many brothas or sistas in line to replace them.
Replace them as what? Reverends neither holds any real position. if your looking for young black leadership check out Benjamin Jealous.

I would'nt consider either of them reverends rather than opportunist. Does Jackson even have a church?

[jjhill]

If you hear a "loud rumble" tonite in the sky, don't worry. It's not thunder. It's Elvis beatin' the shit out of Micheal Jackson for marrying his daughter.


Why he wait so long? :roll:

[Quiet Reflections]

Jason Whitlock is not the arbiter for the universal mind of Black consciousness.

He has good points on some issues, but he comes across as a bitter, odd cat on other discussions.

It is time for dudes like Sharpton and Jackson to hit the assisted living condominium, but I don't see too many brothas or sistas in line to replace them.
Replace them as what? Reverends neither holds any real position. if your looking for young black leadership check out Benjamin Jealous.

I would'nt consider either of them reverends rather than opportunist. Does Jackson even have a church? I'm sure there is a church of fools somewhere willing to listen to both of them.

[sugdaddie69]

If you hear a "loud rumble" tonite in the sky, don't worry. It's not thunder. It's Elvis beatin' the shit out of Micheal Jackson for marrying his daughter.


Shit,if he beat anyone it should be his daughter,no one twisted her arm

[ray_777]

I think Jackson was more talented as an artist and musician. He wrote (not co-wrote) many of his biggest hits such as Billie Jean. The idea for the Thriller dance and video were his own. Without Jacksons own creativity he would not have enjoyed the success he did.

Elvis on the other hand was successful because he was a pioneer bringing rock and roll to the masses. He himself was modestly talented and owes much of his success to marketing, promotion and the people behind him.

[lisaparadise]

who was the best?

Even though Elvis ended up a 42 yo overweight burger guzzling druggie, I still think he blows whacko Jacko off the planet. What say you lot???who better are you serious?elvis is and alway will be the greatest performer of all time followed by sinatra

[BellaBellucci]

who better are you serious?elvis is and alway will be the greatest performer of all time followed by sinatra

They're all overrated, but all things being equal I wonder how Sinatra didn't make the list of choices. :wiggle:

~BB~

[lisaparadise]

They're all overrated, but all things being equal I wonder how Sinatra didn't make the list of choices. :wiggle:

~BB~elvis and frank will always be the best i remember a story when i was really young my dad said to my mom you should listen to this new kid hes a black singer named elvis lol

[Star Angel 86]

elvis and frank will always be the best i remember a story when i was really young my dad said to my mom you should listen to this new kid hes a black singer named elvis lol

Lisa you're not that old.:twisted::lol::cheers:

[lisaparadise]

Lisa you're not that old.:twisted::lol::cheers:lol hahaha your just being kind k when i was a kid my dad used to make me climb a 60 foot antenna just so he could watch another channell lol we only has 3 in those days and it was in black and white no wonder im freakin coloured blind lol

[kaientai]

I would have to say MJ is more talented then elvis imo that is. But neither can hold a candle to freddie mercury in singing or performance, and i'll also admit james brown and mr sinatra and even bruce springsteen are better then they ever were.

[lisaparadise]

I would have to say MJ is more talented then elvis imo that is. But neither can hold a candle to freddie mercury in singing or performance, and i'll also admit james brown and mr sinatra and even bruce springsteen are better then they ever were.dude? you must be over 40 to participate damn it

[kaientai]

sorry lisa did not know

[lisaparadise]

sorry lisa did not knowim just playin witcha babe,the older you get the more we appreciate the music of our childhood although my kids make me listen to this new stuff i cant help but wonder what there really missing.music has transformed so much in my lifetime and i know full well that the music of today doesnt hold a candle to what i grew up with.the 60 revolution? as MC hammer would say ,,,ya cant touch this.

[Star Angel 86]

lol hahaha your just being kind k when i was a kid my dad used to make me climb a 60 foot antenna just so he could watch another channell lol we only has 3 in those days and it was in black and white no wonder im freakin coloured blind lol

I remember when you a choice between color and B & W and there were only like 4 channels and UHF which would never come in.Oh yeah my vote definitely goes to Elvis.

[rightback]

You can't compare Elvis and Michael Jackson. They are completely different in musical style. The only reason they are even in the same discussion is because they were both huge music/pop stars.

I personally am a much bigger Jacko fan than Elvis. Elvis never really did it for me, excluding a few of his most popular songs. Elvis just seems bland compared to Chuck Berry, Carl Perkins, and some of his other peers. Don't get me wrong, I have a huge respect for Elvis, but nothing makes me shake my booty like a classic Michael Jackson or Jackson 5 song.

[natina]

Elvis was a hero to most
But he never meant shit to me you see
Straight up racist that sucker was
Simple and plain
Mother fuck him and John Wayne
Cause I'm Black and I'm proud
I'm ready and hyped plus I'm amped
Most of my heroes don't appear on no stamps
Sample a look back you look and find
Nothing but rednecks for 400 years if you check

Public Enemy - Fight The Power - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8PaoLy7PHwk)


Fight The Power


1989 the number another summer (get down)
Sound of the funky drummer
Music hittin' your heart cause I know you got sould
(Brothers and sisters, hey)
Listen if you're missin' y'all
Swingin' while I'm singin'
Givin' whatcha gettin'
Knowin' what I know
While the Black bands sweatin'
And the rhythm rhymes rollin'
Got to give us what we want
Gotta give us what we need
Our freedom of speech is freedom or death
We got to fight the powers that be
Lemme hear you say
Fight the power


Chorus


As the rhythm designed to bounce
What counts is that the rhymes
Designed to fill your mind
Now that you've realized the prides arrived
We got to pump the stuff to make us tough
from the heart
It's a start, a work of art
To revolutionize make a change nothin's strange
People, people we are the same
No we're not the same
Cause we don't know the game
What we need is awareness, we can't get careless
You say what is this?
My beloved lets get down to business
Mental self defensive fitness
(Yo) bum rush the show
You gotta go for what you know
Make everybody see, in order to fight the powers that be
Lemme hear you say...
Fight the Power


Chorus


Elvis was a hero to most
But he never meant shit to me you see
Straight up racist that sucker was
Simple and plain
Mother fuck him and John Wayne
Cause I'm Black and I'm proud
I'm ready and hyped plus I'm amped
Most of my heroes don't appear on no stamps
Sample a look back you look and find
Nothing but rednecks for 400 years if you check
Don't worry be happy
Was a number one jam
Damn if I say it you can slap me right here
(Get it) lets get this party started right
Right on, c'mon
What we got to say
Power to the people no delay
To make everybody see
In order to fight the powers that be


(Fight the Power)

1

[jerseyboy72]

Elvis

[russtafa]

this is no comparison michael jackson has no equal. did elvis have 7 top 10 hits on the same album? i think not.
i think MJ must have been the most weird person in show business.A black man that wants to be white and has a monkey as his best friend and wants to sleep with kids and lives in neverland =bloody hell:yayo:

[russtafa]

Prince was far better than MJ,Prince was a far better performer and musician and had better songs

[addicted]

elvis and mj were both garbage

[Helvis2012]

The King

[doctor screw]

This is a lose-lose situation

[onmyknees]

Elvis was a hero to most
But he never meant shit to me you see
Straight up racist that sucker was
Simple and plain
Mother fuck him and John Wayne
Cause I'm Black and I'm proud
I'm ready and hyped plus I'm amped
Most of my heroes don't appear on no stamps
Sample a look back you look and find
Nothing but rednecks for 400 years if you check

Public Enemy - Fight The Power - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8PaoLy7PHwk)


Fight The Power


1989 the number another summer (get down)
Sound of the funky drummer
Music hittin' your heart cause I know you got sould
(Brothers and sisters, hey)
Listen if you're missin' y'all
Swingin' while I'm singin'
Givin' whatcha gettin'
Knowin' what I know
While the Black bands sweatin'
And the rhythm rhymes rollin'
Got to give us what we want
Gotta give us what we need
Our freedom of speech is freedom or death
We got to fight the powers that be
Lemme hear you say
Fight the power


Chorus


As the rhythm designed to bounce
What counts is that the rhymes
Designed to fill your mind
Now that you've realized the prides arrived
We got to pump the stuff to make us tough
from the heart
It's a start, a work of art
To revolutionize make a change nothin's strange
People, people we are the same
No we're not the same
Cause we don't know the game
What we need is awareness, we can't get careless
You say what is this?
My beloved lets get down to business
Mental self defensive fitness
(Yo) bum rush the show
You gotta go for what you know
Make everybody see, in order to fight the powers that be
Lemme hear you say...
Fight the Power


Chorus


Elvis was a hero to most
But he never meant shit to me you see
Straight up racist that sucker was
Simple and plain
Mother fuck him and John Wayne
Cause I'm Black and I'm proud
I'm ready and hyped plus I'm amped
Most of my heroes don't appear on no stamps
Sample a look back you look and find
Nothing but rednecks for 400 years if you check
Don't worry be happy
Was a number one jam
Damn if I say it you can slap me right here
(Get it) lets get this party started right
Right on, c'mon
What we got to say
Power to the people no delay
To make everybody see
In order to fight the powers that be


(Fight the Power)

1



It's a subjective question you fool....not a call to arms.


:fu::fu::fu:

[Helvis2012]

It's a subjective question you fool....not a call to arms.


:fu::fu::fu:


I knew someone would paste those lyrics.

[onmyknees]

I knew someone would paste those lyrics.


And I knew it would be him. lol

[russtafa]

I always liked Alvin Stardust and Garry Glitter who moulded themselves on Elvis

[Dino Velvet]

Hank Sr :Bowdown:

Ramblin Man Hank Williams - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4IqlI91Vj7Y)

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_pND18bdVwXI/TS7G3zU0RvI/AAAAAAAAcyg/HtMMKcecwM0/s1600/Hank%2BWilliams-1.jpg

[maaarc]

I voted for MJ not a big fan but I never really got Elvis
compared to Pearl Jam they both stink :)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AFVlJAi3Cso

[russtafa]

Wynonie Harris was the first real rocker but i doubt most of you in bred's would have ever heard of him or know of his history because you yanks chuck your musical history out like bath water and now our teens are doing the same thing

[brooksglass]

Neither, I prefer The Beatles.