Open Mindedness

[jaycanuck]

A friend sent me this link. It's very interesting and I know a few people in my life who should watch this.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T69TOuqaqXI

[raiku9909]

i like the video, but it probably is only appealing to people who are scientifically minded anyway, sadly.

My family says they "pity" me because I don't have faith in a god, or concede that one definitely exists--and say I'm being closed minded, and cannot accept or understand, no matter how many times i say it to them, that religious faith, by it's definition, is a choice to believe in something that is unbelievable, and, generally, restricts your thinking rather than expanding it. Not saying I'm better than them, but this video makes me smile, but would probably be dismissed by the faithful anyway.

[jaycanuck]

I know people close to me like that too raiku. Discussing elements in the bible were like hitting a brick wall everytime because the other person took that book to be it.....nothing else.

I don't begrudge anyone who wants to believe in religion...but when they want to go toe to toe with me and debate that stuff...that person better have some facts to back it up.

[raiku9909]

zigactly--or at least the common sense to admit it's hard to know who or what is really right or true, when you can't observe all the facts.

[Coroner]

It´s sad that most people show no interest in science, especially the "life sciences", also known as biology. Evolution explains our life and it´s a proven fact since the discovery of DNA and genetics as a scientific discipline. There is no need to believe in a supernatural creator because it´s another cultural phenomenon and contradictory to scientific discoveries and explanations. One cannot place his sentimental feelings and wishes above reason just because he was taught or raised so, or because it´s tradition. Richard Dawkins used to say that "everyone who believes in a god, is a scientific illiterate". I´m sorry but he´s right. I have no problems with folks who believe but I cannot respect the nonsense they believe in. All I can do is to tolerate it because I think that everyone has the right to believe in whatever he wants, which is why a secular society is necessary.
I know it´s not easy for laics to understand science because its impenetrable terminology but that´s why you need to read and enlighten yourself because you have the opportunity. Learn something about your life before you die. The Western societies wouldn´t have advanced if there weren´t people who stood up and told the priests that they´re wrong, otherwise we´d live in some kind of Afghanistan in the West and people would still chase gays or us who admire T-ladies, although there´re still groups who do not tolerate us.

[2009AD]

A friend sent me this link. It's very interesting and I know a few people in my life who should watch this.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T69TOuqaqXI

One of the best threads and links posted on HA. You always struck me as a smart and reasonable guy Jay. Thanks for sharing this.

[jaycanuck]

A friend sent me this link. It's very interesting and I know a few people in my life who should watch this.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T69TOuqaqXI

One of the best threads and links posted on HA. You always struck me as a smart and reasonable guy Jay. Thanks for sharing this.


Thanks for the compliment. I'll remember this link now when I watch FOX news segments. Don't know if this'll help me tolerate Hannity though... lol

[jaycanuck]

Another great clip. found from the same source...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kAIpRRZvnJg

[callahac]

It´s sad that most people show no interest in science, especially the "life sciences", also known as biology. Evolution explains our life and it´s a proven fact since the discovery of DNA and genetics as a scientific discipline. There is no need to believe in a supernatural creator because it´s another cultural phenomenon and contradictory to scientific discoveries and explanations. One cannot place his sentimental feelings and wishes above reason just because he was taught or raised so, or because it´s tradition. Richard Dawkins used to say that "everyone who believes in a god, is a scientific illiterate". I´m sorry but he´s right. I have no problems with folks who believe but I cannot respect the nonsense they believe in. All I can do is to tolerate it because I think that everyone has the right to believe in whatever he wants, which is why a secular society is necessary.
I know it´s not easy for laics to understand science because its impenetrable terminology but that´s why you need to read and enlighten yourself because you have the opportunity. Learn something about your life before you die. The Western societies wouldn´t have advanced if there weren´t people who stood up and told the priests that they´re wrong, otherwise we´d live in some kind of Afghanistan in the West and people would still chase gays or us who admire T-ladies, although there´re still groups who do not tolerate us.

Is evolution a proven fact or just a theory? Still no one has come up with the proven fact about how it, and I mean everything, all began either. All questions to ponder.

[jaycanuck]

Is evolution a proven fact or just a theory? Still no one has come up with the proven fact about how it, and I mean everything, all began either. All questions to ponder.

I'm not religious, I tend to focus on science and fact. I'm also not arrogant enough to explain where all this came from because no one knows. We could be part of an atom of someone's fine china.

I do believe in evolution. I don't think man just popped out of thin air.

[El Nino]

The Origins of the universe itself, shall remain a mystery forever. Anybody who claims to know this, is a crack-pot...

[jaycanuck]

The Origins of the universe itself, shall remain a mystery forever. Anybody who claims to know this, is a crack-pot...

Ok...maybe we're an atom in a crack-pot. lol

[MacShreach]

o understand science because its impenetrable terminology

With all respect Coroner although that is often true, Darwin's "Origin of Species" manages to be at the same time an accessible book and one of the most truly seminal ever written.

[MacShreach]

Is evolution a proven fact or just a theory? .

LOL HA is probably not the place to get into he definition of scientific proof, but the short answer is, yes the theory of evolution is thoroughly proven. This was why the "intelligent design" creationists invented their nonsense-- they simply cannot disprove Darwin. Now you can if you wish posit a super-being who "caused" every step of the evolutionary process to happen, but the very redundancy of such a creature should give you pause.

It is true, again, that we do not know exactly what caused the Universe to come into existence, because we can't observe the other side of the moment of its inception, but suggesting that it was the work of a vaguely andromorphic superbeing just begs the question "How did he/she/it come into existence?" Which is going to be even tougher to explain.

Faith is an irrational belief that does not depend on observable facts. Science isn't.

[Coroner]

It´s sad that most people show no interest in science, especially the "life sciences", also known as biology. Evolution explains our life and it´s a proven fact since the discovery of DNA and genetics as a scientific discipline. There is no need to believe in a supernatural creator because it´s another cultural phenomenon and contradictory to scientific discoveries and explanations. One cannot place his sentimental feelings and wishes above reason just because he was taught or raised so, or because it´s tradition. Richard Dawkins used to say that "everyone who believes in a god, is a scientific illiterate". I´m sorry but he´s right. I have no problems with folks who believe but I cannot respect the nonsense they believe in. All I can do is to tolerate it because I think that everyone has the right to believe in whatever he wants, which is why a secular society is necessary.
I know it´s not easy for laics to understand science because its impenetrable terminology but that´s why you need to read and enlighten yourself because you have the opportunity. Learn something about your life before you die. The Western societies wouldn´t have advanced if there weren´t people who stood up and told the priests that they´re wrong, otherwise we´d live in some kind of Afghanistan in the West and people would still chase gays or us who admire T-ladies, although there´re still groups who do not tolerate us.

Is evolution a proven fact or just a theory? Still no one has come up with the proven fact about how it, and I mean everything, all began either. All questions to ponder.

A fact. You should know that theory has a very different definition in science than in generic use. In biology, theory is what natural laws are in physics and you have to make a difference between hypothesis and theory. Scientific theories are not speculations, vague or ambivalent but insights basing upon empirical facts.
The modern Theory of Evolution is called The Synthetic Theory of Biological Evolution. The discipline responsible for the study of the beginning of life on Earth is Chemical Evolution (emergence of organic molecules from anorganic molecules).

Btw, this is how biologists work:

1. Investigation of living nature and fossils (observation)
2. Description + comparison
3. Experiment + data analysis
4. Facts
5. Hypothesis
6. Theory (final fact)

This process is called induction. Repeated and assured descriptions and experiments provide objective facts and lead you to a hypothesis and finally a theory (fact or natural law).

[Coroner]

o understand science because its impenetrable terminology

With all respect Coroner although that is often true, Darwin's "Origin of Species" manages to be at the same time an accessible book and one of the most truly seminal ever written.

This is true because the scientific vocabulary was much more limited than today. :) I was talking about modern scientific specialist literature which is not simply understandable for people without basic scientific knowledge or interest. It´s not like reading James Hunt´s posts. :lol:

[Coroner]

The Origins of the universe itself, shall remain a mystery forever. Anybody who claims to know this, is a crack-pot...

A crack-pot is anyone who doesn´t want to know.

[El Nino]

exactly!

[GinX]

It´s sad that most people show no interest in science, especially the "life sciences", also known as biology. Evolution explains our life and it´s a proven fact since the discovery of DNA and genetics as a scientific discipline. There is no need to believe in a supernatural creator because it´s another cultural phenomenon and contradictory to scientific discoveries and explanations. One cannot place his sentimental feelings and wishes above reason just because he was taught or raised so, or because it´s tradition. Richard Dawkins used to say that "everyone who believes in a god, is a scientific illiterate". I´m sorry but he´s right. I have no problems with folks who believe but I cannot respect the nonsense they believe in. All I can do is to tolerate it because I think that everyone has the right to believe in whatever he wants, which is why a secular society is necessary.
I know it´s not easy for laics to understand science because its impenetrable terminology but that´s why you need to read and enlighten yourself because you have the opportunity. Learn something about your life before you die. The Western societies wouldn´t have advanced if there weren´t people who stood up and told the priests that they´re wrong, otherwise we´d live in some kind of Afghanistan in the West and people would still chase gays or us who admire T-ladies, although there´re still groups who do not tolerate us.

Is evolution a proven fact or just a theory? Still no one has come up with the proven fact about how it, and I mean everything, all began either. All questions to ponder.

One of the first problems to address is the use of the word 'theory'. Most people tend to think that a theory is an educated supposition. This definition is the most widely used in the common parlance. However, a scientific theory does not fit this definition at all. Any scientific theory is: an explanation of an observed phenomenon, said explanation being supported by facts and corroborative evidence. Thus, asking if something is a fact or "just a theory" makes little sense, since the theory itself is factual.

Further, evolution is an observed process. Many bacteria and viruses are constantly going through evolutionary changes. In addition, two famous experiments-one involving fruit flies, the other pepper moths-demonstrates evolution, specifically the mechanism of adaptation, in action.