Animals and the men who love them / NIGHTMARE THREAD !!!

[mimiplastique]

What do you really think about em' ???

i have been reading alot of threads here recently (as in the last 5 min) and i have noticed that the amount of cross dressers and crossdessing on this forum has increased rapidly over the last few weeks .

does not shock me one bit but just thought i would like to make a point of it seeing how alot of them have OUTRAGEOUS ideas going through their mind at all times .


Please share your thoughts

[melissacarter]

The essential difference between transsexual and crossdresser: it's about the feeling not the clothes. That's why you and me work on changing our bodies to fit our minds while crossdressers spend their energy on clothes, and often, the sexual thrill connected to wearing feminine clothing. For TS it is about identity first not sexuality.

The crossdresser continues to invest a majority of his time & energy, and I emphasize the term his, on their male identity. While crossdressers may identify with feminine expression, they have no intention of truly "crossing over"... that is, they see their feminine role as supplemental to their main male role. Thus it is common for many cd's to lead a double life. But their "true" identity, the role that ultimately defines their character, is their male self.

And because the dominant role of a crossdresser is their male identity, often their feminine identity is expressed secretly, or discreetly. This is antithetical to the transsexual, who goes to great lengths to reveal their feminine identity to all and lead one unifed life, not a double life.

Heres one thing I see crossdressers do a lot online: when they think something's funny they actually write out the word "giggles". Jeez, what woman does that?

[LibertyHarkness]

omg melissa i just realised you are bang on with the "giggles" bit, i was mooching on birchplace chat today, and the amount of CDS/TVS that type "giggles" :)

BTW hope you feel better soon after your ops xx

Libby xx

[nohj68]

I think a guy who can pull it off is very hot. I'm curious about it, but never tried. I would if I had someone to show me the ropes.

[ARMANIXXX]

Lots of guys here like Crossdressers......a little more than 2 out of 3 guys.

*shrug*

[Coroner]

Lots of guys here like Crossdressers......a little more than 2 out of 3 guys.

*shrug*

Yeah, they´re all straight. 8)

[mimiplastique]

LADIES WE HAVE SOME CROSS DRESSERS TO IDENTIFY

[saifan]

Not interested.

[menacingmethods86]

That old Howard Stern in drag Jamie used to put "giggles" in all her replies.

[blckhaze]

Not my cup of tea, but obviously Im in a minority on this one. Something(s) are more important to others than the actual status of the persons they drool over.

[JamesHunt]

Can you reduce the size of your avatar, it takes half my fucking screen up :roll:

[mimiplastique]

Can you reduce the size of your avatar, it takes half my fucking screen up :roll:


um yea right ass who cares ??

[JamesHunt]

Can you reduce the size of your avatar, it takes half my fucking screen up :roll:


um yea right ass who cares ??

Read the fucking rules, dumn bitch!!!

"Only one image can be displayed at a time, its width can be no greater than 200 pixels, the height no greater than 200 pixels, and the file size no more than 24 KB."

[Felicia Katt]

Can you reduce the size of your avatar, it takes half my fucking screen up :roll:
first time a guy here ever wanted something smaller LOL

meow

FK

[cheez]

I just find the whole thing funny. Like 90% of the girls here didn't crossdress first before they started doing hormones, getting surgery, etc...
If someone is just a crossdresser and never plans to get any surgery or doesn't feel like they're in the wrong body then sure it's probably a more valid point.
But how many of the people posting on here does anyone know that well? Should we just presume that because someone hasn't been able to move onto hormones or surgery yet they don't have a similar mindset.
I find it very funny that many crossdressers in Europe are open to sex with "straight" men while crossdressers in the US are often "translesbians"
I mean is it something in the water? Or is it that cultural differences make it harder for certain people to get past certain stereotypes?
I dunno. I just get tired of trying to figure out what makes someone or anyone straight or gay on this board, honestly...

[ARMANIXXX]

I just find the whole thing funny. Like 90% of the girls here didn't crossdress first before they started doing hormones, getting surgery, etc...
If someone is just a crossdresser and never plans to get any surgery or doesn't feel like they're in the wrong body then sure it's probably a more valid point.
But how many of the people posting on here does anyone know that well? Should we just presume that because someone hasn't been able to move onto hormones or surgery yet they don't have a similar mindset.
I find it very funny that many crossdressers in Europe are open to sex with "straight" men while crossdressers in the US are often "translesbians"
I mean is it something in the water? Or is it that cultural differences make it harder for certain people to get past certain stereotypes?
I dunno. I just get tired of trying to figure out what makes someone or anyone straight or gay on this board, honestly...


The bottom line, if you like Crossdressers, those who are women for short periods of time then revert back to men, most likely you are gay.


If that's what you like, then that's what you like.

I'm guessing, but, by the sounds of it, probably you.
*shrug*

[HP1000]

Can you reduce the size of your avatar, it takes half my fucking screen up :roll:

He's right, it shows your tight silver dress with a 7 inch bulge/tent pointed at your girlfriend? OMG

[tsntx]

Can you reduce the size of your avatar, it takes half my fucking screen up :roll:

He's right, it shows your tight silver dress with a 7 inch bulge/tent pointed at your girlfriend? OMG


haha it actually does look like that if u look at it

[Thatiger23]

i really dont have any input for this thread yet except to say HI TO MIMI AND JENN and DAMN MIMI YOU LOOK AMAZING IN THAT DRESS

[DC]

I have no interest in CD's at all and think they should post on a CD forum not here..

[Aurora]

Can you reduce the size of your avatar, it takes half my fucking screen up :roll:

He's right, it shows your tight silver dress with a 7 inch bulge/tent pointed at your girlfriend? OMG

I did not notice that at first :lol:

[cheez]

I just find the whole thing funny. Like 90% of the girls here didn't crossdress first before they started doing hormones, getting surgery, etc...
If someone is just a crossdresser and never plans to get any surgery or doesn't feel like they're in the wrong body then sure it's probably a more valid point.
But how many of the people posting on here does anyone know that well? Should we just presume that because someone hasn't been able to move onto hormones or surgery yet they don't have a similar mindset.
I find it very funny that many crossdressers in Europe are open to sex with "straight" men while crossdressers in the US are often "translesbians"
I mean is it something in the water? Or is it that cultural differences make it harder for certain people to get past certain stereotypes?
I dunno. I just get tired of trying to figure out what makes someone or anyone straight or gay on this board, honestly...


The bottom line, if you like Crossdressers, those who are women for short periods of time then revert back to men, most likely you are gay.


If that's what you like, then that's what you like.

I'm guessing, but, by the sounds of it, probably you.
*shrug*

Now you maintain the point that this is someone who reverts back to being a man and is only a woman for a short period of time.
Well if I'm out to get my dick sucked for ten minutes how the hell would I know how long they maintain their feminine look? is this just part time or full time? I'm at a bar with plenty of pretty faces, I should just ignore the ones who haven't done that much work yet?
Aren't there some TS girls who when first starting out have barely developed any secondary female aspects such as boobs or softer features?
So should I upon seeing a very attractive person in dress and full makeup ask them, "how far along are you, and do you plan to take it further because if you're only part time or it's very early on and your hormones haven't kicked in then this is really gay..."
Really, who asks that?
I just honestly can't even explain how stupid I find that idea.
Look I remember seeing Kelly Shore years ago on some t-fan website-- PHAT and at that point, she was not too far along. I also remember seeing Danielle Foxxx early on when she was called Gamma Burn or Gemma Burn or something and didn't have much surgery or even at all.
So I would've been gay to have had sex with these very feminine eventual transgenders early in their transformation, but say three years later when they had a few more procedures I wouldn't be. even though they are the same person inside, right? The same woman who by genetic quirk was born in the wrong body. Even Allanah who I believe has said she started out as a person in drag and was likely very feminine even before any chemical or surgical changes would make me "gay" if I'd dallied with her early in her change according to this standard because I don't know how long or what their mindset is because I'm just trying to get my dick sucked.
Again, sorry I just find it really stupid.

[melissacarter]

I don't know how long or what their mindset is because I'm just trying to get my dick sucked.
Again, sorry I just find it really stupid.

To the gentleman who finds himself in an establishment with the sole purpose of "having his dick sucked":

who is really the stupid one?

[TsVanessa69]

Why the fuck did my name have to be brought up in another one of your bullshit hater threads. There is nothing wrong with crossdressers. To each his own. Live and let live! People are so worried about what the other person does, but if that person is happy, then so be it. Crossdressers don't complain about loud, obnoxios, hateful people like you, so leave them alone!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! There was no reason for my name to even be posted in any of you smut.

[TsVanessa69]

I just find the whole thing funny. Like 90% of the girls here didn't crossdress first before they started doing hormones, getting surgery, etc...
If someone is just a crossdresser and never plans to get any surgery or doesn't feel like they're in the wrong body then sure it's probably a more valid point.
But how many of the people posting on here does anyone know that well? Should we just presume that because someone hasn't been able to move onto hormones or surgery yet they don't have a similar mindset.
I find it very funny that many crossdressers in Europe are open to sex with "straight" men while crossdressers in the US are often "translesbians"
I mean is it something in the water? Or is it that cultural differences make it harder for certain people to get past certain stereotypes?
I dunno. I just get tired of trying to figure out what makes someone or anyone straight or gay on this board, honestly...
Its lack of self esteem and making others look bad to make yourself feel better. The TG umberella covers all gender variant people. Its sad that the person who started this thread is assumed to be transgenderd.

[melissacarter]

Here comes them pictures...oy vey

[Justawannabe]

I'm surprised Melissa, he made a good point and you bypass it completely to smack him for the disparaging tone.

In the grab 'gay or not gay' debates he brings up a good point, or frankly two.

First point, perception on the part of the 'guy' should have some impact on whether what he's doing is 'gay' or not. I guy who gets sucked off by a very passable young CD, particularly if he doesn't know, could hardly be called gay. So why would it matter if she was on hormones or not, or had surgery or not? He's clearly attracted to a very feminine person in that case, and if it doesn't get down to genital revelation (this does happen sadly) how different is it from getting oral from a flat chested genetically female gymnast?

Second point, and the better one, is that a lot of girls figure themselves out over time. They crossdress, they experiment with a purely gay identity, they try to just be the 'arty' guy... and work their way winding down the lane to a trans identity. Denigrating folks on that path as being less than a 'real transsexual' is just dumb... and frankly pretty short sighted.

Lots of folks talk about how hard it is to be trans, and how much courage it takes. I agree on all of that, but are we making it any easier with this attitude to figure out if you ARE trans? How many girls out there hide in a part time life, not because they shouldn't trans, but because they never see a trans they would want to be? How many are scared and alone because they feel that not only would the straight world be threatening, but the alternative world as well?

I understand that a lot of girls use this as a litmus test, if the girl isn't willing to be hounded and hated by everyone around her she isn't trans, but I find that standard poor at best. A lot like the standard applied for a while by the surgeons and other gatekeepers... if you weren't likely to be passable they said you must just be mistaken about your identity.

In many cases the 'sane' response of any girl who can get at least temporary relief is to deal with the gnawing issues and stay in the dominant hetro society, maintaining social, familial and career contacts. A lot like gay life prior to the gay rights movement. Hide who you are to get by, and live for those few moments you get to be yourself. Why? Because you won't be threatened, starved or abandoned if you do it carefully.

Just saying not only the courageous are trans... the courageous just get better surgery and more attention.

Sean

[Justawannabe]

Which is not to say that the CD's who do it badly aren't annoying as hell... 'giggles' my ass! As bad as the one I know who does the valley girl/bubble headed blond crap... makes you want to strangle them, or at least send them to finishing school.

Maybe that's what I'll do when the family money comes my way... endow a school for the trans on how to not act like a twit while figuring out your identity.

And yeah I'm still grouchy... but got good news... Mom's antibiotics worked! Yay for Mom!

Sean

[melissacarter]

I'm surprised Melissa, he made a good point and you bypass it completely to smack him for the disparaging tone.

In the grab 'gay or not gay' debates he brings up a good point, or frankly two.

First point, perception on the part of the 'guy' should have some impact on whether what he's doing is 'gay' or not. I guy who gets sucked off by a very passable young CD, particularly if he doesn't know, could hardly be called gay. So why would it matter if she was on hormones or not, or had surgery or not? He's clearly attracted to a very feminine person in that case, and if it doesn't get down to genital revelation (this does happen sadly) how different is it from getting oral from a flat chested genetically female gymnast?

Second point, and the better one, is that a lot of girls figure themselves out over time. They crossdress, they experiment with a purely gay identity, they try to just be the 'arty' guy... and work their way winding down the lane to a trans identity. Denigrating folks on that path as being less than a 'real transsexual' is just dumb... and frankly pretty short sighted.

Lots of folks talk about how hard it is to be trans, and how much courage it takes. I agree on all of that, but are we making it any easier with this attitude to figure out if you ARE trans? How many girls out there hide in a part time life, not because they shouldn't trans, but because they never see a trans they would want to be? How many are scared and alone because they feel that not only would the straight world be threatening, but the alternative world as well?

I understand that a lot of girls use this as a litmus test, if the girl isn't willing to be hounded and hated by everyone around her she isn't trans, but I find that standard poor at best. A lot like the standard applied for a while by the surgeons and other gatekeepers... if you weren't likely to be passable they said you must just be mistaken about your identity.

In many cases the 'sane' response of any girl who can get at least temporary relief is to deal with the gnawing issues and stay in the dominant hetro society, maintaining social, familial and career contacts. A lot like gay life prior to the gay rights movement. Hide who you are to get by, and live for those few moments you get to be yourself. Why? Because you won't be threatened, starved or abandoned if you do it carefully.

Just saying not only the courageous are trans... the courageous just get better surgery and more attention.

Sean

Sean,

with all due respect, and I do like you Sean, any points worth making were nullified by the concept he put forth that transgender folk at a bar are some kind of "blowjob buffet" to pick from. And he goes on in self-righteous fashion to further point out that a blowjob by a beginner is every bit as good as a blowjob by a full-fledged tranny surgery and all. And of course, who are we to argue, we are merely the blowjob-givers and he in all his majesty, is the man who walked into this establishment, seeking a sucking, entitled to liplock, we are mere pleasure-givers to his fancy. Who are we to judge ourselves as to how far any of us have come, when the main goal as we all know, is to suck his Royal Highness to completion???

[cheez]

I don't know how long or what their mindset is because I'm just trying to get my dick sucked.
Again, sorry I just find it really stupid.

To the gentleman who finds himself in an establishment with the sole purpose of "having his dick sucked":

who is really the stupid one?

first of all 90% of men going out to TS, straight, gay or whatever bars are looking to get their dick sucked.
That's it. Do I really have to make this point?
Second, er weren't you a member of mandingo t-girls or some other yahoo sex group which was devoted to being fucked by guys without much commitment? You didnt have tits back then either. Guess it would have made me gay to get my dick sucked...
People are allowed to make their own choices. If my choice when I go out is be totally shallow and get my dick sucked, then why is that stupid?

[cheez]

I'm surprised Melissa, he made a good point and you bypass it completely to smack him for the disparaging tone.

In the grab 'gay or not gay' debates he brings up a good point, or frankly two.

First point, perception on the part of the 'guy' should have some impact on whether what he's doing is 'gay' or not. I guy who gets sucked off by a very passable young CD, particularly if he doesn't know, could hardly be called gay. So why would it matter if she was on hormones or not, or had surgery or not? He's clearly attracted to a very feminine person in that case, and if it doesn't get down to genital revelation (this does happen sadly) how different is it from getting oral from a flat chested genetically female gymnast?

Second point, and the better one, is that a lot of girls figure themselves out over time. They crossdress, they experiment with a purely gay identity, they try to just be the 'arty' guy... and work their way winding down the lane to a trans identity. Denigrating folks on that path as being less than a 'real transsexual' is just dumb... and frankly pretty short sighted.

Lots of folks talk about how hard it is to be trans, and how much courage it takes. I agree on all of that, but are we making it any easier with this attitude to figure out if you ARE trans? How many girls out there hide in a part time life, not because they shouldn't trans, but because they never see a trans they would want to be? How many are scared and alone because they feel that not only would the straight world be threatening, but the alternative world as well?

I understand that a lot of girls use this as a litmus test, if the girl isn't willing to be hounded and hated by everyone around her she isn't trans, but I find that standard poor at best. A lot like the standard applied for a while by the surgeons and other gatekeepers... if you weren't likely to be passable they said you must just be mistaken about your identity.

In many cases the 'sane' response of any girl who can get at least temporary relief is to deal with the gnawing issues and stay in the dominant hetro society, maintaining social, familial and career contacts. A lot like gay life prior to the gay rights movement. Hide who you are to get by, and live for those few moments you get to be yourself. Why? Because you won't be threatened, starved or abandoned if you do it carefully.

Just saying not only the courageous are trans... the courageous just get better surgery and more attention.

Sean

Sean,

with all due respect, and I do like you Sean, any points worth making were nullified by the concept he put forth that transgender folk at a bar are some kind of "blowjob buffet" to pick from. And he goes on in self-righteous fashion to further point out that a blowjob by a beginner is every bit as good as a blowjob by a full-fledged tranny surgery and all. And of course, who are we to argue, we are merely the blowjob-givers and he in all his majesty, is the man who walked into this establishment, seeking a sucking, entitled to liplock, we are mere pleasure-givers to his fancy. Who are we to judge ourselves as to how far any of us have come, when the main goal as we all know, is to suck his Royal Highness to completion???

Oh man. someone's high horse is getting ridiculous...
I remember you walking around nowhere bar and flashing your ass and getting drunk and grabbing crotches.
I guess acting slutty is ok, but me just wanting a blowjob when i go out with no commitment is a mortal sin...
yawn.

[MrShow52]

Can you reduce the size of your avatar, it takes half my fucking screen up :roll:


um yea right ass who cares ??

can you remove your avatar mimi, you look like a man in it.

[melissacarter]

I'm surprised Melissa, he made a good point and you bypass it completely to smack him for the disparaging tone.

In the grab 'gay or not gay' debates he brings up a good point, or frankly two.

First point, perception on the part of the 'guy' should have some impact on whether what he's doing is 'gay' or not. I guy who gets sucked off by a very passable young CD, particularly if he doesn't know, could hardly be called gay. So why would it matter if she was on hormones or not, or had surgery or not? He's clearly attracted to a very feminine person in that case, and if it doesn't get down to genital revelation (this does happen sadly) how different is it from getting oral from a flat chested genetically female gymnast?

Second point, and the better one, is that a lot of girls figure themselves out over time. They crossdress, they experiment with a purely gay identity, they try to just be the 'arty' guy... and work their way winding down the lane to a trans identity. Denigrating folks on that path as being less than a 'real transsexual' is just dumb... and frankly pretty short sighted.

Lots of folks talk about how hard it is to be trans, and how much courage it takes. I agree on all of that, but are we making it any easier with this attitude to figure out if you ARE trans? How many girls out there hide in a part time life, not because they shouldn't trans, but because they never see a trans they would want to be? How many are scared and alone because they feel that not only would the straight world be threatening, but the alternative world as well?

I understand that a lot of girls use this as a litmus test, if the girl isn't willing to be hounded and hated by everyone around her she isn't trans, but I find that standard poor at best. A lot like the standard applied for a while by the surgeons and other gatekeepers... if you weren't likely to be passable they said you must just be mistaken about your identity.

In many cases the 'sane' response of any girl who can get at least temporary relief is to deal with the gnawing issues and stay in the dominant hetro society, maintaining social, familial and career contacts. A lot like gay life prior to the gay rights movement. Hide who you are to get by, and live for those few moments you get to be yourself. Why? Because you won't be threatened, starved or abandoned if you do it carefully.

Just saying not only the courageous are trans... the courageous just get better surgery and more attention.

Sean

Sean,

with all due respect, and I do like you Sean, any points worth making were nullified by the concept he put forth that transgender folk at a bar are some kind of "blowjob buffet" to pick from. And he goes on in self-righteous fashion to further point out that a blowjob by a beginner is every bit as good as a blowjob by a full-fledged tranny surgery and all. And of course, who are we to argue, we are merely the blowjob-givers and he in all his majesty, is the man who walked into this establishment, seeking a sucking, entitled to liplock, we are mere pleasure-givers to his fancy. Who are we to judge ourselves as to how far any of us have come, when the main goal as we all know, is to suck his Royal Highness to completion???

Oh man. someone's high horse is getting ridiculous...
I remember you walking around nowhere bar and flashing your ass and getting drunk and grabbing crotches.
I guess acting slutty is ok, but me just wanting a blowjob when i go out with no commitment is a mortal sin...
yawn.

Now that I know you're one of those losers hanging at Nowhere that really explains everything.

[cheez]

I'm surprised Melissa, he made a good point and you bypass it completely to smack him for the disparaging tone.

In the grab 'gay or not gay' debates he brings up a good point, or frankly two.

First point, perception on the part of the 'guy' should have some impact on whether what he's doing is 'gay' or not. I guy who gets sucked off by a very passable young CD, particularly if he doesn't know, could hardly be called gay. So why would it matter if she was on hormones or not, or had surgery or not? He's clearly attracted to a very feminine person in that case, and if it doesn't get down to genital revelation (this does happen sadly) how different is it from getting oral from a flat chested genetically female gymnast?

Second point, and the better one, is that a lot of girls figure themselves out over time. They crossdress, they experiment with a purely gay identity, they try to just be the 'arty' guy... and work their way winding down the lane to a trans identity. Denigrating folks on that path as being less than a 'real transsexual' is just dumb... and frankly pretty short sighted.

Lots of folks talk about how hard it is to be trans, and how much courage it takes. I agree on all of that, but are we making it any easier with this attitude to figure out if you ARE trans? How many girls out there hide in a part time life, not because they shouldn't trans, but because they never see a trans they would want to be? How many are scared and alone because they feel that not only would the straight world be threatening, but the alternative world as well?

I understand that a lot of girls use this as a litmus test, if the girl isn't willing to be hounded and hated by everyone around her she isn't trans, but I find that standard poor at best. A lot like the standard applied for a while by the surgeons and other gatekeepers... if you weren't likely to be passable they said you must just be mistaken about your identity.

In many cases the 'sane' response of any girl who can get at least temporary relief is to deal with the gnawing issues and stay in the dominant hetro society, maintaining social, familial and career contacts. A lot like gay life prior to the gay rights movement. Hide who you are to get by, and live for those few moments you get to be yourself. Why? Because you won't be threatened, starved or abandoned if you do it carefully.

Just saying not only the courageous are trans... the courageous just get better surgery and more attention.

Sean

Sean,

with all due respect, and I do like you Sean, any points worth making were nullified by the concept he put forth that transgender folk at a bar are some kind of "blowjob buffet" to pick from. And he goes on in self-righteous fashion to further point out that a blowjob by a beginner is every bit as good as a blowjob by a full-fledged tranny surgery and all. And of course, who are we to argue, we are merely the blowjob-givers and he in all his majesty, is the man who walked into this establishment, seeking a sucking, entitled to liplock, we are mere pleasure-givers to his fancy. Who are we to judge ourselves as to how far any of us have come, when the main goal as we all know, is to suck his Royal Highness to completion???

Oh man. someone's high horse is getting ridiculous...
I remember you walking around nowhere bar and flashing your ass and getting drunk and grabbing crotches.
I guess acting slutty is ok, but me just wanting a blowjob when i go out with no commitment is a mortal sin...
yawn.

Now that I know you're one of those losers hanging at Nowhere that really explains everything.

Um you were there too. Doesn't that make you a loser? And I notice you didn't disagree that you were acting slutty.
I only went two times. Found it boring and only kinda liked it the first time because they had two GG girls (lesbians I guess) pillow fighting
man some people get uppity when they get tits...

[cheez]

I'm surprised Melissa, he made a good point and you bypass it completely to smack him for the disparaging tone.

In the grab 'gay or not gay' debates he brings up a good point, or frankly two.

First point, perception on the part of the 'guy' should have some impact on whether what he's doing is 'gay' or not. I guy who gets sucked off by a very passable young CD, particularly if he doesn't know, could hardly be called gay. So why would it matter if she was on hormones or not, or had surgery or not? He's clearly attracted to a very feminine person in that case, and if it doesn't get down to genital revelation (this does happen sadly) how different is it from getting oral from a flat chested genetically female gymnast?

Second point, and the better one, is that a lot of girls figure themselves out over time. They crossdress, they experiment with a purely gay identity, they try to just be the 'arty' guy... and work their way winding down the lane to a trans identity. Denigrating folks on that path as being less than a 'real transsexual' is just dumb... and frankly pretty short sighted.

Lots of folks talk about how hard it is to be trans, and how much courage it takes. I agree on all of that, but are we making it any easier with this attitude to figure out if you ARE trans? How many girls out there hide in a part time life, not because they shouldn't trans, but because they never see a trans they would want to be? How many are scared and alone because they feel that not only would the straight world be threatening, but the alternative world as well?

I understand that a lot of girls use this as a litmus test, if the girl isn't willing to be hounded and hated by everyone around her she isn't trans, but I find that standard poor at best. A lot like the standard applied for a while by the surgeons and other gatekeepers... if you weren't likely to be passable they said you must just be mistaken about your identity.

In many cases the 'sane' response of any girl who can get at least temporary relief is to deal with the gnawing issues and stay in the dominant hetro society, maintaining social, familial and career contacts. A lot like gay life prior to the gay rights movement. Hide who you are to get by, and live for those few moments you get to be yourself. Why? Because you won't be threatened, starved or abandoned if you do it carefully.

Just saying not only the courageous are trans... the courageous just get better surgery and more attention.

Sean

Thanks, dude. I understand not everyone in the world is not like me out for no strings sex from women no matter what their parts may be, but I explained myself honestly and you got my gist without judging it (and perhaps honed it to a finer point for those with delicate mindsets).
Much appreciated...

[cheez]

delete. double post...

[Tika]

Melissa, why is it that you can condemn someone for wanting a blowjob when you're a sex provider for pay? Is it that he's looking for it for free at a bar versus paying for professional services?

I'm going to call extreme hypocrisy here. T-girls functioning as whores reduce themselves to "merely the blowjob-givers" and being "mere pleasure-givers to his fancy".

Any last shred of intellectual credibility you might have had has vanished like an Arizona frost. Feel free to rant and froth as usual, while ignoring any valid content or criticism of your obviously wobbly "moral" stance.

[SarahG]

The essential difference between transsexual and crossdresser: it's about the feeling not the clothes. That's why you and me work on changing our bodies to fit our minds while crossdressers spend their energy on clothes, and often, the sexual thrill connected to wearing feminine clothing. For TS it is about identity first not sexuality.

Correction: You mean "The essential difference between a transsexual and a transvestite..."

I know it might come off as semantics, but it really isn't. "crossdresser" is just a meaningless slang term, you're not going to find it in the medical books because it simply doesn't exist. It's not a real term, just some PC bullshit alternative to transvestite (since I guess TV's don't like the word "transvestite" and wanted something else to use).

There's nothing wrong with coming up with a new term, god knows I prefer using the term GID over TS- but if we're going to use CD as an alternative term for TV, then we really can't be using CD as a word for "anyone who isn't fulltime or transitioning yet"

Otherwise I agree with your post entirely.

Which brings me to this point:


I just find the whole thing funny. Like 90% of the girls here didn't crossdress first before they started doing hormones, getting surgery, etc...

Except that's entirely wrong, TS and TV are two vastly different medical conditions, hence why they're not even near each other in the DSM. I highly doubt most TS girls start off "wearing clothes of the opposite sex as a sexual fetish" before they transition.

TS girls may often have a period of being part-time, before they go full-time, but that doesn't make them TV's or CD's IMHO.

I realize what complicates the matter is that its hard to consider someone TS, if they haven't even started to transition yet... and some TV's do go on HRT despite not having GID. Some TVs may pass better than some people with GID, which I think is also a source of confusion for some people as well.

But what it boils down to is; is the person in question transitioning as some kind of fetish, or are they transitioning because of body dysphoria (that is to say: because they believe their body is physically incorrect/wrong)?

Now I'll agree some girls don't find out about GID/TS until after finding out about CD/TV's (this makes sense, there are so many more TV's out there)... but that doesn't mean the individual in question was a TV first. In order for them to have been a TV, they'd have had to find CDing to be some kind of sexual fetish. What would be more typical, is someone finds out about GID/TS from TVs and then goes "ah ha, so that's why I never felt like these TV's do, because I'm not and never was a TV."

I am not saying "CDing as a sexual fetish" is a bad thing. There are all kinds of fetishes out there (fuck, look at some of the odd stuff that's been posted on this board over the years, how many people actually enjoyed the anal prolapse thread?), and yet it seems the only people who jump down my throat when I point out that these are two different medical conditions, are TV's who don't want it to be thought of as a sexual fetish -perhaps because they think that somehow invalidates them or embarrasses them or whatever else. I don't doubt that the general public are going to have a harder time accepting odd fetishes than identity disorders, which might be the reason behind the tension. TV's don't want the hostility generated from proliferating the FACT that there is a sexual component to their situation, and people with GID don't want the general public to think TV & TS is the same (aka the stereotype of all TG people being "45 year old guys putting on hose to jerk off").

[Alyssa87]

hey Sarah, that was pretty effin genius.
thanks.

[tsntx]

yeah sarah hit it

i also agree that just bc a true ts was part time in the beginning doesnt mean she was ever "a gay man" or a "crossdresser"

it means she was born male and corrected the problem when she could

theres a huge difference between some guy that doesnt have the balls or desire to be a woman so he does it when ppl arent looking and a woman trapped in a mans body who goes to extreme lengths to make her outter match her inner

anyone that sees both as one and the same is a fag in my book looking to justify his own faggotry

[drock]

I don't like cross dressers and have zero intrest in them at all!!!

[Alyssa87]

anyone that sees both as one and the same is a fag in my book looking to justify his own faggotry

i didnt see that coming before i read it.lmao

[SarahG]

hey Sarah, that was pretty effin genius.
thanks.

Thanks, it has been one of my pet peaves for quite awhile. It gets tiring to have people continuously think the two things are the same. They're not.

Most of the situations under that big "transgender" umbrella term have absolutely nothing in common outside of the people that would do them harm. It's like grouping TG into LGB groups. There is strength in numbers (SOMETIMES- people are also dumber in groups), but that doesn't mean all its members are the same.

[Alyssa87]

hey Sarah, that was pretty effin genius.
thanks.

Thanks, it has been one of my pet peaves for quite awhile. It gets tiring to have people continuously think the two things are the same. They're not.

Most of the situations under that big "transgender" umbrella term have absolutely nothing in common outside of the people that would do them harm. It's like grouping TG into LGB groups. There is strength in numbers (SOMETIMES- people are also dumber in groups), but that doesn't mean all its members are the same.

no, not by a longshot!
Thats one of the main reasons i dont talk to people about my T.
Even though id like to educate them, when they make comments like
'oh, well my uncle is gay' or 'my hairdresser does dragshows'- i just want to mush their fucking faces and walk away.

[cheez]

The essential difference between transsexual and crossdresser: it's about the feeling not the clothes. That's why you and me work on changing our bodies to fit our minds while crossdressers spend their energy on clothes, and often, the sexual thrill connected to wearing feminine clothing. For TS it is about identity first not sexuality.

Correction: You mean "The essential difference between a transsexual and a transvestite..."

I know it might come off as semantics, but it really isn't. "crossdresser" is just a meaningless slang term, you're not going to find it in the medical books because it simply doesn't exist. It's not a real term, just some PC bullshit alternative to transvestite (since I guess TV's don't like the word "transvestite" and wanted something else to use).

There's nothing wrong with coming up with a new term, god knows I prefer using the term GID over TS- but if we're going to use CD as an alternative term for TV, then we really can't be using CD as a word for "anyone who isn't fulltime or transitioning yet"

Otherwise I agree with your post entirely.

Which brings me to this point:


I just find the whole thing funny. Like 90% of the girls here didn't crossdress first before they started doing hormones, getting surgery, etc...

Except that's entirely wrong, TS and TV are two vastly different medical conditions, hence why they're not even near each other in the DSM. I highly doubt most TS girls start off "wearing clothes of the opposite sex as a sexual fetish" before they transition.

TS girls may often have a period of being part-time, before they go full-time, but that doesn't make them TV's or CD's IMHO.

I realize what complicates the matter is that its hard to consider someone TS, if they haven't even started to transition yet... and some TV's do go on HRT despite not having GID. Some TVs may pass better than some people with GID, which I think is also a source of confusion for some people as well.

But what it boils down to is; is the person in question transitioning as some kind of fetish, or are they transitioning because of body dysphoria (that is to say: because they believe their body is physically incorrect/wrong)?

Now I'll agree some girls don't find out about GID/TS until after finding out about CD/TV's (this makes sense, there are so many more TV's out there)... but that doesn't mean the individual in question was a TV first. In order for them to have been a TV, they'd have had to find CDing to be some kind of sexual fetish. What would be more typical, is someone finds out about GID/TS from TVs and then goes "ah ha, so that's why I never felt like these TV's do, because I'm not and never was a TV."

I am not saying "CDing as a sexual fetish" is a bad thing. There are all kinds of fetishes out there (fuck, look at some of the odd stuff that's been posted on this board over the years, how many people actually enjoyed the anal prolapse thread?), and yet it seems the only people who jump down my throat when I point out that these are two different medical conditions, are TV's who don't want it to be thought of as a sexual fetish -perhaps because they think that somehow invalidates them or embarrasses them or whatever else. I don't doubt that the general public are going to have a harder time accepting odd fetishes than identity disorders, which might be the reason behind the tension. TV's don't want the hostility generated from proliferating the FACT that there is a sexual component to their situation, and people with GID don't want the general public to think TV & TS is the same (aka the stereotype of all TG people being "45 year old guys putting on hose to jerk off").

Ok fantastic, I will admit there's a huge part of this world I have no idea about.
My point is if I'm a regular horny guy who goes out for an evening just to get laid (which straight, gay, druid whatever the fuck you are kinds of people do all the time) and I see someone who looks hot and stunning and we have casual chit chat and we have consensual adult actions, how do i know which of these complex sexual, gender identity issues they're dealing with?
And to be honest I only think I'm wrong is using the term crossdress. I do believe most girls do start trying to bring out their female identity as soon as possible or at least that's what I get from many girls who have been on the web and on TV. Hell Isis from ANTM was on Tyra's talk show the other day talking about how she tricked her mom into letting her wear her clothing.
Why not just ask? I bet fucking dollars to donuts the first TG girl you ask "are you just a crossdresser" will be ready to rip your nuts off.
Oh and thank God tsntx showed up to tell everyone they're fags. I needed to set my clock to SOMETHING...

[mimiplastique]

i really dont have any input for this thread yet except to say HI TO MIMI AND JENN and DAMN MIMI YOU LOOK AMAZING IN THAT DRESS

THANK YOU BABY

[mimiplastique]

I FIND IT SOOO FUCKING FUNNY VANESSA HAS TO COME IN THE THREAD JUST LIKE A MOTH TO A FLAME


FUCK ME FUCK ME FUCK ME

THAT BITCH IS UGLY STUPID AND PREDICTABLE

WHAT A FOOL

IF YALL COULD SEE HOW HARD I AM LAUGHING

JESUS

GET INTO THE ACTION !!!!!

FILM IT !!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[mimiplastique]

I FIND IT SOOO FUCKING FUNNY VANESSA HAS TO COME IN THE THREAD JUST LIKE A MOTH TO A FLAME


FUCK ME FUCK ME FUCK ME

THAT BITCH IS UGLY STUPID AND PREDICTABLE

WHAT A FOOL

IF YALL COULD SEE HOW HARD I AM LAUGHING

JESUS

GET INTO THE ACTION !!!!!

FILM IT !!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[ARMANIXXX]

I just find the whole thing funny. Like 90% of the girls here didn't crossdress first before they started doing hormones, getting surgery, etc...
If someone is just a crossdresser and never plans to get any surgery or doesn't feel like they're in the wrong body then sure it's probably a more valid point.
But how many of the people posting on here does anyone know that well? Should we just presume that because someone hasn't been able to move onto hormones or surgery yet they don't have a similar mindset.
I find it very funny that many crossdressers in Europe are open to sex with "straight" men while crossdressers in the US are often "translesbians"
I mean is it something in the water? Or is it that cultural differences make it harder for certain people to get past certain stereotypes?
I dunno. I just get tired of trying to figure out what makes someone or anyone straight or gay on this board, honestly...


The bottom line, if you like Crossdressers, those who are women for short periods of time then revert back to men, most likely you are gay.


If that's what you like, then that's what you like.

I'm guessing, but, by the sounds of it, probably you.
*shrug*

Now you maintain the point that this is someone who reverts back to being a man and is only a woman for a short period of time.
Well if I'm out to get my dick sucked for ten minutes how the hell would I know how long they maintain their feminine look? is this just part time or full time? I'm at a bar with plenty of pretty faces, I should just ignore the ones who haven't done that much work yet?
Aren't there some TS girls who when first starting out have barely developed any secondary female aspects such as boobs or softer features?
So should I upon seeing a very attractive person in dress and full makeup ask them, "how far along are you, and do you plan to take it further because if you're only part time or it's very early on and your hormones haven't kicked in then this is really gay..."
Really, who asks that?
I just honestly can't even explain how stupid I find that idea.
Look I remember seeing Kelly Shore years ago on some t-fan website-- PHAT and at that point, she was not too far along. I also remember seeing Danielle Foxxx early on when she was called Gamma Burn or Gemma Burn or something and didn't have much surgery or even at all.
So I would've been gay to have had sex with these very feminine eventual transgenders early in their transformation, but say three years later when they had a few more procedures I wouldn't be. even though they are the same person inside, right? The same woman who by genetic quirk was born in the wrong body. Even Allanah who I believe has said she started out as a person in drag and was likely very feminine even before any chemical or surgical changes would make me "gay" if I'd dallied with her early in her change according to this standard because I don't know how long or what their mindset is because I'm just trying to get my dick sucked.
Again, sorry I just find it really stupid.



I think the point has already been addressed, but since you responded to me I'll respond back, simply and quickly.

Lack of tits, surgery, hormones, etc, doesn't make a girl a Crossdresser......it makes her early in transition. If she considers herself a woman 24/7, then she is a TS woman. Whether or not you want to fuck her or not that's your business and totally negotiable for you two.


On the other hand, If said person puts on a wig and a dress, or fake tits and make up, then takes that same shit off and becomes a man, and functions in his daily life as a man, then dude, that person is NOT a TS......that person is a man.

If you choose to fuck that person, fine.....that too is negotiable between you two, but you are fucking a man. You both are gay. That's ok if that's what you like, but please don't try to misalign the 2 in a big mess of double talk.....it's really quite simple.

[drock]

i really dont have any input for this thread yet except to say HI TO MIMI AND JENN and DAMN MIMI YOU LOOK AMAZING IN THAT DRESS

THANK YOU BABY

Is that a hard on you have Mimi? I thought you didn't like other girls?? I guess there's a chance of seeing you doing a lesbian scene with another girl after all???

[ARMANIXXX]

Ok fantastic, I will admit there's a huge part of this world I have no idea about.
My point is if I'm a regular horny guy who goes out for an evening just to get laid (which straight, gay, druid whatever the fuck you are kinds of people do all the time) and I see someone who looks hot and stunning and we have casual chit chat and we have consensual adult actions, how do i know which of these complex sexual, gender identity issues they're dealing with?
And to be honest I only think I'm wrong is using the term crossdress. I do believe most girls do start trying to bring out their female identity as soon as possible or at least that's what I get from many girls who have been on the web and on TV. Hell Isis from ANTM was on Tyra's talk show the other day talking about how she tricked her mom into letting her wear her clothing.
Why not just ask? I bet fucking dollars to donuts the first TG girl you ask "are you just a crossdresser" will be ready to rip your nuts off.
Oh and thank God tsntx showed up to tell everyone they're fags. I needed to set my clock to SOMETHING...


Ok,

I see.

You are having a dilemma on how to address this to the person (hypothetical) in question.

Once again, a very quick and simple solution on what I do.


"Excuse me, I think you are very pretty, but I have just 1 question that I hope you wont mind. Are you fulltime or part time?"


Asking that question will not get you cussed out because it is a very genuine and non offending question, and you'll get the correct answer almost 100% of the time.

Of course, if they tell you they are part time and you reject them because of it, you could get cussed out or scolded at that point......I have. Maybe not you, but it's a risk I'm willing to take. ;)

[cheez]

I just find the whole thing funny. Like 90% of the girls here didn't crossdress first before they started doing hormones, getting surgery, etc...
If someone is just a crossdresser and never plans to get any surgery or doesn't feel like they're in the wrong body then sure it's probably a more valid point.
But how many of the people posting on here does anyone know that well? Should we just presume that because someone hasn't been able to move onto hormones or surgery yet they don't have a similar mindset.
I find it very funny that many crossdressers in Europe are open to sex with "straight" men while crossdressers in the US are often "translesbians"
I mean is it something in the water? Or is it that cultural differences make it harder for certain people to get past certain stereotypes?
I dunno. I just get tired of trying to figure out what makes someone or anyone straight or gay on this board, honestly...


The bottom line, if you like Crossdressers, those who are women for short periods of time then revert back to men, most likely you are gay.


If that's what you like, then that's what you like.

I'm guessing, but, by the sounds of it, probably you.
*shrug*

Now you maintain the point that this is someone who reverts back to being a man and is only a woman for a short period of time.
Well if I'm out to get my dick sucked for ten minutes how the hell would I know how long they maintain their feminine look? is this just part time or full time? I'm at a bar with plenty of pretty faces, I should just ignore the ones who haven't done that much work yet?
Aren't there some TS girls who when first starting out have barely developed any secondary female aspects such as boobs or softer features?
So should I upon seeing a very attractive person in dress and full makeup ask them, "how far along are you, and do you plan to take it further because if you're only part time or it's very early on and your hormones haven't kicked in then this is really gay..."
Really, who asks that?
I just honestly can't even explain how stupid I find that idea.
Look I remember seeing Kelly Shore years ago on some t-fan website-- PHAT and at that point, she was not too far along. I also remember seeing Danielle Foxxx early on when she was called Gamma Burn or Gemma Burn or something and didn't have much surgery or even at all.
So I would've been gay to have had sex with these very feminine eventual transgenders early in their transformation, but say three years later when they had a few more procedures I wouldn't be. even though they are the same person inside, right? The same woman who by genetic quirk was born in the wrong body. Even Allanah who I believe has said she started out as a person in drag and was likely very feminine even before any chemical or surgical changes would make me "gay" if I'd dallied with her early in her change according to this standard because I don't know how long or what their mindset is because I'm just trying to get my dick sucked.
Again, sorry I just find it really stupid.



I think the point has already been addressed, but since you responded to me I'll respond back, simply and quickly.

Lack of tits, surgery, hormones, etc, doesn't make a girl a Crossdresser......it makes her early in transition. If she considers herself a woman 24/7, then she is a TS woman. Whether or not you want to fuck her or not that's your business and totally negotiable for you two.


On the other hand, If said person puts on a wig and a dress, or fake tits and make up, then takes that same shit off and becomes a man, and functions in his daily life as a man, then dude, that person is NOT a TS......that person is a man.

If you choose to fuck that person, fine.....that too is negotiable between you two, but you are fucking a man. You both are gay. That's ok if that's what you like, but please don't try to misalign the 2 in a big mess of double talk.....it's really quite simple.

I swear to God I don't understand this board...
You guys are talking like I'm going to know this person for more than an hour or two.
And just because a girl is part time at one point doesn't mean they'll always be, does it?
Do I know for a fact that the guy in a dress has no plans to transition at some point? Do I know that the girl who has little a-cups isn't just wearing a padded bra?
A point of fact; almost all the girls at t- parties are working the room for customers, which is where I've met the most girls in my city. I've seen many girls over five or six years change from just wearing feminine clothes to getting surgery.
So I guess because I wasn't completely sure five years ago, I would've been gay then, to mess with them, but now it would be "straight?"
Sorry, that's just stupid to me.
How about this, ask most of the rest of the world and they'll say any guy who touches a dick that isn't his, is gay.
That's the real world answer, for the most part. You touch another dick, you're gay. Doesn't matter if it has tits or hormones, you're gay.
So let's just call tsntx and tell her she's right.
Everybody's gay :D

[ARMANIXXX]

I just find the whole thing funny. Like 90% of the girls here didn't crossdress first before they started doing hormones, getting surgery, etc...
If someone is just a crossdresser and never plans to get any surgery or doesn't feel like they're in the wrong body then sure it's probably a more valid point.
But how many of the people posting on here does anyone know that well? Should we just presume that because someone hasn't been able to move onto hormones or surgery yet they don't have a similar mindset.
I find it very funny that many crossdressers in Europe are open to sex with "straight" men while crossdressers in the US are often "translesbians"
I mean is it something in the water? Or is it that cultural differences make it harder for certain people to get past certain stereotypes?
I dunno. I just get tired of trying to figure out what makes someone or anyone straight or gay on this board, honestly...


The bottom line, if you like Crossdressers, those who are women for short periods of time then revert back to men, most likely you are gay.


If that's what you like, then that's what you like.

I'm guessing, but, by the sounds of it, probably you.
*shrug*

Now you maintain the point that this is someone who reverts back to being a man and is only a woman for a short period of time.
Well if I'm out to get my dick sucked for ten minutes how the hell would I know how long they maintain their feminine look? is this just part time or full time? I'm at a bar with plenty of pretty faces, I should just ignore the ones who haven't done that much work yet?
Aren't there some TS girls who when first starting out have barely developed any secondary female aspects such as boobs or softer features?
So should I upon seeing a very attractive person in dress and full makeup ask them, "how far along are you, and do you plan to take it further because if you're only part time or it's very early on and your hormones haven't kicked in then this is really gay..."
Really, who asks that?
I just honestly can't even explain how stupid I find that idea.
Look I remember seeing Kelly Shore years ago on some t-fan website-- PHAT and at that point, she was not too far along. I also remember seeing Danielle Foxxx early on when she was called Gamma Burn or Gemma Burn or something and didn't have much surgery or even at all.
So I would've been gay to have had sex with these very feminine eventual transgenders early in their transformation, but say three years later when they had a few more procedures I wouldn't be. even though they are the same person inside, right? The same woman who by genetic quirk was born in the wrong body. Even Allanah who I believe has said she started out as a person in drag and was likely very feminine even before any chemical or surgical changes would make me "gay" if I'd dallied with her early in her change according to this standard because I don't know how long or what their mindset is because I'm just trying to get my dick sucked.
Again, sorry I just find it really stupid.



I think the point has already been addressed, but since you responded to me I'll respond back, simply and quickly.

Lack of tits, surgery, hormones, etc, doesn't make a girl a Crossdresser......it makes her early in transition. If she considers herself a woman 24/7, then she is a TS woman. Whether or not you want to fuck her or not that's your business and totally negotiable for you two.


On the other hand, If said person puts on a wig and a dress, or fake tits and make up, then takes that same shit off and becomes a man, and functions in his daily life as a man, then dude, that person is NOT a TS......that person is a man.

If you choose to fuck that person, fine.....that too is negotiable between you two, but you are fucking a man. You both are gay. That's ok if that's what you like, but please don't try to misalign the 2 in a big mess of double talk.....it's really quite simple.

I swear to God I don't understand this board...
You guys are talking like I'm going to know this person for more than an hour or two.
How the fuck am I going to know what they're doing with their day life?
Am I going to ask? Because I guarantee I'll offend a TS if I do.
Do I know for a fact that the guy in a dress has no plans to transition at some point? Do I know that the girl who has little a-cups isn't just wearing a padded bra?
A point of fact; almost all the girls at t- parties are working the room for customers, which is where I've met the most girls in my city. I've seen many girls over five or six years change from just wearing feminine clothes to getting surgery.
So I guess because I wasn't completely sure five years ago, I would've been gay then, to mess with them, but now it would be "straight?"
Sorry, that's just stupid to me.
How about this, ask most of the rest of the world and they'll say any guy who touches a dick that isn't his, is gay.
That's the real world answer, for the most part. You touch another dick, you're gay. Doesn't matter if it has tits or hormones, you're gay.
So let's just call tsntx and tell her she's right.
Everybody's gay :D


Gottcha.

I just answered you on the top of this page.

Good luck.

;)

[SarahG]

My point is if I'm a regular horny guy who goes out for an evening just to get laid (which straight, gay, druid whatever the fuck you are kinds of people do all the time) and I see someone who looks hot and stunning and we have casual chit chat and we have consensual adult actions, how do i know which of these complex sexual, gender identity issues they're dealing with?


But then you still don't get it, only a TS girl would be having "gender identity issues."

A TV cannot, by definition, have gender identity issues and still be a TV.

Let's try approaching this from another perspective. Suppose a young actor in a local theatre company is playing a female character (not to pretend to be trans or anything like that, say they were short enough females to do a full accurate cast), and being young- he passes fine in whatever outfit they have him wearing for the show.

This totally nontrans (not TV, not CD, not TS) actor- simply wearing the outfit for a job, then goes across the street to get a cup of coffee between acts. You're in line, you see him- think he's hot, and start hitting on him.

Does this make you gay? Well, probably not by itself... If he was by coincidence gay (well, it wouldn't be THAT big of a coincidence, we are talking about a theatre company LOL) and sucked you off on his way back to work across the street, if he passed well enough you'd never even know anything was off/wrong. This is just my opinion speaking here, but if you then met him behind stage, found out he was a totally 100% nontrans gay guy who was simply wearing that outfit & makeup for the week's run of a show, didn't think anything of the situation- then wanted a relationship of some kind (even if its a fuckbuddy thing) with him, then yes I would really have to question your orientation.

That gay guy from the theatre company is a guy, always was a guy, and always will be a guy. Even if he is willing to wear a skirt for you in bed, you wouldn't be able to expect anything more than a gay relationship from it.

But the bottom line is just because someone can pass as a girl, doesn't mean they are one. Most kids up until a few years into puberty can pass as either sex just by changing their hairstyle & clothing


I do believe most girls do start trying to bring out their female identity as soon as possible or at least that's what I get from many girls who have been on the web and on TV.

Which just goes to show someone who is TS, is TS from the start. They don't "become TS" by CDing or being a TV.



"are you just a crossdresser" will be ready to rip your nuts off.

Because, as I said in my other post- there is a real reason why TS people don't want to be thought of as TV's. Why do you think TV and CD are thrown around as insults by girls even on this board? Because its not only saying "you're a sick fetishist pervert" (with whatever stereotypical images of unpassable middle aged men in hose jerking off) but also "you're not even a girl." Its a way to tare someone down multiple ways at once, attacking everything from the core of their existence to their exterior appearance in one word.

[tsbrenda]

Matt to Krista
http://vids.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=vids.individual&VideoID=8619332

video austinangels sold by glamour boutique.
http://www.glamourboutique.com/access/makeup/index.html




http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0wJN2sWKuww

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QC0MHPquJcI&feature=related


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v8yDq65QIvk


I think a guy who can pull it off is very hot. I'm curious about it, but never tried. I would if I had someone to show me the ropes.

[melissacarter]

Melissa, why is it that you can condemn someone for wanting a blowjob when you're a sex provider for pay? Is it that he's looking for it for free at a bar versus paying for professional services?

I'm going to call extreme hypocrisy here. T-girls functioning as whores reduce themselves to "merely the blowjob-givers" and being "mere pleasure-givers to his fancy".

Any last shred of intellectual credibility you might have had has vanished like an Arizona frost. Feel free to rant and froth as usual, while ignoring any valid content or criticism of your obviously wobbly "moral" stance.

I wasn't condemning Mr, Cheez for wanting a blowjob it was the assumption and implication on his part that trans-folk were not only available for suck-services but that was our main function. That's how he views us. That's the purpose we serve in his deranged mind.

As for you Tika the anonymous, I quite enjoy your little snips and thank you so much for the head space you rent me free of charge. What the fuck do you look like anyway?

[melissacarter]

hey Sarah, that was pretty effin genius.
thanks.

Thanks, it has been one of my pet peaves for quite awhile. It gets tiring to have people continuously think the two things are the same. They're not.

Most of the situations under that big "transgender" umbrella term have absolutely nothing in common outside of the people that would do them harm. It's like grouping TG into LGB groups. There is strength in numbers (SOMETIMES- people are also dumber in groups), but that doesn't mean all its members are the same.

Thank you for clarifying a point I've been making for a long time. Transgender is not, and never will be a faction or off-shoot of the gay community. I never understood the LGB connection and always believed we need to leave the T off. I said as much over a year ago on my blog when the ENDA bill was coming for vote:

http://blog.360.yahoo.com/blog-pWCghCk5dLIBoxhfLZc4HBdZ7rkQ6Mh0NA--?cq=1&p=406

"The TS population is done a disservice in being grouped with the GLB community because ultimately the general public will get a skewed impression of us. Of our core identity and what we're about. We are not about sexual orientation. We are about identity. "

We will sacrifice our rights and individuality if we ride the coattails of the GLB. We will be viewed as gay men with tits. And this is not an altogether inappropriate subject within the topic of corssdressers. Because ultimately, at least from my experience, the sexual fetishistic interest most transvestites possess are a kind of disguised homosexuality. It is much closer to man-on-man relations than a man and a transsexual, which is arguably closer to a heterosexual experience.

[SarahG]

hey Sarah, that was pretty effin genius.
thanks.

Thanks, it has been one of my pet peaves for quite awhile. It gets tiring to have people continuously think the two things are the same. They're not.

Most of the situations under that big "transgender" umbrella term have absolutely nothing in common outside of the people that would do them harm. It's like grouping TG into LGB groups. There is strength in numbers (SOMETIMES- people are also dumber in groups), but that doesn't mean all its members are the same.

Thank you for clarifying a point I've been making for a long time. Transgender is not, and never will be a faction or off-shoot of the gay community. I never understood the LGB connection and always believed we need to leave the T off. I said as much over a year ago on my blog when the ENDA bill was coming for vote:

http://blog.360.yahoo.com/blog-pWCghCk5dLIBoxhfLZc4HBdZ7rkQ6Mh0NA--?cq=1&p=406

"The TS population is done a disservice in being grouped with the GLB community because ultimately the general public will get a skewed impression of us. Of our core identity and what we're about. We are not about sexual orientation. We are about identity. "

We will sacrifice our rights and individuality if we ride the coattails of the GLB. We will be viewed as gay men with tits. And this is not an altogether inappropriate subject within the topic of corssdressers. Because ultimately, at least from my experience, the sexual fetishistic interest most transvestites possess are a kind of disguised homosexuality. It is much closer to man-on-man relations than a man and a transsexual, which is arguably closer to a heterosexual experience.

ENDA was not the first time HRC sold us down the river.

ENDA wasn't even the first time HRC sold us down the river on a piece of federal legislation.

The more things change, the more they stay the same.

[melissacarter]

Sarah, I'd like your thoughts on my last point, that oft more than not, the sexual fetishistic interest most transvestites possess are a kind of disguised homosexuality. And that if we want to get all category-crazy one could argue that the difference between TS and TV is so vast the TS sit deeper in "hetero" territory while TV's sit closer to the "homo" side of town.

[cheez]

My point is if I'm a regular horny guy who goes out for an evening just to get laid (which straight, gay, druid whatever the fuck you are kinds of people do all the time) and I see someone who looks hot and stunning and we have casual chit chat and we have consensual adult actions, how do i know which of these complex sexual, gender identity issues they're dealing with?


But then you still don't get it, only a TS girl would be having "gender identity issues."

A TV cannot, by definition, have gender identity issues and still be a TV.

Let's try approaching this from another perspective. Suppose a young actor in a local theatre company is playing a female character (not to pretend to be trans or anything like that, say they were short enough females to do a full accurate cast), and being young- he passes fine in whatever outfit they have him wearing for the show.

This totally nontrans (not TV, not CD, not TS) actor- simply wearing the outfit for a job, then goes across the street to get a cup of coffee between acts. You're in line, you see him- think he's hot, and start hitting on him.

Does this make you gay? Well, probably not by itself... If he was by coincidence gay (well, it wouldn't be THAT big of a coincidence, we are talking about a theatre company LOL) and sucked you off on his way back to work across the street, if he passed well enough you'd never even know anything was off/wrong. This is just my opinion speaking here, but if you then met him behind stage, found out he was a totally 100% nontrans gay guy who was simply wearing that outfit & makeup for the week's run of a show, didn't think anything of the situation- then wanted a relationship of some kind (even if its a fuckbuddy thing) with him, then yes I would really have to question your orientation.

That gay guy from the theatre company is a guy, always was a guy, and always will be a guy. Even if he is willing to wear a skirt for you in bed, you wouldn't be able to expect anything more than a gay relationship from it.

But the bottom line is just because someone can pass as a girl, doesn't mean they are one. Most kids up until a few years into puberty can pass as either sex just by changing their hairstyle & clothing


I do believe most girls do start trying to bring out their female identity as soon as possible or at least that's what I get from many girls who have been on the web and on TV.

Which just goes to show someone who is TS, is TS from the start. They don't "become TS" by CDing or being a TV.



"are you just a crossdresser" will be ready to rip your nuts off.

Because, as I said in my other post- there is a real reason why TS people don't want to be thought of as TV's. Why do you think TV and CD are thrown around as insults by girls even on this board? Because its not only saying "you're a sick fetishist pervert" (with whatever stereotypical images of unpassable middle aged men in hose jerking off) but also "you're not even a girl." Its a way to tare someone down multiple ways at once, attacking everything from the core of their existence to their exterior appearance in one word.


I honestly think you guys can't see this from the other side and so you'll keep making the same argument. Most men when they go out are looking for sex. melissa carter can get up in arms all she wants but let her talk to a few GGs and she'll find this isn't really an uncommon thing.
Really.
You guys are looking at this from some sort of more than a few hours thing.
have I ever talked about a relationship?
for one second?
never.
your scenario, the understanding, it doesn't apply to what I'm talking about.
we're talking heat of passion. period.
Look. take one crossdresser and one person having gender issues and is transitioning.
Now let's say the crossdresser looks like Angelina Jolie on a good day and is wearing a short dress killer legs in stockings and fuck me pumps. And TS person is going through transition, has some issues with weight and maybe didn't dress too well for their body shape that day. It's an extreme example but the point is this; most men regardless of their t- attraction will likely be attracted to the more attractive one first.
That's the way the brain works.
And let's face it, 99% of these scenarios are going to occur in places where there are many people like Sunny's parties or Allanah's parties, and not some random occurrence on the street.
So most guys who don't live your lifestyle are going to assume you're all birds of a feather.
Does that concept totally escape you?
We often live in blissful ignorance of your issues and it's rare we understand or know the difference.
It's important to you all because without it I imagine your existence would be even more agonizing, but most men don't care.
I can't make this point emphatically enough.
They're not going to care.
Who looks hottest, that's what matters.
You guys need this distinction, I understand that. You need to understand what drives and how its different and how what makes you tick is a whole part of you that you can't defy.
I however find it ridiculous that you can't allow for the idea there are some girls who can only be part time due to their circumstance (maybe they fathered a child early on and their job and finances don't allow for transition for example; they've put the needs of their child first) or that men don't often understand the difference and because they're not looking for long term don't need to know and that you can try and explain it a million times and call guys fags a million times, but we're always going to be attracted to who looks hottest.
Period.
We're not gonna care who's been dressing part time for three weeks and is a macho guy who works a steamfitter 90% of the time, if he looks hotter than the transgender girl.
I can't pretend to know the sadness some of you go through feeling that life has left you with a body that isn't right for you.
But we're splitting hairs here.
I'm about instant attraction, quick sex (which adults indulge in all the time) and being done with it. And how if you're not really well versed the distinction just doesn't matter.
And this will be likely be my last post on the matter because I know no matter what, you guys can't see the other side of this coin.

[cheez]

Melissa, why is it that you can condemn someone for wanting a blowjob when you're a sex provider for pay? Is it that he's looking for it for free at a bar versus paying for professional services?

I'm going to call extreme hypocrisy here. T-girls functioning as whores reduce themselves to "merely the blowjob-givers" and being "mere pleasure-givers to his fancy".

Any last shred of intellectual credibility you might have had has vanished like an Arizona frost. Feel free to rant and froth as usual, while ignoring any valid content or criticism of your obviously wobbly "moral" stance.

I wasn't condemning Mr, Cheez for wanting a blowjob it was the assumption and implication on his part that trans-folk were not only available for suck-services but that was our main function. That's how he views us. That's the purpose we serve in his deranged mind.

As for you Tika the anonymous, I quite enjoy your little snips and thank you so much for the head space you rent me free of charge. What the fuck do you look like anyway?

Deranged mind?
Says the hooker...
Yeah, you're one to throw stones.
Heaven forbid an adult male admits he's just looking for sex when he goes out...

[SarahG]

Sarah, I'd like your thoughts on my last point, that oft more than not, the sexual fetishistic interest most transvestites possess are a kind of disguised homosexuality. And that if we want to get all category-crazy one could argue that the difference between TS and TV is so vast the TS sit deeper in "hetero" territory while TV's sit closer to the "homo" side of town.

I suppose I do have a few thoughts on the subject...

My first thought is in comparing GID people cross culturally. The United States certainly isn't the most tolerant society for TS people, but it certainly isn't the most intolerant either. I can remember, years ago when I was first coming out to people in my family- there was a case in Ohio (not surprising...) where a family had a trans child who was really young (I do not remember the age, but at the time she was pre-puberty). They wanted to help her transition, and quickly found that in the US it is very very difficult to transition before 18. Even with supportive parents, using doctors, shrinks, clinics and witchdoctors assumes that the only time to transition, is in adulthood. The parents, not being completely clueless idiots, realized this was stupidity and let her transition -anyway-, and were in the process of trying to find a surgeon overseas to do SRS.

The problem was, the kid went to school, and the school upon seeing that the kid was "being forced to be fulltime" and "being forced to transition" (because well, "kids don't know who they are until the first minute after their 18th birthday") reported the parents to child services, who put the kid in foster care- and arrested the parents for child abuse. I do not know what came of the story in the end, but one of my classes at the time did read the article and discuss it.

Regardless the specifics of that case, its part of a broader practice of forcing kids to put off transitioning until adulthood, even when their families are entirely on board with their kids' needs. There is no shortage of stories of kids going DIY in high school, or running away from home to transition, or being kicked out of home for being trans. I would expect this to be worse the less tolerant a given country is towards GID patients.

These run aways, discarded children, and so on then have to survive in a world where they have no GED, didn't finish high school, have no assets, have no families, and where on top of that; employers are generally free to discriminate all they want. Under that environment, people are pushed into "queer culture" because it acts as a safe heaven when nothing else is left. This institutionalizes, or rather... socializes trans individuals, one generation at a time- into queer culture, even when they transition early.

Then you have all the people who thought "putting it off was the only way" and have trouble passing as a result. Even FFS will only go so far, and some people will never fully pass. These people, in dating/finding relationships are also going to be pushed into queer culture, but for different reasons. I am not surprised that a lot of tgirls sleep with tgirls, if they are in situations where no one else (GG or GB) will be in a LTR with them, then it becomes the alternative method of fullfilling that need. I know bi tgirls who will only date other tgirls because they got tired of the bullshit that can happen when their SO outs them, or when their SO's family somehow finds out and makes it a problem.

This all greatly differs from cultures where GID minors can transition early (as in pre-puberty early), particularly in some parts of Northern Europe, Asia etc... these kids, being able to transition early, being able to pass from the start, and not having this atmosphere of intolerance & stigmatization & discrimination, are generally gay no more often than the normal nontrans population (that is to say, not often at all).

Certainly gender & orientation are two different things, but it could be shown that GID patient care & quality of life is related to orientation trends. I am not sure that means "intolerance made them gay"- but I can easily picture someone who is bi, and given enough trouble, only going with the sex that gives them the least drama. I know bi GG's who flat out stopped going out with or having sex with men, that doesn't mean "men turned them into lesbians." Chances were they were already attracted to the same sex, and still aren't gay exclusively- they just don't want the BS.

But if we can agree that TS people are, in a tolerant society, no more or less gay than GG's... well, then the other part of the question is how TV's would compare.

I am not sure how to address that part. Some TV's (but not all) have made claims that their orientation is based on what "mode" they are in. The argument is that when not CDing, they only like girls, and when CDing they either are bi, or only like guys. I wouldn't be able to say as to whether or not that makes them bi, nor would I be able to say whether or not they were bi all along since birth. I wouldn't even be able to say if the "mode based orientation" is in the majority or minority of TV populations.

TVs also have a fundamentally different situation because, societal tolerance aside- they don't have to have anyone know they're a TV. TV's don't have to go and get their names legally changed, they don't have to fight with health care programs for HRT & surgeries, they don't have to convince a shrink with a conflict of interest to write a letter authorizing surgeries, they don't have to fight with the gov over marriage rights, they don't have to fight with the gov about changing BC's, changing ID's. If someone is a TV, you'll never know it when they're out in their normal day to day guymode... so they don't face the same hiring & firing discrimination, don't have to worry about being thrown in jail only to to be cut off from HRT access. Shit its a hugely different scenario to the point where I can't even begin to think about orientation trends or potential relationships between societal tolerance & orientation trends.

Sure discrimination is still there to a point. TV's have to worry about losing their jobs if outted (depending on what their job is), they face having their SO'd divorce them over being TV's, they have to worry about public stigmatization if they go out in public dressed- and although all that is similar & similarly unfortunate, it's still a different situation.

So I guess my answer would be, if I had to subjectively define TV orientation so that it could be compared with typical GID patient orientation- its beyond my ability.

[melissacarter]

Melissa, why is it that you can condemn someone for wanting a blowjob when you're a sex provider for pay? Is it that he's looking for it for free at a bar versus paying for professional services?

I'm going to call extreme hypocrisy here. T-girls functioning as whores reduce themselves to "merely the blowjob-givers" and being "mere pleasure-givers to his fancy".

Any last shred of intellectual credibility you might have had has vanished like an Arizona frost. Feel free to rant and froth as usual, while ignoring any valid content or criticism of your obviously wobbly "moral" stance.

I wasn't condemning Mr, Cheez for wanting a blowjob it was the assumption and implication on his part that trans-folk were not only available for suck-services but that was our main function. That's how he views us. That's the purpose we serve in his deranged mind.

As for you Tika the anonymous, I quite enjoy your little snips and thank you so much for the head space you rent me free of charge. What the fuck do you look like anyway?

Deranged mind?
Says the hooker...
Yeah, you're one to throw stones.
Heaven forbid an adult male admits he's just looking for sex when he goes out...

all you people who dismiss what I say with the "she's a whore" argument, cheap obvious and not valid. Because I turn a trick suddenly my intelligence is nullified? Fuck you, I turn tricks asshole, tricks like you only your too cheap to pay so instead you go to Nowhere Bar, a gay bar I miight add, and get blown by some dude in a dress with a moustache.

[Tika]

Melissa, if you're renting your body for sex, then of course that's your "main function". That's your *job*. Are you not aware of how the dots connect here?

If most transsexuals a man encounters are working as prostitutes, THAT IS HOW MEN WILL TEND TO VIEW ALL TRANSSEXUALS. As I've argued repeatedly and vehemently, and you've just as vehemently denied and shied away from realizing, men views transsexuals as sex objects because the majority are sex workers.

If you want men to treat transsexuals differently, with more respect, as human beings and not blowjob dispensers - perhaps you should stop being a sex worker and do work that garners you and others like you some respect.

And I'm an attractive brunette with blue eyes and shoulder-length hair. Why does my appearance matter in any way for determining the validity of what I post here? Oh wait. This is HungAngels. Even if you look like mashed snake, as long as you have fake tits and put out, you're an intellectual titan.

P.S. As for renting you head-space? Umm, I have no idea what that means. If you think you have any significance to me other than in the few minutes I spend reading these threads, well mwahaha on you.

[TsVanessa69]

Melissa, why is it that you can condemn someone for wanting a blowjob when you're a sex provider for pay? Is it that he's looking for it for free at a bar versus paying for professional services?

I'm going to call extreme hypocrisy here. T-girls functioning as whores reduce themselves to "merely the blowjob-givers" and being "mere pleasure-givers to his fancy".

Any last shred of intellectual credibility you might have had has vanished like an Arizona frost. Feel free to rant and froth as usual, while ignoring any valid content or criticism of your obviously wobbly "moral" stance.
Thank you!!

[melissacarter]

Melissa, if you're renting your body for sex, then of course that's your "main function". That's your *job*. Are you not aware of how the dots connect here?

If most transsexuals a man encounters are working as prostitutes, THAT IS HOW MEN WILL TEND TO VIEW ALL TRANSSEXUALS. As I've argued repeatedly and vehemently, and you've just as vehemently denied and shied away from realizing, men views transsexuals as sex objects because the majority are sex workers.

If you want men to treat transsexuals differently, with more respect, as human beings and not blowjob dispensers - perhaps you should stop being a sex worker and do work that garners you and others like you some respect.

And I'm an attractive brunette with blue eyes and shoulder-length hair. Hi!

P.S. As for renting you head-space? Umm, I have no idea what that means. If you think you have any significance to me other than in the few minutes I spend reading these threads, well mwahaha to you.

Buying Tranny Guide for dummies, are we? That's the most obvious and misguided answer currently circulating. If I make my thousand between 9 and 12 on a Wednesday morning that does NOT define who I am, that defines how I make my money. Then I'm free to do anything I choose, like paint, draw or write, which is much closer to my "main function" as you say. But you wouldn't know that because you of course buy into that simple-minded idea that if I turn a trick that's all I am. Because escorts have no feelings, and our thoughts don't count, right?

And by the way saying you're a brunette with blue eyes doesn't mean jack shit, you are a faceless, nameless nobody and your opinion carries no weight. It's easy to name-call from behind your computer, isn't it?

[melissacarter]

Melissa, why is it that you can condemn someone for wanting a blowjob when you're a sex provider for pay? Is it that he's looking for it for free at a bar versus paying for professional services?

I'm going to call extreme hypocrisy here. T-girls functioning as whores reduce themselves to "merely the blowjob-givers" and being "mere pleasure-givers to his fancy".

Any last shred of intellectual credibility you might have had has vanished like an Arizona frost. Feel free to rant and froth as usual, while ignoring any valid content or criticism of your obviously wobbly "moral" stance.
Thank you!!

you moron she dissed you too, lol

[ARMANIXXX]

Melissa, why is it that you can condemn someone for wanting a blowjob when you're a sex provider for pay? Is it that he's looking for it for free at a bar versus paying for professional services?

I'm going to call extreme hypocrisy here. T-girls functioning as whores reduce themselves to "merely the blowjob-givers" and being "mere pleasure-givers to his fancy".

Any last shred of intellectual credibility you might have had has vanished like an Arizona frost. Feel free to rant and froth as usual, while ignoring any valid content or criticism of your obviously wobbly "moral" stance.
Thank you!!

you moron she dissed you too, lol


At the risk of attracting unwanted internet faces and stares, I do have to admit that there is a sort of hypocrisy in doing sex work, as a TS, and then turning around and complaining that TS's are unfairly viewed as sexual objects.

I'm not hating on the work, but I have to acknowledge the irony.

[Tika]

Ummm, I didn't dis Vanessa. She's not trying to maintain an indefensible moral stance. She hasn't said a word so far. Please don't call her a moron for no reason.

As for what you do for a living defining who you are, typically it doesn't. However, there are some moral complications inherent in certain jobs. "I beat the shit out of pregnant women to earn my pay, but I'm really a sensitive person who like Sartre, cooks Thai food and makes dreamcatchers. How dare you attack me!"

If you can't see the absurdity inherent in trying to maintain the moral high ground in an argument with a man wanting a blowjob at a bar from someone who looks like a woman at the time but might not later, when YOU'RE a sex worker who gives blowjobs to anyone with cash in hand...

And again, will a picture make my arguments more valid? I don't have fake tits and I'm not a whore. Does that mean I'm not allowed to point out the absurdity of your stance in this discussion? Ten bucks says if I post a picture, it turns things into "God you look ugly".

[melissacarter]

Oh I get it because I sell sex I forfeit my right to personal moral preferences. Because I sell sex I can't feel offended by the tone of his implications. Get a grip and then get a profile picture you whispering ghost in the background. If you are a TS, and you haven't shown anyone you're anything more than some guy, you are utterly clueless as to what we deal with.

[TsVanessa69]

Melissa, why is it that you can condemn someone for wanting a blowjob when you're a sex provider for pay? Is it that he's looking for it for free at a bar versus paying for professional services?

I'm going to call extreme hypocrisy here. T-girls functioning as whores reduce themselves to "merely the blowjob-givers" and being "mere pleasure-givers to his fancy".

Any last shred of intellectual credibility you might have had has vanished like an Arizona frost. Feel free to rant and froth as usual, while ignoring any valid content or criticism of your obviously wobbly "moral" stance.

I wasn't condemning Mr, Cheez for wanting a blowjob it was the assumption and implication on his part that trans-folk were not only available for suck-services but that was our main function. That's how he views us. That's the purpose we serve in his deranged mind.

As for you Tika the anonymous, I quite enjoy your little snips and thank you so much for the head space you rent me free of charge. What the fuck do you look like anyway?

Deranged mind?
Says the hooker...
Yeah, you're one to throw stones.
Heaven forbid an adult male admits he's just looking for sex when he goes out...

all you people who dismiss what I say with the "she's a whore" argument, cheap obvious and not valid. Because I turn a trick suddenly my intelligence is nullified? Fuck you, I turn tricks asshole, tricks like you only your too cheap to pay so instead you go to Nowhere Bar, a gay bar I miight add, and get blown by some dude in a dress with a moustache.We dismiss what you say because you are a whore.
With tacky shoes, or barefoot. I thought you lived in a trailer or something. Or maybe you just post bullshit to get attention. :roll: :roll: Maybe all those years on drugs is finally taking its toll on your brain.
Who know? who cares? Its a bullshit thread and you just added to the bullshit with even more bullshit and nobody even gives a fuck, you are a joke. A hot shitty shady mess!

[melissacarter]

Melissa, why is it that you can condemn someone for wanting a blowjob when you're a sex provider for pay? Is it that he's looking for it for free at a bar versus paying for professional services?

I'm going to call extreme hypocrisy here. T-girls functioning as whores reduce themselves to "merely the blowjob-givers" and being "mere pleasure-givers to his fancy".

Any last shred of intellectual credibility you might have had has vanished like an Arizona frost. Feel free to rant and froth as usual, while ignoring any valid content or criticism of your obviously wobbly "moral" stance.



I wasn't condemning Mr, Cheez for wanting a blowjob it was the assumption and implication on his part that trans-folk were not only available for suck-services but that was our main function. That's how he views us. That's the purpose we serve in his deranged mind.

As for you Tika the anonymous, I quite enjoy your little snips and thank you so much for the head space you rent me free of charge. What the fuck do you look like anyway?

Deranged mind?
Says the hooker...
Yeah, you're one to throw stones.
Heaven forbid an adult male admits he's just looking for sex when he goes out...

all you people who dismiss what I say with the "she's a whore" argument, cheap obvious and not valid. Because I turn a trick suddenly my intelligence is nullified? Fuck you, I turn tricks asshole, tricks like you only your too cheap to pay so instead you go to Nowhere Bar, a gay bar I miight add, and get blown by some dude in a dress with a moustache.We dismiss what you say because you are a whore.
With tacky shoes, or barefoot. I thought you lived in a trailer or something. Or maybe you just post bullshit to get attention. :roll: :roll: Maybe all those years on drugs is finally taking its toll on your brain.
Who know? who cares? Its a bullshit thread and you just added to the bullshit with even more bullshit and nobody even gives a fuck, you are a joke. A hot shitty shady mess!

lol, I buried your HIV ass last week, you should stay in your grave.

[Tika]

You owe me ten bucks, Melissa. Make sure it's not sticky. I've dealt with my share of issues, but at least I can invite my family to work.

Your last response to Vanessa shows what a very shallow, mean and awful person you are. That's a goddamn horrid thing to say to anyone. You should be ashamed.

[melissacarter]

You owe me ten bucks, Melissa. Make sure it's not sticky. I've dealt with my share of issues, but at least I can invite my family to work.

Your last response to Vanessa shows what a very shallow, mean and awful person you are. That's a goddamn horrid thing to say to anyone. You should be ashamed.

That's nothing you and your family can suck my dick, we'll start with your mother then work in order of appearance, you can lick me clean. Keep hiding behind that computer, mister.

[tsntx]

So let's just call tsntx and tell her she's right.
Everybody's gay :D

honey i dont need phonecall confirmations.... ive been on this board for like 4/5yrs now

i KNOW yall are fags

lololol :wink:

[tsntx]

Melissa, why is it that you can condemn someone for wanting a blowjob when you're a sex provider for pay? Is it that he's looking for it for free at a bar versus paying for professional services?

I'm going to call extreme hypocrisy here. T-girls functioning as whores reduce themselves to "merely the blowjob-givers" and being "mere pleasure-givers to his fancy".

Any last shred of intellectual credibility you might have had has vanished like an Arizona frost. Feel free to rant and froth as usual, while ignoring any valid content or criticism of your obviously wobbly "moral" stance.
Thank you!!

you moron she dissed you too, lol


At the risk of attracting unwanted internet faces and stares, I do have to admit that there is a sort of hypocrisy in doing sex work, as a TS, and then turning around and complaining that TS's are unfairly viewed as sexual objects.

I'm not hating on the work, but I have to acknowledge the irony.

chicken or the egg, lover

do ts become escorts bc of how they have been treated by men
or
do men only think of ts as escorts bc thats how they assume we choose to be seen?

if more men treated ts as women/humans/people and not discardable vessels of sex then im sure MOST ts escorts would dissapear

[ARMANIXXX]

Melissa, why is it that you can condemn someone for wanting a blowjob when you're a sex provider for pay? Is it that he's looking for it for free at a bar versus paying for professional services?

I'm going to call extreme hypocrisy here. T-girls functioning as whores reduce themselves to "merely the blowjob-givers" and being "mere pleasure-givers to his fancy".

Any last shred of intellectual credibility you might have had has vanished like an Arizona frost. Feel free to rant and froth as usual, while ignoring any valid content or criticism of your obviously wobbly "moral" stance.
Thank you!!

you moron she dissed you too, lol


At the risk of attracting unwanted internet faces and stares, I do have to admit that there is a sort of hypocrisy in doing sex work, as a TS, and then turning around and complaining that TS's are unfairly viewed as sexual objects.

I'm not hating on the work, but I have to acknowledge the irony.

chicken or the egg, lover

do ts become escorts bc of how they have been treated by men
or
do men only think of ts as escorts bc thats how they assume we choose to be seen?

if more men treated ts as women/humans/people and not discardable vessels of sex then im sure MOST ts escorts would dissapear



I don't know....I'm not sure.

I mean, there's many more GG escorts than TS escorts.

So by that account perhaps men treat TS's exactly like they do women.

hmmm....food for thought, perhaps.

[tsntx]

eh not really babe... there may be "more" gg escorts compared to ts listed

but if you look at gg women as a whole and ts women as a whole and then took how many % wise of both groups were escorts, or had been escorts in their life at one point... then that would go back to my point of if men/society were able to interact/ date/ marry/ be friends with ts women the way they can with gg.... the % would prob be equal .... and that would mean a HUGE drop of ts escorts

[mimiplastique]

welcome back MIMI !!!!!!!!!!!

[Thatiger23]

i really dont have any input for this thread yet except to say HI TO MIMI AND JENN and DAMN MIMI YOU LOOK AMAZING IN THAT DRESS

THANK YOU BABY

Anytime beauiful ;)....Atleast you acknowlegded i said hi unlike JENN :P

[tsntx]

i didnt even see!?!?!

i just saw faggotry and man-essa posting more pics of her busted ass mug

the only pic i wanna see of that whore is her MUG SHOT

[Thatiger23]

i didnt even see!?!?!

i just saw faggotry and man-essa posting more pics of her busted ass mug

the only pic i wanna see of that whore is her MUG SHOT

ah ok well HI JENN how are you?

[Odelay]

I swear... we really do need a scoreboard around here to keep track of things. :shock:

I thought Mimi and Vanessa were Chicago friends. Then again, I thought they both hated Brenda, but now it appears that Brenda gets along okay with one or the other (I can't remember which). And when did Melissa jump into this mess? Of course I thought Johnny and Allanah were cool with one another, only to find out that they now pretty much hate each other. Now tsntx...

Wait a minute. Check that. At least tsntx (Jenn) never changes. 8)

Now tsntx and Kelly seem to get along, but I remember when Vicki and Kelly seemed a bit catty with one another. Of course, that's when Vicki was still participating on this board... now she has her own board. And of course Vicki and Danielle seemed like long term buddies in the porn biz, but I sense there was a falling out there. And Danielle! She was persona-non-grata on this board for awhile due to some actions and words but thankfully Hungangels and Danielle kissed and made up and now she's a regular! Lessee... there was some fight btwn Yasmin and Allanah. And Vicki and Wendy were going at it at, at one time. Just when I thought someone like Hara stays above it all, I come across an old thread where she and Seanchai were going at it.

All of this is to say that I'm always confused when I read these threads, but I have to admit to being entertained, too.

And remember, the above list is probably a miniscule fraction of the total drama that has occurred on this board so it goes without saying that I apologize if you were left out. I just don't have enough time in the day or week or year to stay on top of it all.

Happy Holidays!

Odelay

[tsntx]

and i never will change

i say what i want and wats on my mind

i dont censor my opinions out of fear that ppl wont like me, buy my products, or watch my tv show

i take pride in that

[Justawannabe]

Wow this thread ran a long way since I had a chance to look.

melissa - you say cheez (is that right?) lost an validity to his post because he was just out looking for a blowjob and treating TS women poorly, but you then turn around and slam the folks who discount your statements for being a provider. Can't have it both ways, either a persons arguments are valid based on their internal logic and not on the person making them or not.

to various -

We make a point around here in differentiating between people with GID and fetishistic TVs. Both are valid but also not exclusive, as there is also non fetish related cross dressing, usually relieving stress in a non sexual fashion. Just saying be careful lumping folks together.

On folks with GID, there are two real breeds here as well, those who are open about either/both in real life or on the internet. A lot of folks who suffer do so behind a much larger set of barriers, especially older folks before TS became a good way to boost ratings and the most TS's shown on TV or movies were not socially ver adept or ended badly.

Last point, I know that a GID individual was never a 'gay man' and never will be, but the sad reality is many folks who have it, will have adapted that identity for some period of their lives. Even more will have had that identity forced upon them by others, and not had the insight or the strenght of character to confront the error and correct it. Denial is alive and well my friends, and as number of folks have pointed out, it would be so much easier to just be gay.

Sean

[melissacarter]

Fuck GID . The D stands for disorder, which is an insult to any trans woman who stands firmly as a woman and comfortable in her skin. Theres no disorder here, and once again we have guys who think they know how it feels to be a transwoman, when they don't.

I'm so sick of these robots who feel that just because a woman is a sex worker she gives up all rights to morals and can only be viewed as a sex object. Yea, if you view my website then you can read me as a sex object but meet me at a bookstore and you better fucking extend me every courtesy or you will be publicly humiliated.

Jeez, what do I have to do start a Whores are People Too movement?

[TsVanessa69]

You owe me ten bucks, Melissa. Make sure it's not sticky. I've dealt with my share of issues, but at least I can invite my family to work.

Your last response to Vanessa shows what a very shallow, mean and awful person you are. That's a goddamn horrid thing to say to anyone. You should be ashamed.
She's a cheap whore with a drug addiction, her chances of having HIV are much higher than mine. My boyfriend and I both have gotten tested recently so these bullshit comments don't bother me although it is a crime to make such acusations. The queens that try that line is because they have nothing better to come up with. Working in HIV Prevention does not make one HIV positive. And yea I can take my family to work too.
Come on, it's Melissa Carter, what more do I need to say???
Morally bankrupt is the term used to describe her kind.
She's trying so hard to catch up and fit in. She got a late start in her transition, and has turning tricks to fall back on. I wonder what her incalll is? Maybe like $5. She would save alot of money on airfares and hotels by driving her trailer to different trailer parks and truck stops.

[melissacarter]

Hey Vanessa make sure you wipe the cum off your bf's chin.

[Justawannabe]

Melissa, I agree with you that your not any less relevant or a person for being a provider, but, by that same token, you can't disregard relevant points by people who is out looking for a sexual encounter. Not because your a provider, or because they aren't acting shallow, but because it has nothing to do with whether what they have to say is true or not. Don't attack the person, refute the point is all I'm saying.

To be fair to most people out on the town for the night are looking at most people as sex objects, and if they turn out to be more that is a pleasant surprise. It's rare if not unknown for a person across a crowded and loud room to be attracted to someone for their opinions. As a number of girls have told me over the years, if the girl comes up to you, the only thing you can do to screw it up is open you mouth and speak.

And I used GID because another poster used the diagnosis as opposed to TS (Sarah?). I would argue that it is a disorder, but not a mental one. A lot like a heart defect is still a defect. A person still needs medical intervention to live a full life.

Anyway, clearly pissing you off so I'll move on...

Sean

[lahabra1976]

and i never will change

i say what i want and wats on my mind

i dont censor my opinions out of fear that ppl wont like me, buy my products, or watch my tv show

i take pride in that

excellent :)

[SarahG]

Fuck GID . The D stands for disorder, which is an insult to any trans woman who stands firmly as a woman and comfortable in her skin.

I have to disagree. If there is no disorder, then there is no such thing as a "medical treatment" (you can' treat what doesn't exist). And if there is no medical treatment, then there is no justification for HRT & SRS, particularly since both do harm to otherwise functional, healthy tissue.

How is a woman going to, as you put it, feel "comfortable in her skin" without some of those treatments, particularly HRT? I am going to assume most GG's who feel comfortable in their skin, do so without having to worry about large concentrations of testosterone causing:- facial hair growth, muscle mass increases, skeletal abnormalities, hairloss, and facial masculation. If a GG were to not have ovaries, even if there is no T in their system, I will bet they'll still be uncomfortable in their skin when they find that, without that estrogen, they'll never get curves, hips, soft skin, breasts, or puberty.

[Danielle Foxx]

The essential difference between transsexual and crossdresser: it's about the feeling not the clothes. That's why you and me work on changing our bodies to fit our minds while crossdressers spend their energy on clothes, and often, the sexual thrill connected to wearing feminine clothing. For TS it is about identity first not sexuality.

The crossdresser continues to invest a majority of his time & energy, and I emphasize the term his, on their male identity. While crossdressers may identify with feminine expression, they have no intention of truly "crossing over"... that is, they see their feminine role as supplemental to their main male role. Thus it is common for many cd's to lead a double life. But their "true" identity, the role that ultimately defines their character, is their male self.

And because the dominant role of a crossdresser is their male identity, often their feminine identity is expressed secretly, or discreetly. This is antithetical to the transsexual, who goes to great lengths to reveal their feminine identity to all and lead one unifed life, not a double life.

Heres one thing I see crossdressers do a lot online: when they think something's funny they actually write out the word "giggles". Jeez, what woman does that?

I used to scratch my balls, what woman does that?

Giggles...

[melissacarter]

Fuck GID . The D stands for disorder, which is an insult to any trans woman who stands firmly as a woman and comfortable in her skin.

I have to disagree. If there is no disorder, then there is no such thing as a "medical treatment" (you can' treat what doesn't exist). And if there is no medical treatment, then there is no justification for HRT & SRS, particularly since both do harm to otherwise functional, healthy tissue.

How is a woman going to, as you put it, feel "comfortable in her skin" without some of those treatments, particularly HRT? I am going to assume most GG's who feel comfortable in their skin, do so without having to worry about large concentrations of testosterone causing:- facial hair growth, muscle mass increases, skeletal abnormalities, hairloss, and facial masculation. If a GG were to not have ovaries, even if there is no T in their system, I will bet they'll still be uncomfortable in their skin when they find that, without that estrogen, they'll never get curves, hips, soft skin, breasts, or puberty.

That's the biggest lie going

These are not medical corections they're cosmetic choices

[SarahG]

These are not medical corections they're cosmetic choices

Disagree again. It is a medical treatment when doctors give GG's estrogen following the removal of their ovaries (or the onset of menopause).

EDIT/ADDED:

Plus if the patient has gotten an orchi or SRS, going off HRT actually puts their health in direct harm.

It is extremely dangerous to go for extended periods with no sex hormones in the body. In addition to weakening the patient's immune system and putting them at risk for infectious diseases, it causes severe bone loss, meaning hairline cracks in the spine, the patient's teeth will rot out of their mouth (even if they have flawless hygene), if they fall they'll break their hips, possibly leaving the patient immobile- and that's just the obvious stuff.

If you don't think it happens, you'd be incorrect, I know a GG who lost every tooth in her mouth because her GP wasn't keeping her estrogen levels were they should have been- and she was in her early thirties.

[muhmuh]

if more men treated ts as women/humans/people and not discardable vessels of sex then im sure MOST ts escorts would dissapear

i rather doubt that
i remember a pic you posted that pointed out all your surgeries and how much they costed... not that i remember the exact numbers or that ot matter whats important is that it was a lot of money which someone wont have at a young age unless they do a profession which pays very well while requiring no education whatsoever

granted if society by and large were a lot more tolerant and allowed for ts to start hrt before puberty the surgery costs would be reduced to srs... for most anyway

[lahabra1976]

granted if society by and large were a lot more tolerant and allowed for ts to start hrt before puberty the surgery costs would be reduced to srs... for most anyway

Really?

[SarahG]

granted if society by and large were a lot more tolerant and allowed for ts to start hrt before puberty the surgery costs would be reduced to srs... for most anyway

Really?

Of course, if a patient were to go on HRT at say, 12, they'd never have to worry about their voice changing, or getting facial hair, or having their face masculate. All that male stuff is caused by testosterone. No testosterone, no testosterone induced changes to the body.

IIRC the Netherlands health care system will let someone who is trans start hrt a year after the patient's normal puberty start, which can be as young as 12-14.

Only countries that are intolerant force trans kids to wait until adulthood to start hrt.

[lahabra1976]

cool

[lahabra1976]

can she get good size natural looking breast also so no need breast augmentation later?

[SarahG]

can she get good size natural looking breast also so no need breast augmentation later?

If the patient starts early enough AND has everything at the right dosages, yes.

That's an oversimplification, there are other factors like body type, body weight etc. If no GG's in the girl's family reach a B cup, don't expect the girl to end up with D's.

[lahabra1976]

That all sounds pretty sweet thing, I think its a good thing to do. But I wondering how many tgirls would have started that early if given to the chance?

[SarahG]

That all sounds pretty sweet thing, I think its a good thing to do. But I wondering how many tgirls would have started that early if given to the chance?

Probably most of them.

Look at how many start between 18-25 now, that change happened because it became easier to start in that age group.

As soon as the American gender clinics were done away with, people could transition at younger ages- no more spending 20 years trying to talk a bigoted clinic run by asshats to start you on hrt. I've talked to people who worked at those clinics, they believe stupid shit like "it should be illegal for anyone under 30 to go on hrt," and "fulltime means never wearing pants or shorts of any kind again, RLE means skirts and dresses only," and "you're only trans if you only like guys," and so on (you get the idea).

There was a time where the only way to transition with the use of medical doctors in the US, was to go through those clinics OR go diy (and that wasn't much of an option, no internet pharmacies to turn to back then).

[mimiplastique]

I LOVE THIS

OH AND VANESSA IN HER FAVORITE DRE$$ !!!!!!!!

[melissacarter]

These are not medical corections they're cosmetic choices

Disagree again. It is a medical treatment when doctors give GG's estrogen following the removal of their ovaries (or the onset of menopause).

EDIT/ADDED:

Plus if the patient has gotten an orchi or SRS, going off HRT actually puts their health in direct harm.

It is extremely dangerous to go for extended periods with no sex hormones in the body. In addition to weakening the patient's immune system and putting them at risk for infectious diseases, it causes severe bone loss, meaning hairline cracks in the spine, the patient's teeth will rot out of their mouth (even if they have flawless hygene), if they fall they'll break their hips, possibly leaving the patient immobile- and that's just the obvious stuff.

If you don't think it happens, you'd be incorrect, I know a GG who lost every tooth in her mouth because her GP wasn't keeping her estrogen levels were they should have been- and she was in her early thirties.


Thats not what we are talking about. Let's take it back to the original choice of orchi or SRS. It is still a choice not a medical condition. We are talking about a natural born male who feels female, not saying they're a woman trapped in a man's body thats' a fairy tale...but this male, who recognizes he is a male, desires change and makes choices. He doesn't like what he sees in the mirror and decides (chooses) to do HRT, chooses to have body augmentation, chooses to go for FFS. This is not a male who, without these hormone adjustments will lose his teeth or his bones will crack.

These are choices and until TS are accountable for our actions we will be viewed as freaks, who claim to have no control over what we are inside, that this is destiny, that we are really women with a birth defect. It's this medical cop-out that lands us on the Maury show and the Springer show. Keep it up, keep up those excuses and you'll keep up Maury's ratings and you'll keep us out of the mainstream.

No wonder no one takes us seriously or gives us good jobs, if we can't even say we made a conscious choice to switch genders how could we possibly be given a job of great responsibility. If we simply admitted this was a choice to make us happier then maybe we would not be saddled with a medical condition. This is a lifestyle issue not a medical issue.

[lahabra1976]

[
Thats not what we are talking about. Let's take it back to the original choice of orchi or SRS. It is still a choice not a medical condition. We are talking about a natural born male who feels female, not saying they're a woman trapped in a man's body thats' a fairy tale...but this male, who recognizes he is a male, desires change and makes choices. He doesn't like what he sees in the mirror and decides (chooses) to do HRT, chooses to have body augmentation, chooses to go for FFS. This is not a male who, without these hormone adjustments will lose his teeth or his bones will crack.


That sounds reasonable

[garrylobary]

Fuck GID . The D stands for disorder, which is an insult to any trans woman who stands firmly as a woman and comfortable in her skin.

I have to disagree. If there is no disorder, then there is no such thing as a "medical treatment" (you can' treat what doesn't exist). And if there is no medical treatment, then there is no justification for HRT & SRS, particularly since both do harm to otherwise functional, healthy tissue.

How is a woman going to, as you put it, feel "comfortable in her skin" without some of those treatments, particularly HRT? I am going to assume most GG's who feel comfortable in their skin, do so without having to worry about large concentrations of testosterone causing:- facial hair growth, muscle mass increases, skeletal abnormalities, hairloss, and facial masculation. If a GG were to not have ovaries, even if there is no T in their system, I will bet they'll still be uncomfortable in their skin when they find that, without that estrogen, they'll never get curves, hips, soft skin, breasts, or puberty.

That's the biggest lie going

These are not medical corections they're cosmetic choices




At first you just came off as a bitch. Now you just look fucking stupid. Read a book!

[garrylobary]

I LOVE THIS

OH AND VANESSA IN HER FAVORITE DRE$$ !!!!!!!!



Do honestly think that you are better looking than Vanessa in any way? Just because you have a group of sycophants on this board that hang on your every word doesn't change the fact that you look manly as fuck. Shit is gross!



Same with tsnx, calling people fags and shit. Haha some of you transexuals will go to such great lengths to try to assert your worth over others. Then again I would probably be insecure if I looked as fucked up as the lot of you.

[mimiplastique]

YEA RIGHT DARLIN ;)
WHATEVER HELPS YOU LOOK BETTER ON YOUR NEW PHONY ACCOUNT ;)

[melissacarter]

Do honestly think that you are better looking than Vanessa in any way?

LOL You have just ruined your credibility, now leave.

[lahabra1976]

At first you just came off as a bitch. Now you just look fucking stupid. Read a book!

Amazon.com has great deals on books btw, don't go to borders you will pay more.

[SarahG]

Thats not what we are talking about.

It absolutely is what we're talking about.

Menopause is a natural process that ALL gg's will go threw at some point in their lives. HRT is risky for them, just as it is for us- and it is their CHOICE to go on E once menopause starts.

Something CAN be both a CHOICE and a MEDICAL TREATMENT.

So why would a GG want to go on estrogen? Well think about it, its the exact same reason why we do; prevents facial hair growth (how many post menopausal women have you seen with hair on their upper lips?), keeps their skin softer, makes them look better, makes them feel more comfortable- its the exact same set of reasons. The only difference is that none of the reasons they cite are as severe... a post menopausal GG may get facial hair, but they're not going to get a full beard like a GB will under normal, natural circumstances.

Absolutely no one in the medical community, the health care community, or anywhere else for that matter, will argue that "estrogen replacement therapy for post menopausal women isn't a medical treatment." Yet here there is no underlying disorder at all, there certainly is no disease... menopause is a natural process that happens to all girls eventually.

Almost ALL medical treatments are elective. Almost ALL medical treatments are the patient's choice. The only time this isn't the case, is when a medical treatment is needed in order for the patient to live, and even then it is still a choice. People with cancer decide every day in this country whether or not they should CHOOSE to go on chemo, but the bulk of the medical care that goes down in this country, every day (even right now) has nothing to do with eminently saving people's lives, but rather to improve patients' quality of life. Sometimes that is to end nonlethal pain (like an ingrown toe nail), sometimes it is merely to make the patient happier or more comfortable.


No wonder no one takes us seriously or gives us good jobs, if we can't even say we made a conscious choice to switch genders how could we possibly be given a job of great responsibility. If we simply admitted this was a choice to make us happier then maybe we would not be saddled with a medical condition.

This is where medical ethics becomes an issue however. Doctors have an ethical duty, an oath to do no harm. If I walk into a doctor's office and demand they amputate my leg, no way in hell are they going to do that.

But that's basically what we have going on with SRS- a healthy, seemingly normal patient walks into the office and demands their dick & balls get lopped off. Even if the patient is sane, informed, and fully sincere, the doctor ethically and legally cannot then go and cut off your genitals because that would be doing harm! That's why GID is in the medical texts, it empowers surgeons by saying "the patient looks normal & healthy but really they have GID so now it's ok to cut off their genitals"

Do you really, honestly believe job discrimination happens because trans people say its a medical condition & not a choice? Have you ever even heard of an employer saying "well... I was going to hire you, but since you didn't say it was an alternative lifestyle and insist its not a choice, I am going to have to show you where the door is..." That's insane!

And this says nothing of the REAL scientific evidence out there that shows that GID patients really do have brains of the opposite sex. Male and female brains are not identical, there are real subjective, measurable, tangible differences in brain structures & brain operation. You can take someone who is trans, give them a brain scan- and see on the spot "whether or not they have a female brain." This won't be possible if it was just some "fairy tale."

But I am getting off topic here (which is one of my flaws), and I do have to say with honesty, that I don't give a shit about whether or not it is a choice.

The only time someone cares about whether or not it is a choice, is when they go and say "you can't do this [fire, beat, kill, whatever it is] to me, I didn't have a choice here." Even if it is true that there is a medical abnormality here, and that abnormality can be subjectively detected (which it is), it isn't relevant!

If a parent goes and says "you sick pervert, I won't have my kid be a tranny- I am going to kill you", the response shouldn't be "but I didn't have a choice"- the response should be "murder is wrong, you shouldn't be killing someone for this- whether it be a choice or not"!

[mimiplastique]

AMAZING THE POWER OF A FEW WORDS


What do you really think about em' ???

i have been reading alot of threads here recently (as in the last 5 min) and i have noticed that the amount of cross dressers and crossdessing on this forum has increased rapidly over the last few weeks .

does not shock me one bit but just thought i would like to make a point of it seeing how alot of them have OUTRAGEOUS ideas going through their mind at all times .


Please share your thoughts

[lahabra1976]

you really know your stuff thats for sure

[melissacarter]

Thats not what we are talking about.

It absolutely is what we're talking about.

Menopause is a natural process that ALL gg's will go threw at some point in their lives. HRT is risky for them, just as it is for us- and it is their CHOICE to go on E once menopause starts.

Something CAN be both a CHOICE and a MEDICAL TREATMENT.

So why would a GG want to go on estrogen? Well think about it, its the exact same reason why we do; prevents facial hair growth (how many post menopausal women have you seen with hair on their upper lips?), keeps their skin softer, makes them look better, makes them feel more comfortable- its the exact same set of reasons. The only difference is that none of the reasons they cite are as severe... a post menopausal GG may get facial hair, but they're not going to get a full beard like a GB will under normal, natural circumstances.

Absolutely no one in the medical community, the health care community, or anywhere else for that matter, will argue that "estrogen replacement therapy for post menopausal women isn't a medical treatment." Yet here there is no underlying disorder at all, there certainly is no disease... menopause is a natural process that happens to all girls eventually.

Almost ALL medical treatments are elective. Almost ALL medical treatments are the patient's choice. The only time this isn't the case, is when a medical treatment is needed in order for the patient to live, and even then it is still a choice. People with cancer decide every day in this country whether or not they should CHOOSE to go on chemo, but the bulk of the medical care that goes down in this country, every day (even right now) has nothing to do with eminently saving people's lives, but rather to improve patients' quality of life. Sometimes that is to end nonlethal pain (like an ingrown toe nail), sometimes it is merely to make the patient happier or more comfortable.


No wonder no one takes us seriously or gives us good jobs, if we can't even say we made a conscious choice to switch genders how could we possibly be given a job of great responsibility. If we simply admitted this was a choice to make us happier then maybe we would not be saddled with a medical condition.

This is where medical ethics becomes an issue however. Doctors have an ethical duty, an oath to do no harm. If I walk into a doctor's office and demand they amputate my leg, no way in hell are they going to do that.

But that's basically what we have going on with SRS- a healthy, seemingly normal patient walks into the office and demands their dick & balls get lopped off. Even if the patient is sane, informed, and fully sincere, the doctor ethically and legally cannot then go and cut off your genitals because that would be doing harm! That's why GID is in the medical texts, it empowers surgeons by saying "the patient looks normal & healthy but really they have GID so now it's ok to cut off their genitals"

Do you really, honestly believe job discrimination happens because trans people say its a medical condition & not a choice? Have you ever even heard of an employer saying "well... I was going to hire you, but since you didn't say it was an alternative lifestyle and insist its not a choice, I am going to have to show you where the door is..." That's insane!

And this says nothing of the REAL scientific evidence out there that shows that GID patients really do have brains of the opposite sex. Male and female brains are not identical, there are real subjective, measurable, tangible differences in brain structures & brain operation. You can take someone who is trans, give them a brain scan- and see on the spot "whether or not they have a female brain." This won't be possible if it was just some "fairy tale."

But I am getting off topic here (which is one of my flaws), and I do have to say with honesty, that I don't give a shit about whether or not it is a choice.

The only time someone cares about whether or not it is a choice, is when they go and say "you can't do this [fire, beat, kill, whatever it is] to me, I didn't have a choice here." Even if it is true that there is a medical abnormality here, and that abnormality can be subjectively detected (which it is), it isn't relevant!

If a parent goes and says "you sick pervert, I won't have my kid be a tranny- I am going to kill you", the response shouldn't be "but I didn't have a choice"- the response should be "murder is wrong, you shouldn't be killing someone for this- whether it be a choice or not"!

Your problem is substituting opinion for fact when it is only your opinion. You have a hard time differentiating the two.

When I was going through my name and gender change you gave me a big shpeil about how New Jersey requires all kinds of surgeon notes and doctor records and how I can't just use a doctor's letter and get my gender switched. Well, guess what? I got my gender changed to female:

http://www.hungangels.com/board/viewtopic.php?t=37016&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0


NJ vitals and the SSA have both told me that when dealing with their documents (I am talking about NJ vitals, not NJ dmv- I've never had a NJ DL) they require the actual surgical notes/records, WHICH IS MORE THAN JUST A SURGEON'S LETTER. This differs from some states where you can get by with a carefully worded surgeon's letter after an orchi.

So much for your facts.

Everything I said in my previous post stands and nothing you said here counters, only that you are insisting this is medical not a lifestyle choice. Bringing genetic women into the picture does not change the position-these are choices, Sarah, and you cannot get around that.

[blckhaze]

damn did this thread get sidetracked.
Was a a potentially good one to.

[SarahG]

When I was going through my name and gender change you gave me a big shpeil about how New Jersey requires all kinds of surgeon notes and doctor records and how I can't just use a doctor's letter and get my gender switched. Well, guess what? I got my gender changed to female


Which means nothing at all. Hell, any girl who is preop & passable can go into a crowded DMV, walk up to the counter to the underpaid, overworked DMV clerk and say "there's been a mistake, this says male incorrectly" and get a female DL. Yet per the actual policies and regulations and laws, very few states let preops get female DL's.

I know a couple surgeons who do orchi's who will write letters basically saying that the patient's genitals have been modified and therefor the patient should be referred to as female. In most states that will fly as enough to get a female BC, even when when the state CLEARLY only changes BC's for postops.

Just because the law or a policy says one thing, doesn't mean it is being followed. Just because you can go and find a busy civil servant with poor training to issue a female BC, doesn't mean that the clerk did so legally (or did so validly). That doesn't even mean the document would hold up in court if challenged.

But I really don't need to explain that point, I am sure everyone here understands it already. I did talk to the SSA, I also talked to NJ vitals. What I have stated on this board is precisely what they told me... its accuracy would ENTIRELY depend upon the accuracy of these civil servants, aka clerks the whole trans community has known -for years- don't always know what they're doing, and don't always care what they're doing.


..only that you are insisting this is medical not a lifestyle choice.

Really? Because that's not what I said, go re-read my post.

What part of me saying it was a choice confused you?

[lahabra1976]

damn did this thread get sidetracked.
Was a a potentially good one to.

I don't remember the orginal subject

[muhmuh]

Really?

feminine enough?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kim_Petras


You can take someone who is trans, give them a brain scan- and see on the spot "whether or not they have a female brain." This won't be possible if it was just some "fairy tale."

unless there has been a recent major breakthrough which i dont know about that kind of research is still very much inconclusive and no study holds up to basic rigour... in science terms its somewhere between a conjecture and a hypothesis

[SarahG]

unless there has been a recent major breakthrough which i dont know about that kind of research is still very much inconclusive and no study holds up to basic rigour... in science terms its somewhere between a conjecture and a hypothesis

The studies out there, particularly looking at the lymbic nucleus are convincing. The criticism I have seen so far, has not attacked the findings of these studies (which showed that yes, the transsexual patients tended to be typically female in the brain scans), but the size of the sample size.

I am not sure how big of a sample size would be required to satisfy everyone, and I am sure there are trans patient age groups that have not been studied yet in this manner. It would certainly be interesting to see how young transitioners compared to middle aged transitioners compared to even later aged transitioners (believe most surgeons have the cut off age for srs in what, the late 60s?). The other relevant question would be "if these changes are present, are they there naturally there from birth- or are they being caused by experiences over a lifetime, a natural occurring process after birth, or prolonged HRT usage...?"

But the lymbic nucleus studies aren't the only studies that have been done, yes the sample sizes have been small even when looking at other parts of the brain- but just about all trans studies have small sample sizes. IMHO because no one really cares about the science behind transsexuality, and as a niche field its got all those "scientists[?]" like Bailey who won't even bother conducting studies on a good day- and oddly people like him tend to be the only ones to get the press coverage.

Edit-
BTW I believe I have some of these studies and some the articles on these studies on my computer, but I am not sure if posting full text on here would qualify as "fair use" though.

[4ever_ngt]

12 pages..??? are you fukin kidding me..I gave up after page 7..Look a Blk Bi males 2cents..."we all began as something else". & everyones journey is their own. I mean how many women here are post-op..??? less than 1% maybe..??? Yet these same women with dicks have the audacity to pass judgment like gate keepers..sad.It dosent matter what you feel your soul says...At the end of the day you can spend $100K in surgery & be the most beautiful woman this side of Norma Jean but genome dosent lie..XY...So I say get off the Judgment seat..Get off this forum & go outside & smell the gawd dayum roses..make a friend..smoke some weed for all i care...Lifes far too short to be worried bout exential bullshit beyond your control...its hard enough being transgendered as it is.. Live & let Live

[mimiplastique]

12 pages..??? are you fukin kidding me..I gave up after page 7..Look a Blk Bi males 2cents..."we all began as something else". & everyones journey is their own. I mean how many women here are post-op..??? less than 1% maybe..??? Yet these same women with dicks have the audacity to pass judgment like gate keepers..sad.It dosent matter what you feel your soul says...At the end of the day you can spend $100K in surgery & be the most beautiful woman this side of Norma Jean but genome dosent lie..XY...So I say get off the Judgment seat..Get off this forum & go outside & smell the gawd dayum roses..make a friend..smoke some weed for all i care...Lifes far too short to be worried bout exential bullshit beyond your control...its hard enough being transgendered as it is.. Live & let Live

spoken like a true crossdresser .

while i smoke my dro and laugh at this response with my friends

[SarahG]

BTW I believe I have some of these studies and some the articles on these studies on my computer, but I am not sure if posting full text on here would qualify as "fair use" though.

The BSTc related studies are, in some cases, online- so just google it. I am not going to violate TOS by putting fulltexts of articles on here. However they did have a picture of what they're talking about:

It is kinda big (you've been warned).
http://jcem.endojournals.org/content/vol85/issue5/images/large/eg0406564002.jpeg

Basically what you're looking at here is they stained the somatostatin tissue using a kind of dye- so that you can see the structural differences of the somatostatin tissue. The top left is a normal male, the bottom left is a gay male, and then on the opposite side you have a GG and MtF respectfully. As you can see, even gay males have the same sized somatostatin tissue as a normal hetero male, but the MtF's show a somatostatin size significantly smaller, comparable in size & shape to the GG somatostatin tissue shown.

If melissacarter is correct that this is a "fairy tale" and people are saying "its all in their head" to make themselves feel better about themselves , then there should be no difference in somatostatin tissue between equally sized samples of normal hetero males, normal gay males, and MtF's.... but this isn't the case.

This alone doesn't sound like much, but when taken with other studies that (also having small sample sizes) show that; the androgen receptor gene tends to be present in transsexuals uniquely, and that that gene influences the way in which testosterone (and other male sex hormones) works, basically acting somewhat like a intermittent blocker (to oversimply it a bit)- and you can start to draw that there are medical abnormalities going on here. Again, if people are just saying stuff as a justification- then these medical abnormalities would not be feasibly present.

However; none of this is the bigger picture. The individual is still CHOOSING to transition, and the individual is using their medical consensual rights to dictate how and when that transition takes place. Not everyone uses hrt, not everyone gets implants, not everyone gets srs, not everyone gets the same type of SRS... there are many different ways in which this situation can be addressed, regardless whether or not there is a tangible "smoking gun." The bigger picture is that in all the instances where this "it isn't my choice" argument comes up- its where it is being applied erroneously.

Saying "but it isn't my choice" probably isn't going to carry much weight with an attacker, murderer, or intolerant job interviewer... because it doesn't matter. The reason why these things are bad, are not because the victim is trans- but because they are bad no matter who (or what) they're targeting.

If the science proved once and for all (conclusively & definitively) that there were no medical abnormalities at all, and that it is a choice, would that suddenly make it ok to murder someone who is trans (because after all, then the victim would be choosing the life style)? No, not at all. And that's my whole point, and one that was in agreeance with melissacarter's initial argument.

[mimiplastique]

BTW I believe I have some of these studies and some the articles on these studies on my computer, but I am not sure if posting full text on here would qualify as "fair use" though.

The BSTc related studies are, in some cases, online- so just google it. I am not going to violate TOS by putting fulltexts of articles on here. However they did have a picture of what they're talking about:

It is kinda big (you've been warned).
http://jcem.endojournals.org/content/vol85/issue5/images/large/eg0406564002.jpeg

Basically what you're looking at here is they stained the somatostatin tissue using a kind of dye- so that you can see the structural differences of the somatostatin tissue. The top left is a normal male, the bottom left is a gay male, and then on the opposite side you have a GG and MtF respectfully. As you can see, even gay males have the same sized somatostatin tissue as a normal hetero male, but the MtF's show a somatostatin size significantly smaller, comparable in size & shape to the GG somatostatin tissue shown.

If melissacarter is correct that this is a "fairy tale" and people are saying "its all in their head" to make themselves feel better about themselves , then there should be no difference in somatostatin tissue between equally sized samples of normal hetero males, normal gay males, and MtF's.... but this isn't the case.

This alone doesn't sound like much, but when taken with other studies that (also having small sample sizes) show that; the androgen receptor gene tends to be present in transsexuals uniquely, and that that gene influences the way in which testosterone (and other male sex hormones) works, basically acting somewhat like a intermittent blocker (to oversimply it a bit)- and you can start to draw that there are medical abnormalities going on here. Again, if people are just saying stuff as a justification- then these medical abnormalities would not be feasibly present.

However; none of this is the bigger picture. The individual is still CHOOSING to transition, and the individual is using their medical consensual rights to dictate how and when that transition takes place. Not everyone uses hrt, not everyone gets implants, not everyone gets srs, not everyone gets the same type of SRS... there are many different ways in which this situation can be addressed, regardless whether or not there is a tangible "smoking gun." The bigger picture is that in all the instances where this "it isn't my choice" argument comes up- its where it is being applied erroneously.

Saying "but it isn't my choice" probably isn't going to carry much weight with an attacker, murderer, or intolerant job interviewer... because it doesn't matter. The reason why these things are bad, are not because the victim is trans- but because they are bad no matter who (or what) they're targeting.

If the science proved once and for all (conclusively & definitively) that there were no medical abnormalities at all, and that it is a choice, would that suddenly make it ok to murder someone who is trans (because after all, then the victim would be choosing the life style)? No, not at all. And that's my whole point, and one that was in agreeance with melissacarter's initial argument.


GIRL I AM NOT EVEN READING WHAT YOU SAY ... BUT MUCH RESPECT FOR WHAT YOU DO HAVE TO SAY ... BUT I WROTE THIS THREAD TO BE A GAG GET A HUGE RISE AND LAUGH ...
YOU HAVE DEDICATED 2 WHOLE DAYS TO THIS TOPIC ...
ITS REALLY NOT THIS SERIOUS

BUT THANK YOU FOR CONTRIBUTING TO THIS CARRYING ON

[Tiffany Anne]

Heres one thing I see crossdressers do a lot online: when they think something's funny they actually write out the word "giggles". Jeez, what woman does that?

I used to scratch my balls, what woman does that?

Giggles...

And this is why Danielle Foxx rocks...

[muhmuh]

The studies out there, particularly looking at the lymbic nucleus are convincing. The criticism I have seen so far, has not attacked the findings of these studies (which showed that yes, the transsexual patients tended to be typically female in the brain scans), but the size of the sample size.

the only one that i could find is this:
http://jcem.endojournals.org/cgi/content/full/85/5/2034
which obviously fails at rigour with a sample size of only 7
http://jcem.endojournals.org/cgi/content/full/85/5/2034/T1
additionally their error bars are suspiciously small
http://jcem.endojournals.org/content/vol85/issue5/images/large/eg0406564001.jpeg

some the critcism on this study that i came across too long ago to remember where it was claimed that with a large enough sample size of heterosexual women and men the supposed difference begins to diminish somewhat (notice how much their dots are scattered across an overlapping area)

and about your proposed brain scan... i suppose theres a good reason why they disected brains instead of using an mri so using the method to prove to the world youre transsexual somewhat defeats the point of doing so


or prolonged HRT usage...?"

well the study does include one untreated mtf who falls nicely within the female range... not that it means anything with one single sample


you can start to draw that there are medical abnormalities going on here. Again, if people are just saying stuff as a justification- then these medical abnormalities would not be feasibly present.

dont get me wrong im not trying to argue that theres nothing there all im trying to say is dont jump on the next bandwagon because someone tested 5 brains and claims to have found the holy grail of transsexuality


If the science proved once and for all (conclusively & definitively) that there were no medical abnormalities at all, and that it is a choice, would that suddenly make it ok to murder someone who is trans (because after all, then the victim would be choosing the life style)?

dont you disagree with yourself there? you always choose the lifestyle whether or not theres a tangible and causal biological reason for it or not

[TsVanessa69]

12 pages..??? are you fukin kidding me..I gave up after page 7..Look a Blk Bi males 2cents..."we all began as something else". & everyones journey is their own. I mean how many women here are post-op..??? less than 1% maybe..??? Yet these same women with dicks have the audacity to pass judgment like gate keepers..sad.It dosent matter what you feel your soul says...At the end of the day you can spend $100K in surgery & be the most beautiful woman this side of Norma Jean but genome dosent lie..XY...So I say get off the Judgment seat..Get off this forum & go outside & smell the gawd dayum roses..make a friend..smoke some weed for all i care...Lifes far too short to be worried bout exential bullshit beyond your control...its hard enough being transgendered as it is.. Live & let Live
Look at who started this thread and look at the big fool who is making herself look dumber by the post. What was it granny used to say?? Give them enough rope and they hang themselves!

[TsVanessa69]

Do honestly think that you are better looking than Vanessa in any way?

LOL You have just ruined your credibility, now leave.
Now we all know you on your best day, wouldn't look better than me on my worse.

[melissacarter]

Do honestly think that you are better looking than Vanessa in any way?

LOL You have just ruined your credibility, now leave.
Now we all know you on your best day, wouldn't look better than me on my worse.

That's the funniest shit I heard all day you just won't let go you're like a hamster. Tell you what Keenan, I'll put that to an HA vote.

Since you keep comparing yourself to me let them decide. And while we're at it include personality you have none. And then do us all a favor and go away.

[lahabra1976]

[which obviously fails at rigour with a sample size of only 7
http://jcem.endojournals.org/cgi/content/full/85/5/2034/T1


These studies tend to have small sample sizes cause it is hard to find people who meet the criteria and overall and its very costly. I could imagine funding can be difficult cause the government and most people are more interested in other studies dealing with medical science, economics, and the like.

[RangeHova]

I have no attraction to crossdressers or TVs but I do think that they sometimes get a raw deal from TS girls and TS admirers. I understand why a TS would want to distance herself from a TV but in the process it seems a lot of hate is developed and thrown around when these discussions come up.

There are differences between the two but when you get down to it, you don't really know what a person is by a label or by what you see of them from the outside. In going to clubs, I would would see crossdressers occasionally and I had an almost disdain for them until I got to talk to a few. After really talking to some I found out that some who I assumed were TV were in fact TS. They just didn't transition until later in life and some didn't transition at all for a multitude of reasons. Many of them went on to transition. Example, Renee Reyes, she was the big TV on the Atlanta scene who by day lived as a business man. The TS girls shunned her for that reason. Then al of a sudden she got breast, started living as a woman and became accepted by the TS girls.

Many TS girls don't transition until much later in life. I don't think a girl who transitioned in her teens or 20s can relate to a girl like that. And me being an admirer of pretty, passable, femme transwomen makes it hard for me to find anything in someone less attractive and hardened by life as a man. Very few early transitioning TS girls or Ts admirere would be caught dead at a place like the Southern Conference just because of the way we see those types of TS women. And many times the inability to relate or to connect becomes indifference. Because this person is not attractive, not passable, more masculine, a guy like me almost has no reason to take a second to sit down and talk to them. And most of the girls on this group would never relate to the route they took so we sit back and judge them based on the less than pretty outside.

On the flipside, I have know some BEAUTIFUL, passable, fully transitioned, stunning and amazing girls who when you peeled back the emotional layers and really got to know them you would find that they transitioned for such things as attention, drag, balls, on the scene status and celebrity... I find a lot of younger kids (femme boys) coming up are taking the girl route a lot more often. Not to put this girl's business out there but a girl that I know who won Continental, and who is looked up to by many many girls has put it out there that in spite of her beauty, her body and general appearance she never felt like a girl and felt pressured to take her drag further by those around her when she was younger and new on the scene.

There is a girl who has been posted on HA many many hundreds of times that I know who goes back and forth from boy to girl to boy to girl despite her beauty as a woman and her very convincing female body. Anyone in Atlanta and halfway close to the scene knows who I am talking about. Not to say because she goes back and forth that it makes her 'not a TS' but she when she goes into boy mode she repeatedly says that she is a boy and went into being a girl for some combination of reasons that has nothing to do with feeling like she was a TS or that she was a female.

Hell, I dated a girl (a performer) who, again, is highly looked upon in the TS community by girls and guys. I would have never in a million years thought that she didn't grow up dreaming of being a girl, being femme and girly from day one. She tells people that. She tells people that she was the stereotypical TS girl itching to be a girl as soon as life permitted her to be. Well, some messy queen pulled up her early pictures and video where she was a masculine boy dancer (although pretty). I turns out that because she was pretty people talked her into doing drag, which lead to physical tweeks and later her living as a female. It wasn't until she caught religion that she admitted than. She is now back as a girl. Stories like that are common enough that it shows me that I can't judge a book by it pretty or not so pretty cover.

I just don't feel that we can diagnose, judge, or categorize anyone unless we truly know them. That unattractive man in a dress with the bad wig and ugly ill-fitting clothes just might be truly have spent his life feeling that he was a female but didn't have that extra something to do anything about it while that gorgeous, sexy, curvy, big breasted, well dressed and passable girl just might not really be a TS. Being a TS is about what is in your mind and what you feel about yourself. The outer has little to do with it.

[melissacarter]

Do honestly think that you are better looking than Vanessa in any way?

LOL You have just ruined your credibility, now leave.
Now we all know you on your best day, wouldn't look better than me on my worse.

It's just so funny you even make a statement like that, do you realize what a horseface you are? Posting pictures in every thread you can, bad pictures I might add? Posting self-serving pictures of yourself in a dead girl's obituary thread? Do you see how many people on HA not only dislike you but intensely dislike you? I'ts like you went out of your way to piss people off. You and your gay cock-sucking dick hustling boyfriend are persona non-grata, no one likes you no one defends you except maybe yourself under your fake pseudonyms that you post under occasionally.

You are transparent, except for those cinderblock botched titties, which I would have sued the doctor over only we all know that was no doctor that was some silicone snake oil salesman pumpin you up in the back of a fleagbag hotel. You are the poster child of what a TS should never become. You are it, Man-essa, you just cant see it, you are a loser. And yet you speak of yourself like you're the shiznitz. You are some guy working at an HIV program meanwhile you fuck guys in the ass bareback and post it on youtube. Wow what a lady you are.

Here, allow me to post a picture of your wonderful self and save you the trouble. Ladies and gentlemen, here is your HA Clown of the week:

[4ever_ngt]

Oh im sorry Mimi did the whole "Bitch with a dick" comment offend you...because because it wasnt directed at you...well maybe it was..& you took the time to reply to my comment..AAhhh now I feel special (attention Whore)...Look I dont know you.. hell I dont wanna know ya, I come in here maybe once a month & now I remember why...wasted of time & energy & honestly you dont seem like a very creditable human being...so easily baitable its almost pathetic ...I didnt wish you any ill will all I did was speak my mind like a real man..not that you would know......anyway im sorry it is what it is & if you dont accept that well you can always cut off your own dick roll that up and smoke it out ya ass..feel free to use my avatar to the left when ur done

[muhmuh]

These studies tend to have small sample sizes cause it is hard to find people who meet the criteria and overall and its very costly.

well obviously that doesnt relief them from increasing the sample size to produce scientific results... this isnt mythbusters

as an aside its funny how you can tell the study is dutch before you even get to the list of universities it was funded by


I could imagine funding can be difficult cause the government and most people are more interested in other studies dealing with medical science, economics, and the like.

well tbh there are a few more pressing matters to put a brain specialists thought into than gid

[keepingitreal470]

[quote="4ever_ngt"]Oh im sorry Mimi did the whole "Bitch with a dick" comment offend you...because because it wasnt directed at you...well maybe it was..& you took the time to reply to my comment..AAhhh now I feel special (attention Whore)...Look I dont know you.. hell I dont wanna know ya, I come in here maybe once a month & now I remember why...wasted of time & energy & honestly you dont seem like a very creditable human being...so easily baitable its almost pathetic ...I didnt wish you any ill will all I did was speak my mind like a real man..not that you would know......anyway im sorry it is what it is & if you dont accept that well you can always cut off your own dick roll that up and smoke it out ya ass..feel free to use my avatar to the left when ur done quote]HAHAHAHAHAHA LMFAO!!!!!!!!! Major props 4ever! Thats what this board needs. More men that speak like a real man instead of a bunch of ass kissing chasers.

[yodajazz]

I have no attraction to crossdressers or TVs but I do think that they sometimes get a raw deal from TS girls and TS admirers. I understand why a TS would want to distance herself from a TV but in the process it seems a lot of hate is developed and thrown around when these discussions come up.

There are differences between the two but when you get down to it, you don't really know what a person is by a label or by what you see of them from the outside. In going to clubs, I would would see crossdressers occasionally and I had an almost disdain for them until I got to talk to a few. After really talking to some I found out that some who I assumed were TV were in fact TS. They just didn't transition until later in life and some didn't transition at all for a multitude of reasons. Many of them went on to transition. Example, Renee Reyes, she was the big TV on the Atlanta scene who by day lived as a business man. The TS girls shunned her for that reason. Then al of a sudden she got breast, started living as a woman and became accepted by the TS girls.

Many TS girls don't transition until much later in life. I don't think a girl who transitioned in her teens or 20s can relate to a girl like that. And me being an admirer of pretty, passable, femme transwomen makes it hard for me to find anything in someone less attractive and hardened by life as a man. Very few early transitioning TS girls or Ts admirere would be caught dead at a place like the Southern Conference just because of the way we see those types of TS women. And many times the inability to relate or to connect becomes indifference. Because this person is not attractive, not passable, more masculine, a guy like me almost has no reason to take a second to sit down and talk to them. And most of the girls on this group would never relate to the route they took so we sit back and judge them based on the less than pretty outside.

On the flipside, I have know some BEAUTIFUL, passable, fully transitioned, stunning and amazing girls who when you peeled back the emotional layers and really got to know them you would find that they transitioned for such things as attention, drag, balls, on the scene status and celebrity... I find a lot of younger kids (femme boys) coming up are taking the girl route a lot more often. Not to put this girl's business out there but a girl that I know who won Continental, and who is looked up to by many many girls has put it out there that in spite of her beauty, her body and general appearance she never felt like a girl and felt pressured to take her drag further by those around her when she was younger and new on the scene.

There is a girl who has been posted on HA many many hundreds of times that I know who goes back and forth from boy to girl to boy to girl despite her beauty as a woman and her very convincing female body. Anyone in Atlanta and halfway close to the scene knows who I am talking about. Not to say because she goes back and forth that it makes her 'not a TS' but she when she goes into boy mode she repeatedly says that she is a boy and went into being a girl for some combination of reasons that has nothing to do with feeling like she was a TS or that she was a female.

Hell, I dated a girl (a performer) who, again, is highly looked upon in the TS community by girls and guys. I would have never in a million years thought that she didn't grow up dreaming of being a girl, being femme and girly from day one. She tells people that. She tells people that she was the stereotypical TS girl itching to be a girl as soon as life permitted her to be. Well, some messy queen pulled up her early pictures and video where she was a masculine boy dancer (although pretty). I turns out that because she was pretty people talked her into doing drag, which lead to physical tweeks and later her living as a female. It wasn't until she caught religion that she admitted than. She is now back as a girl. Stories like that are common enough that it shows me that I can't judge a book by it pretty or not so pretty cover.

I just don't feel that we can diagnose, judge, or categorize anyone unless we truly know them. That unattractive man in a dress with the bad wig and ugly ill-fitting clothes just might be truly have spent his life feeling that he was a female but didn't have that extra something to do anything about it while that gorgeous, sexy, curvy, big breasted, well dressed and passable girl just might not really be a TS. Being a TS is about what is in your mind and what you feel about yourself. The outer has little to do with it.

Excellent, excellent post RangeHova. I just have a question on the part I put in bold. Did you mean to say 'that' instead of 'than'. And did you mean to say that, "she went back to being a boy"?

This thread was started, to help certain people feel better about themselves by attacking the less fortunate, mainly those who don't as good. But time itself, has a way on working on some people, gg, ts, or tv, and men as well.

And speaking of time, I believe that people's self identity can change over time, and that's ok. Yesterday's drug kinpin, now has a PhD in Sociology. Each was a valid true identity.

One last point is that I look for things that people have in common, although each person is also unique. I take an opposing view tha being a tv is just a milder case of being ts; a milder case of GID, if I can use that term. Some expressed it behind close doors, maybe only as a sexual release. Others feel the need to dress on go out and interact with others, but they revert back to their male role also. I believe that they see their feminine expression as a real part of themselves. Viewing this as part of the same spectrum, ts people, feel so strongly about their sexual identity, they take medical steps to live their identity full time. So this is how I explain what TsVanessa69 referred to earlier, as "the TG umbrella".

I have read tons of ts narritives. For most later transistioners, they expressed the other gender part time, but started to define themselves by saying their opposite gender was more important, until they wanted to live it full time. It is the same thing as a success financial manager, who maybe volunteers working with kids on the weekend, and decides he wants to become an elementary school teacher to be happy. Identity changes over time for those that grow.

RangeHova said; "Being a TS is about what is in your mind and what you feel about yourself." But this can change over time. So the real bottom line is like others like cheez have said: try not to judge other people. In thils case, those 'other people' you are judging are some of your biggest supporters.

[mimiplastique]

Do honestly think that you are better looking than Vanessa in any way?

LOL You have just ruined your credibility, now leave.
Now we all know you on your best day, wouldn't look better than me on my worse.

It's just so funny you even make a statement like that, do you realize what a horseface you are? Posting pictures in every thread you can, bad pictures I might add? Posting self-serving pictures of yourself in a dead girl's obituary thread? Do you see how many people on HA not only dislike you but intensely dislike you? I'ts like you went out of your way to piss people off. You and your gay cock-sucking dick hustling boyfriend are persona non-grata, no one likes you no one defends you except maybe yourself under your fake pseudonyms that you post under occasionally.

You are transparent, except for those cinderblock botched titties, which I would have sued the doctor over only we all know that was no doctor that was some silicone snake oil salesman pumpin you up in the back of a fleagbag hotel. You are the poster child of what a TS should never become. You are it, Man-essa, you just cant see it, you are a loser. And yet you speak of yourself like you're the shiznitz. You are some guy working at an HIV program meanwhile you fuck guys in the ass bareback and post it on youtube. Wow what a lady you are.

Here, allow me to post a picture of your wonderful self and save you the trouble. Ladies and gentlemen, here is your HA Clown of the week:


READ FISH ]

[mimiplastique]

Oh im sorry Mimi did the whole "Bitch with a dick" comment offend you...because because it wasnt directed at you...well maybe it was..& you took the time to reply to my comment..AAhhh now I feel special (attention Whore)...Look I dont know you.. hell I dont wanna know ya, I come in here maybe once a month & now I remember why...wasted of time & energy & honestly you dont seem like a very creditable human being...so easily baitable its almost pathetic ...I didnt wish you any ill will all I did was speak my mind like a real man..not that you would know......anyway im sorry it is what it is & if you dont accept that well you can always cut off your own dick roll that up and smoke it out ya ass..feel free to use my avatar to the left when ur done

HUH WHO THE FUCK ARE YOU ????


BWAHAHHAHAHAHAHAH THE FACT YOU ACTUALLY THINK I READ WHAT YOU WROTE KILLS ME
I MADE 1000 TODAY
ONE MAN 20 MIN

WHO CARES WHAT YOUR 'REAL MAN ' ASS HAD TO SAY
CAUSE AT THE END OF THE DAY
MY DICK IS JUST A BIG AS THE ONE IN YOUR AVATAR AND YOU MEAN NOTHING

BUT THANK YOU FOR CONTRIBUTING TO THE HATERATION .


DON'T FLATTER YOURSELF

I PLANNED THIS WHOLE THREAD FLAWLESSLY
I OWN IT EVEN YOU FAGGOT


GIGGLES

TTYN

[Tika]

Someone still owes me ten bucks for this devolving into attacks on personal appearance. You know who you are. I don't post a picture because I'm secure in my looks. I'm not some shallow attention whore that has a million pictures in my gallery, videos, you name it. Frothing at the mouth while you call me a man means nothing to me. Getting mad and coating your monitor with impotent rage spittle while you type nastygrams amuses me to no end.

As for botched tit jobs, Melissa... I'm pretty sure your nipples are supposed to point the same way. Tell Jésus the med student that when you go for your followup.

P.S. If you think Vanessa looks awful, you're insane. Seriously, tear the pictures of Natalie Wood off all your mirrors and see the real you, it's... not as pretty.

[Floyd R]

I'm in a bad mood and want to pick a fight with someone. Should i fuck with Mimi, Melissa, Vanessa, Sarah, or Jessica? Who should I verbally beat up today?

[lahabra1976]

:smh

[keepingitreal470]

Oh im sorry Mimi did the whole "Bitch with a dick" comment offend you...because because it wasnt directed at you...well maybe it was..& you took the time to reply to my comment..AAhhh now I feel special (attention Whore)...Look I dont know you.. hell I dont wanna know ya, I come in here maybe once a month & now I remember why...wasted of time & energy & honestly you dont seem like a very creditable human being...so easily baitable its almost pathetic ...I didnt wish you any ill will all I did was speak my mind like a real man..not that you would know......anyway im sorry it is what it is & if you dont accept that well you can always cut off your own dick roll that up and smoke it out ya ass..feel free to use my avatar to the left when ur done

HUH WHO THE FUCK ARE YOU ????


BWAHAHHAHAHAHAHAH THE FACT YOU ACTUALLY THINK I READ WHAT YOU WROTE KILLS ME
I MADE 1000 TODAY
ONE MAN 20 MIN

WHO CARES WHAT YOUR 'REAL MAN ' ASS HAD TO SAY
CAUSE AT THE END OF THE DAY
MY DICK IS JUST A BIG AS THE ONE IN YOUR AVATAR AND YOU MEAN NOTHING

BUT THANK YOU FOR CONTRIBUTING TO THE HATERATION .


DON'T FLATTER YOURSELF

I PLANNED THIS WHOLE THREAD FLAWLESSLY
I OWN IT EVEN YOU FAGGOT


GIGGLES

TTYNUmmm, I know for a fact your dick isnt as big as my friend(the girl in my avatar). You probably lie to dates and tell them that shit like most girls do. And I seriously doubt you know what to do with it. One guy paid you a G huh? Well theres desperate suckers everywhere. There is no IQ test for people that have money. Some just dont know where to spend it. Or who to spend it on.

[DL_NL]

I MADE 1000 TODAY
ONE MAN 20 MIN

1. "'There's a sucker born every minute" - P.T. Barnum
2. Great, now you can buy a new keyboard with working caps lock.

[melissacarter]

Someone still owes me ten bucks for this devolving into attacks on personal appearance. You know who you are. I don't post a picture because I'm secure in my looks. I'm not some shallow attention whore that has a million pictures in my gallery, videos, you name it. Frothing at the mouth while you call me a man means nothing to me. Getting mad and coating your monitor with impotent rage spittle while you type nastygrams amuses me to no end.

As for botched tit jobs, Melissa... I'm pretty sure your nipples are supposed to point the same way. Tell Jésus the med student that when you go for your followup.

P.S. If you think Vanessa looks awful, you're insane. Seriously, tear the pictures of Natalie Wood off all your mirrors and see the real you, it's... not as pretty.

I own you punk and thanks for clearly reading so much about me. I'm pretty live with that lol you on the other hand are anonymous. People like me live with it you in contrast are a nobody. Now get back to the drive thru

[mimiplastique]

I MADE 1000 TODAY
ONE MAN 20 MIN

1. "'There's a sucker born every minute" - P.T. Barnum
2. Great, now you can buy a new keyboard with working caps lock.


thanks your advice is not needed because my Boyfriend bought me a computer( laptop ) for my birthday ! so no need for a new computer ! I own three !

as for a sucker

i consider anyone who pays for sex a sucker and please quote me !


and as for the remark made about my dick

you thirsty ass cock craver you won't get a picture of it out of me


but three pics are availbe for purchase @ www.niteflirt.com/tink

thanks in advance you FAT SLOPPY NO GOOD ASS TRICK !!!!!

[garrylobary]

I MADE 1000 TODAY
ONE MAN 20 MIN

1. "'There's a sucker born every minute" - P.T. Barnum
2. Great, now you can buy a new keyboard with working caps lock.


thanks your advice is not needed because my Boyfriend bought me a computer( laptop ) for my birthday ! so no need for a new computer ! I own three !

as for a sucker

i consider anyone who pays for sex a sucker and please quote me !

i have said this before to men and they continue to pay for MY TIME
fag


youre boyfriend is the sucker. (and a huge fag)



by the way, ru paul called. he wants his jawline back nigga

[mimiplastique]

bwahahahahhahahahahaha


reina you will always look like the walking dead to me

i slay
you in every aspect of the word

[keepingitreal470]

I MADE 1000 TODAY
ONE MAN 20 MIN

1. "'There's a sucker born every minute" - P.T. Barnum
2. Great, now you can buy a new keyboard with working caps lock.


thanks your advice is not needed because my Boyfriend bought me a computer( laptop ) for my birthday ! so no need for a new computer ! I own three !

as for a sucker

i consider anyone who pays for sex a sucker and please quote me !


and as for the remark made about my dick

you thirsty ass cock craver you won't get a picture of it out of me


but three pics are availbe for purchase @ www.niteflirt.com/tink

thanks in advance you FAT SLOPPY NO GOOD ASS TRICK !!!!!No thanks. I dont need to see pics of your pencil dick. And I really didnt need to see a pic of the three teen age faggots either. What are they like 12? You can tell a lot about a person by the company they keep. What were you guys doing in the pic, watching Seasame Street?

[mimiplastique]

I MADE 1000 TODAY
ONE MAN 20 MIN

1. "'There's a sucker born every minute" - P.T. Barnum
2. Great, now you can buy a new keyboard with working caps lock.


thanks your advice is not needed because my Boyfriend bought me a computer( laptop ) for my birthday ! so no need for a new computer ! I own three !

as for a sucker

i consider anyone who pays for sex a sucker and please quote me !


and as for the remark made about my dick

you thirsty ass cock craver you won't get a picture of it out of me


but three pics are availbe for purchase @ www.niteflirt.com/tink

thanks in advance you FAT SLOPPY NO GOOD ASS TRICK !!!!!No thanks. I dont need to see pics of your pencil dick. And I really didnt need to see a pic of the three teen age faggots either. What are they like 12? You can tell a lot about a person by the company they keep. What were you guys doing in the pic, watching Seasame Street?



LMAO

[TsVanessa69]

bwahahahahhahahahahaha


reina you will always look like the walking dead to me

i slay
you in every aspect of the word
Bitch I don't give a flying fuck how you think of me.
Who the fuck are you anyway?????????????????

[TsVanessa69]

Someone still owes me ten bucks for this devolving into attacks on personal appearance. You know who you are. I don't post a picture because I'm secure in my looks. I'm not some shallow attention whore that has a million pictures in my gallery, videos, you name it. Frothing at the mouth while you call me a man means nothing to me. Getting mad and coating your monitor with impotent rage spittle while you type nastygrams amuses me to no end.

As for botched tit jobs, Melissa... I'm pretty sure your nipples are supposed to point the same way. Tell Jésus the med student that when you go for your followup.

P.S. If you think Vanessa looks awful, you're insane. Seriously, tear the pictures of Natalie Wood off all your mirrors and see the real you, it's... not as pretty.
That bitch is a fool and a joke. Then to post my pics which yea, have made me alot of money, and by the way are from a PAID shoot for Shemale Strokers. And my dick is bigger than yours. And botched boob job or not, bitch you are still an old late in transition bitter ass prostitute who sucks dicks to eat.

[TsVanessa69]

I MADE 1000 TODAY
ONE MAN 20 MIN

1. "'There's a sucker born every minute" - P.T. Barnum
2. Great, now you can buy a new keyboard with working caps lock.


thanks your advice is not needed because my Boyfriend bought me a computer( laptop ) for my birthday ! so no need for a new computer ! I own three !

as for a sucker

i consider anyone who pays for sex a sucker and please quote me !


and as for the remark made about my dick

you thirsty ass cock craver you won't get a picture of it out of me


but three pics are availbe for purchase @ www.niteflirt.com/tink

thanks in advance you FAT SLOPPY NO GOOD ASS TRICK !!!!!No thanks. I dont need to see pics of your pencil dick. And I really didnt need to see a pic of the three teen age faggots either. What are they like 12? You can tell a lot about a person by the company they keep. What were you guys doing in the pic, watching Seasame Street?
Its all falls together. A need for attention and will take it anywhere she can get it.
Oversized avatars, hateraid posts, the need to brag on who buys her things and how much she makes, ONLY has friends 15 and under. Never has anything positve to say or contribute to the comunnity. A bitch who's funeral I will attend and probably be the only one there, and will pour piss on her grave

[TsVanessa69]

Someone still owes me ten bucks for this devolving into attacks on personal appearance. You know who you are. I don't post a picture because I'm secure in my looks. I'm not some shallow attention whore that has a million pictures in my gallery, videos, you name it. Frothing at the mouth while you call me a man means nothing to me. Getting mad and coating your monitor with impotent rage spittle while you type nastygrams amuses me to no end.

As for botched tit jobs, Melissa... I'm pretty sure your nipples are supposed to point the same way. Tell Jésus the med student that when you go for your followup.

P.S. If you think Vanessa looks awful, you're insane. Seriously, tear the pictures of Natalie Wood off all your mirrors and see the real you, it's... not as pretty.

I own you punk and thanks for clearly reading so much about me. I'm pretty live with that lol you on the other hand are anonymous. People like me live with it you in contrast are a nobody. Now get back to the drive thruYou are on old drug addicted street walker, now how is that better than working in a drive-thru???? You aren't even an escort, a cheap trailer park hooker or a lot lizard at best. Low budget punk trying desperatly to fit in and girl you failed miserably. You are not nothing hot enough to ever talk about somebody's looks at all. You have no shape, no personality and most definatly no sex appeal. Probably never owned a pair of heels in your life. Those crusty chunky Payless heels you wear are a fool!

[melissacarter]

Someone still owes me ten bucks for this devolving into attacks on personal appearance. You know who you are. I don't post a picture because I'm secure in my looks. I'm not some shallow attention whore that has a million pictures in my gallery, videos, you name it. Frothing at the mouth while you call me a man means nothing to me. Getting mad and coating your monitor with impotent rage spittle while you type nastygrams amuses me to no end.

As for botched tit jobs, Melissa... I'm pretty sure your nipples are supposed to point the same way. Tell Jésus the med student that when you go for your followup.

P.S. If you think Vanessa looks awful, you're insane. Seriously, tear the pictures of Natalie Wood off all your mirrors and see the real you, it's... not as pretty.

I own you punk and thanks for clearly reading so much about me. I'm pretty live with that lol you on the other hand are anonymous. People like me live with it you in contrast are a nobody. Now get back to the drive thruYou are on old drug addicted street walker, now how is that better than working in a drive-thru???? You aren't even an escort, a cheap trailer park hooker or a lot lizard at best. Low budget punk

snicker snicker how was work today? Oh, here, ya go.

[TsVanessa69]

Someone still owes me ten bucks for this devolving into attacks on personal appearance. You know who you are. I don't post a picture because I'm secure in my looks. I'm not some shallow attention whore that has a million pictures in my gallery, videos, you name it. Frothing at the mouth while you call me a man means nothing to me. Getting mad and coating your monitor with impotent rage spittle while you type nastygrams amuses me to no end.

As for botched tit jobs, Melissa... I'm pretty sure your nipples are supposed to point the same way. Tell Jésus the med student that when you go for your followup.

P.S. If you think Vanessa looks awful, you're insane. Seriously, tear the pictures of Natalie Wood off all your mirrors and see the real you, it's... not as pretty.

I own you punk and thanks for clearly reading so much about me. I'm pretty live with that lol you on the other hand are anonymous. People like me live with it you in contrast are a nobody. Now get back to the drive thruYou are on old drug addicted street walker, now how is that better than working in a drive-thru???? You aren't even an escort, a cheap trailer park hooker or a lot lizard at best. Low budget punk

snicker snicker how was work today? Oh, here, ya go.
Work was fine. All my co-workers got a laugh at your expense! You seem to collect my pics, shows how much you are into me.
Bitch yea I gained a few pounds, but still have the curves men want to see! Still booked around the country and still getting paid!!!!!!!!!! All the hater bitches have tons of my pics, yet I have none of them, shows how much I give a fuck about you.

[mimiplastique]

YOU LOOK A GOD DAMN FOOL YOU PEROID

[mimiplastique]

LMAO

[TsVanessa69]

LMAO
Since you like to prank call my housde ith your friends number I made a police report AGAIN
this time it was: Calb Ceguilla 312-532-4632

you were warned

And I have 2 witnesses.

[mimiplastique]

LMAO
Since you like to prank call my housde ith your friends number I made a police report AGAIN
this time it was: Calb Ceguilla 312-532-4632

you were warned

And I have 2 witnesses.

THEY ARE ALL GONNA LAUGH AT YOU AND I STILL HAVE THE REPORT PENDING ON YOU FAGGOT BRICK

YOU LOOK A FOOL

[mimiplastique]

I HAVE 4
YOU UGLY BRICK

[Floyd R]

Now that was cold. I almost chocked on my cereal while reading your comments.







I MADE 1000 TODAY
ONE MAN 20 MIN

1. "'There's a sucker born every minute" - P.T. Barnum
2. Great, now you can buy a new keyboard with working caps lock.


thanks your advice is not needed because my Boyfriend bought me a computer( laptop ) for my birthday ! so no need for a new computer ! I own three !

as for a sucker

i consider anyone who pays for sex a sucker and please quote me !


and as for the remark made about my dick

you thirsty ass cock craver you won't get a picture of it out of me


but three pics are availbe for purchase @ www.niteflirt.com/tink

thanks in advance you FAT SLOPPY NO GOOD ASS TRICK !!!!!No thanks. I dont need to see pics of your pencil dick. And I really didnt need to see a pic of the three teen age faggots either. What are they like 12? You can tell a lot about a person by the company they keep. What were you guys doing in the pic, watching Seasame Street?
Its all falls together. A need for attention and will take it anywhere she can get it.
Oversized avatars, hateraid posts, the need to brag on who buys her things and how much she makes, ONLY has friends 15 and under. Never has anything positve to say or contribute to the comunnity. A bitch who's funeral I will attend and probably be the only one there, and will pour piss on her grave

[Floyd R]

Why do you and Vanessa hate each other?





Someone still owes me ten bucks for this devolving into attacks on personal appearance. You know who you are. I don't post a picture because I'm secure in my looks. I'm not some shallow attention whore that has a million pictures in my gallery, videos, you name it. Frothing at the mouth while you call me a man means nothing to me. Getting mad and coating your monitor with impotent rage spittle while you type nastygrams amuses me to no end.

As for botched tit jobs, Melissa... I'm pretty sure your nipples are supposed to point the same way. Tell Jésus the med student that when you go for your followup.

P.S. If you think Vanessa looks awful, you're insane. Seriously, tear the pictures of Natalie Wood off all your mirrors and see the real you, it's... not as pretty.

I own you punk and thanks for clearly reading so much about me. I'm pretty live with that lol you on the other hand are anonymous. People like me live with it you in contrast are a nobody. Now get back to the drive thruYou are on old drug addicted street walker, now how is that better than working in a drive-thru???? You aren't even an escort, a cheap trailer park hooker or a lot lizard at best. Low budget punk

snicker snicker how was work today? Oh, here, ya go.

[lisaparadise]

Lots of guys here like Crossdressers......a little more than 2 out of 3 guys.

*shrug* pretty sad if thats true someone call the fag patrol damn it lol

[mimiplastique]

Now that was cold. I almost chocked on my cereal while reading your comments.







I MADE 1000 TODAY
ONE MAN 20 MIN

1. "'There's a sucker born every minute" - P.T. Barnum
2. Great, now you can buy a new keyboard with working caps lock.


thanks your advice is not needed because my Boyfriend bought me a computer( laptop ) for my birthday ! so no need for a new computer ! I own three !

as for a sucker

i consider anyone who pays for sex a sucker and please quote me !


and as for the remark made about my dick

you thirsty ass cock craver you won't get a picture of it out of me


but three pics are availbe for purchase @ www.niteflirt.com/tink

thanks in advance you FAT SLOPPY NO GOOD ASS TRICK !!!!!No thanks. I dont need to see pics of your pencil dick. And I really didnt need to see a pic of the three teen age faggots either. What are they like 12? You can tell a lot about a person by the company they keep. What were you guys doing in the pic, watching Seasame Street?
Its all falls together. A need for attention and will take it anywhere she can get it.
Oversized avatars, hateraid posts, the need to brag on who buys her things and how much she makes, ONLY has friends 15 and under. Never has anything positve to say or contribute to the comunnity. A bitch who's funeral I will attend and probably be the only one there, and will pour piss on her grave


YEA THE GIRL WITH THE RAPIDLY DROPPING T CELLS AT MY FUNERAL


SORRY RENIA

I HAVE FAMILY THAT WILL BE THERE

FRIENDS

BEAUTIFUL FRIENDS

YOU SHOULD ASK WHO EVER PRESCRIBED YOU COMBIVIR TO
ATTEND YOURS

YOU BARE BACK PORN FREE SEX FAGGOT

YOU GOT SHIT GROWING OFF OF YOUR BODY AND ITS NOT CUTE



COME TO LOU CANTE DANCE STUDIO AND ATTEND CLASSES WITH THE BEST ... THEN TALK SOME SHIT

UNTILL THEN OLD MAN START WRITING OUT YOUR WILL AND WHO YOUR GOING TO LEAVE YOUR AIDS TO NEXT


STILL LMAO

ALL OF US
LMAO

[TsVanessa69]

Now that was cold. I almost chocked on my cereal while reading your comments.







I MADE 1000 TODAY
ONE MAN 20 MIN

1. "'There's a sucker born every minute" - P.T. Barnum
2. Great, now you can buy a new keyboard with working caps lock.


thanks your advice is not needed because my Boyfriend bought me a computer( laptop ) for my birthday ! so no need for a new computer ! I own three !

as for a sucker

i consider anyone who pays for sex a sucker and please quote me !


and as for the remark made about my dick

you thirsty ass cock craver you won't get a picture of it out of me


but three pics are availbe for purchase @ www.niteflirt.com/tink

thanks in advance you FAT SLOPPY NO GOOD ASS TRICK !!!!!No thanks. I dont need to see pics of your pencil dick. And I really didnt need to see a pic of the three teen age faggots either. What are they like 12? You can tell a lot about a person by the company they keep. What were you guys doing in the pic, watching Seasame Street?
Its all falls together. A need for attention and will take it anywhere she can get it.
Oversized avatars, hateraid posts, the need to brag on who buys her things and how much she makes, ONLY has friends 15 and under. Never has anything positve to say or contribute to the comunnity. A bitch who's funeral I will attend and probably be the only one there, and will pour piss on her grave
Like I said, I'll be at your funeral faggot!
Mark my words.
What do you want on your tombstomstone?? And I ain't talkin about pizza either honey!

[mimiplastique]

you are an old ugly aids infested nigga with a hard ass body

how would you like to be burried ???

i would chose to burn all that car gawk homo

lmao

you kitchen table nightmare

[Castor_Troy05]

Seriously take this to PM cos who wants to read you both just bashing each other over 17 pages.

You 2 don't like each other, we get it.

[Castor_Troy05]

edit *dbl post*

[SarahG]

...you always choose the lifestyle whether or not theres a tangible and causal biological reason for it or not

Thank you, that is precisely what I was trying to say! That's the whole reason why I brought up GG's that go on HRT.


I'm in a bad mood and want to pick a fight with someone. Should i fuck with Mimi, Melissa, Vanessa, Sarah, or Jessica? Who should I verbally beat up today?

Just verbally? Darn... I was going to say "sure, what's the worst that could happen" but now I don't know.

Why are you in a bad mood?

[muhmuh]

I'm in a bad mood and want to pick a fight with someone. Should i fuck with Mimi, Melissa, Vanessa, Sarah, or Jessica?

doesnt matter as long as you do it in real life and theres a camera present

[TsVanessa69]

I'm in a bad mood and want to pick a fight with someone. Should i fuck with Mimi, Melissa, Vanessa, Sarah, or Jessica?

doesnt matter as long as you do it in real life and theres a camera present
See nobody on here would ever step to me in real life. I called the faggot who was prank calling me last night and he said Mimi was the one with the problem. He said he had no issues with me, and he respected me. Mimi is a sick bitch, I am so happy hers is coming sooner than she knows!

[melissacarter]

lol the pictures, the pictures, it never ends, it's a kind of mental illness.

check out that last one, fuck thats two beaten humans

[melissacarter]

Why do you and Vanessa hate each other?

hate? Floyd, I'm surprised at you. You only hate those you care about. Vanessa is a source of entertainment, I enjoy the pictures and the lip service.

[mimiplastique]

lol the pictures, the pictures, it never ends, it's a kind of mental illness.

check out that last one, fuck thats two beaten humans


lmao you like ????
call

[melissacarter]

I like how Vanessa's hands are bigger than his, check the fingers yikes!

[mimiplastique]

you look great vannesa !!!

and mine has been coming for a long time
no worries
I'll take this as a threat and report it to the police .
You wanna play hardball bitch .... I'm Game !!!

[TsVanessa69]

Why do you and Vanessa hate each other?

hate? Floyd, I'm surprised at you. You only hate those you care about. Vanessa is a source of entertainment, I enjoy the pictures and the lip service.
I knew you enjoyed the pics!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
You just got a boob job and its fucked up from day 1!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Now do't you have some more of those barefoot farm girl pics around????

[mimiplastique]

and bitch toni is not your friend girl he sat up here and told me he has been prank calling you for months AND he somehow knew you don't pick up private calls
so girl fuck you bitch
i am so glad you are out of my life ... Its so much better with out you '


and for god sakes why did you post that picture???

[TsVanessa69]

you look great vannesa !!!

and mine has been coming for a long time
no worries
I'll take this as a threat and report it to the police .
You wanna play hardball bitch .... I'm Game !!!
print it out and take it to them!
taking it as a threat is only your opinion
we have the entire convo printed and your harassing phone calls!!!!!!!!!!!
And wonder if you landlord knows you prostitite out of his building?

[mimiplastique]

you look great vannesa !!!

and mine has been coming for a long time
no worries
I'll take this as a threat and report it to the police .
You wanna play hardball bitch .... I'm Game !!!
print it out and take it to them!
taking it as a threat is only your opinion
we have the entire convo printed and your harassing phone calls!!!!!!!!!!!
And wonder if you landlord knows you prostitute out of his building?


i do not prostitute anywhere .

[mimiplastique]

you look great vannesa !!!

and mine has been coming for a long time
no worries
I'll take this as a threat and report it to the police .
You wanna play hardball bitch .... I'm Game !!!
print it out and take it to them!
taking it as a threat is only your opinion
we have the entire convo printed and your harassing phone calls!!!!!!!!!!!
And wonder if you landlord knows you prostitute out of his building?


i do not prostitute anywhere . Although i have been spending alot of time dancing in the dance studio !!! ;) maybe you should too

[TsVanessa69]

and bitch toni is not your friend girl he sat up here and told me he has been prank calling you for months AND he somehow knew you don't pick up private calls
so girl fuck you bitch
i am so glad you are out of my life ... Its so much better with out you '


and for god sakes why did you post that picture???
Nobody ever said tony was my friend. He's not your either. He told us how he was with you when you were diagnosed with HIV and how you took it really hard and needed to speak to a counsler. That explains your hatred for the world.

[TsVanessa69]

you look great vannesa !!!

and mine has been coming for a long time
no worries
I'll take this as a threat and report it to the police .
You wanna play hardball bitch .... I'm Game !!!
print it out and take it to them!
taking it as a threat is only your opinion
we have the entire convo printed and your harassing phone calls!!!!!!!!!!!
And wonder if you landlord knows you prostitute out of his building?


i do not prostitute anywhere .
So Ts Heidi stole your pics and your phone. Girl thats horrible

[mimiplastique]

and bitch toni is not your friend girl he sat up here and told me he has been prank calling you for months AND he somehow knew you don't pick up private calls
so girl fuck you bitch
i am so glad you are out of my life ... Its so much better with out you '


and for god sakes why did you post that picture???
Nobody ever said tony was my friend. He's not your either. He told us how he was with you when you were diagnosed with HIV and how you took it really hard and needed to speak to a counsler. That explains your hatred for the world.



are you fucking serious reina ??? girl come off it i have info on you that would make you cry if you knew i knew then posted it on the board .
and i do not hate anything
i LOVE my computer and I LOVE YOU TOO !!!!
MUAH

[mimiplastique]

[quote=TsVanessa69][quote=mimiplastique]you look great vannesa !!!

and mine has been coming for a long time
no worries
I'll take this as a threat and report it to the police .
You wanna play hardball bitch .... I'm Game !!!
print it out and take it to them!
taking it as a threat is only your opinion
we have the entire convo printed and your harassing phone calls!!!!!!!!!!!
And wonder if you landlord knows you prostitute out of his building?



bitch just because you post your shit on line does not mean that posting others is acceptable !!! you are a bitch and a fool ! always have been !!!
you were a bitch to me when we hung out and you will die that way .

i showed my Mother your comments about going to my funeral a few days ago
she said you were never my friend .

[TsVanessa69]

and bitch toni is not your friend girl he sat up here and told me he has been prank calling you for months AND he somehow knew you don't pick up private calls
so girl fuck you bitch
i am so glad you are out of my life ... Its so much better with out you '


and for god sakes why did you post that picture???
Nobody ever said tony was my friend. He's not your either. He told us how he was with you when you were diagnosed with HIV and how you took it really hard and needed to speak to a counsler. That explains your hatred for the world.



are you fucking serious reina ??? girl come off it i have info on you that would make you cry if you knew i knew then posted it on the board .
and i do not hate anything
i LOVE my computer and I LOVE YOU TOO !!!!
MUAH
I'm jus sayin what Tony told me on the phone with somebody else on the phone. But it never was a care to me either way. And like I said, I never said he was my friend. I'm jus sayin that when I called him, and read him, he said he had no problems with me, that you were behind the whole shit. There was no reason for you to repeatedly call my home. And like I said, none of you faggots have the balls to say shit to my face. You have to hide behind a computer. I'm that important to you that you always bring my name up in your bullshit threads. If you didn't like crossdressers, thats your opinion, but you had to add my name in the mix.

[TsVanessa69]

[quote=TsVanessa69][quote=mimiplastique]you look great vannesa !!!

and mine has been coming for a long time
no worries
I'll take this as a threat and report it to the police .
You wanna play hardball bitch .... I'm Game !!!
print it out and take it to them!
taking it as a threat is only your opinion
we have the entire convo printed and your harassing phone calls!!!!!!!!!!!
And wonder if you landlord knows you prostitute out of his building?



bitch just because you post your shit on line does not mean that posting others is acceptable !!! you are a bitch and a fool ! always have been !!!
you were a bitch to me when we hung out and you will die that way .

i showed my Mother your comments about going to my funeral a few days ago
she said you were never my friend .
I mean you post shit and you want to go to the police. I welcome you to do so, as I have other posts you made.
I was thr only bitch who had your back even when I kne it was bullshit. I got you booked at clubs, I talked to you 10 times a day when nobody else would. The year before last when everybody paid you dust on your birthday, I came over, bought you a perfume I knew you wanted and took you to dinner, how soon we forget. You just got mad cuz I got my life together and moving on to better things thats it! Maybe instead of worrying so much about me and my life, maybe you should channel that into getting a better life for yourself

[mimiplastique]

and bitch toni is not your friend girl he sat up here and told me he has been prank calling you for months AND he somehow knew you don't pick up private calls
so girl fuck you bitch
i am so glad you are out of my life ... Its so much better with out you '


and for god sakes why did you post that picture???
Nobody ever said tony was my friend. He's not your either. He told us how he was with you when you were diagnosed with HIV and how you took it really hard and needed to speak to a counsler. That explains your hatred for the world.

cause you always have bullshit to talk me and i did not want it !!! so there BITCH
i wasted loads of time trying to co-operate with you and i know how you think
just like i knew it was you who posted that shit about BLKTS
i did not see her at my birthday
was it you ???

are you fucking serious reina ??? girl come off it i have info on you that would make you cry if you knew i knew then posted it on the board .
and i do not hate anything
i LOVE my computer and I LOVE YOU TOO !!!!
MUAH
I'm jus sayin what Tony told me on the phone with somebody else on the phone. But it never was a care to me either way. And like I said, I never said he was my friend. I'm jus sayin that when I called him, and read him, he said he had no problems with me, that you were behind the whole shit. There was no reason for you to repeatedly call my home. And like I said, none of you faggots have the balls to say shit to my face. You have to hide behind a computer. I'm that important to you that you always bring my name up in your bullshit threads. If you didn't like crossdressers, thats your opinion, but you had to add my name in the mix.

[mimiplastique]

and bitch toni is not your friend girl he sat up here and told me he has been prank calling you for months AND he somehow knew you don't pick up private calls
so girl fuck you bitch
i am so glad you are out of my life ... Its so much better with out you '


and for god sakes why did you post that picture???
Nobody ever said tony was my friend. He's not your either. He told us how he was with you when you were diagnosed with HIV and how you took it really hard and needed to speak to a counsler. That explains your hatred for the world.


are you fucking serious reina ??? girl come off it i have info on you that would make you cry if you knew i knew then posted it on the board .
and i do not hate anything
i LOVE my computer and I LOVE YOU TOO !!!!
MUAH
I'm jus sayin what Tony told me on the phone with somebody else on the phone. But it never was a care to me either way. And like I said, I never said he was my friend. I'm jus sayin that when I called him, and read him, he said he had no problems with me, that you were behind the whole shit. There was no reason for you to repeatedly call my home. And like I said, none of you faggots have the balls to say shit to my face. You have to hide behind a computer. I'm that important to you that you always bring my name up in your bullshit threads. If you didn't like crossdressers, thats your opinion, but you had to add my name in the mix.
cause you always have bullshit to talk me and i did not want it !!! so there BITCH
i wasted loads of time trying to co-operate with you and i know how you think
just like i knew it was you who posted that shit about BLKTS
i did not see her at my birthday
was it you ???

[TsVanessa69]

and bitch toni is not your friend girl he sat up here and told me he has been prank calling you for months AND he somehow knew you don't pick up private calls
so girl fuck you bitch
i am so glad you are out of my life ... Its so much better with out you '


and for god sakes why did you post that picture???
Nobody ever said tony was my friend. He's not your either. He told us how he was with you when you were diagnosed with HIV and how you took it really hard and needed to speak to a counsler. That explains your hatred for the world.


are you fucking serious reina ??? girl come off it i have info on you that would make you cry if you knew i knew then posted it on the board .
and i do not hate anything
i LOVE my computer and I LOVE YOU TOO !!!!
MUAH
I'm jus sayin what Tony told me on the phone with somebody else on the phone. But it never was a care to me either way. And like I said, I never said he was my friend. I'm jus sayin that when I called him, and read him, he said he had no problems with me, that you were behind the whole shit. There was no reason for you to repeatedly call my home. And like I said, none of you faggots have the balls to say shit to my face. You have to hide behind a computer. I'm that important to you that you always bring my name up in your bullshit threads. If you didn't like crossdressers, thats your opinion, but you had to add my name in the mix.
cause you always have bullshit to talk me and i did not want it !!! so there BITCH
i wasted loads of time trying to co-operate with you and i know how you think
just like i knew it was you who posted that shit about BLKTS
i did not see her at my birthday
was it you ???
Bitch that was another one of your bullshit threads. You started it because you like to keep up drama. If I have anything to say to anybody I say it, I don't need to make up fake names. I'm not scared of you in the least. I told you on the phone that day and on here I wasn't going to that bullshit ass party.You love drama and confrontation. You are miserable and you want every one around you to worship you and tell you how good you look. I don't need all that, I'm secure in who I am. I made changes in my life that I felt needed to be made.

[mimiplastique]

and bitch toni is not your friend girl he sat up here and told me he has been prank calling you for months AND he somehow knew you don't pick up private calls
so girl fuck you bitch
i am so glad you are out of my life ... Its so much better with out you '


and for god sakes why did you post that picture???
Nobody ever said tony was my friend. He's not your either. He told us how he was with you when you were diagnosed with HIV and how you took it really hard and needed to speak to a counsler. That explains your hatred for the world.


are you fucking serious reina ??? girl come off it i have info on you that would make you cry if you knew i knew then posted it on the board .
and i do not hate anything
i LOVE my computer and I LOVE YOU TOO !!!!
MUAH
I'm jus sayin what Tony told me on the phone with somebody else on the phone. But it never was a care to me either way. And like I said, I never said he was my friend. I'm jus sayin that when I called him, and read him, he said he had no problems with me, that you were behind the whole shit. There was no reason for you to repeatedly call my home. And like I said, none of you faggots have the balls to say shit to my face. You have to hide behind a computer. I'm that important to you that you always bring my name up in your bullshit threads. If you didn't like crossdressers, thats your opinion, but you had to add my name in the mix.
cause you always have bullshit to talk me and i did not want it !!! so there BITCH
i wasted loads of time trying to co-operate with you and i know how you think
just like i knew it was you who posted that shit about BLKTS
i did not see her at my birthday
was it you ???
Bitch that was another one of your bullshit threads. You started it because you like to keep up drama. If I have anything to say to anybody I say it, I don't need to make up fake names. I'm not scared of you in the least. I told you on the phone that day and on here I wasn't going to that bullshit ass party.You love drama and confrontation. You are miserable and you want every one around you to worship you and tell you how good you look. I don't need all that, I'm secure in who I am. I made changes in my life that I felt needed to be made.

i have proof that it was you or someone you knew that made up that blak ts account ! SOLID FUCKING PROOF!!!!

[TsVanessa69]

and bitch toni is not your friend girl he sat up here and told me he has been prank calling you for months AND he somehow knew you don't pick up private calls
so girl fuck you bitch
i am so glad you are out of my life ... Its so much better with out you '


and for god sakes why did you post that picture???
Nobody ever said tony was my friend. He's not your either. He told us how he was with you when you were diagnosed with HIV and how you took it really hard and needed to speak to a counsler. That explains your hatred for the world.


are you fucking serious reina ??? girl come off it i have info on you that would make you cry if you knew i knew then posted it on the board .
and i do not hate anything
i LOVE my computer and I LOVE YOU TOO !!!!
MUAH
I'm jus sayin what Tony told me on the phone with somebody else on the phone. But it never was a care to me either way. And like I said, I never said he was my friend. I'm jus sayin that when I called him, and read him, he said he had no problems with me, that you were behind the whole shit. There was no reason for you to repeatedly call my home. And like I said, none of you faggots have the balls to say shit to my face. You have to hide behind a computer. I'm that important to you that you always bring my name up in your bullshit threads. If you didn't like crossdressers, thats your opinion, but you had to add my name in the mix.
cause you always have bullshit to talk me and i did not want it !!! so there BITCH
i wasted loads of time trying to co-operate with you and i know how you think
just like i knew it was you who posted that shit about BLKTS
i did not see her at my birthday
was it you ???
Bitch that was another one of your bullshit threads. You started it because you like to keep up drama. If I have anything to say to anybody I say it, I don't need to make up fake names. I'm not scared of you in the least. I told you on the phone that day and on here I wasn't going to that bullshit ass party.You love drama and confrontation. You are miserable and you want every one around you to worship you and tell you how good you look. I don't need all that, I'm secure in who I am. I made changes in my life that I felt needed to be made.

i have proof that it was you or someone you knew that made up that blak ts account ! SOLID FUCKING PROOF!!!!
Oh girl :roll: :roll: Like when I confronted Tony on the phone with you just now, I said it then and I say it again, I don't need to hide behind shit, If I have something to say to anybody, i will say it to their face. Now if somebody made it up or not, I don't give a fuck, I say what I feel when the fuck I feel like it!

[tsluvaman]

This thread seems to be total bullshit started by an inmature person who needed some attention. But thats not the worse. As some very educational points were brought out by more mature members of the board. The most confusing part to me was this Melissa Carter character. Somebody lied to her and she ran with it, or she has fun park mirrors in her house, or doesn't use mirrors at all. I understand Mimi and Vanessa go back and forth, then Melissa jumps in where she obviously doesn't fit in. Then to use lines on Vanessa that Mimi already used shows a lack of originality. Sad that your need to fit in and be accepted has lead you to make a fool of yourself in a public forum like this. Instead of focusing all that attention on Vanessa, use that energy to better yourself and get your life together. No matter what you say about Vanessa, she is way hotter than you and has alot more going for her. You should sit back and take notes. Your work is mediocre at best and that piss poor attitude makes you look even worse. Mimi is hott, Vanessa is hott and if they go back and forth thats on them, they have personal issues, and have know each other for a while it seems. You jumping in with your bullshit, pointless comments just make you look like the looser you are.

[mimiplastique]

okay you make great points !!!
i am officially done arguing with her

yea that bitch has made alot of steps
but i am 23 and will NEVER see the biz (porn ) cause i guess thats what your talking about
sorry just not my thing

vannesa is on a higher level ... like a god ... beautiful , wise , intelligent.... and so on


sorry for failing to realize the error in my ways

now PLEASE FORGIVE ME


and if you don't i still have a facial to go to today a 2:30


microd yea

[tsluvaman]

okay you make great points !!!
i am officially done arguing with her

yea that bitch has made alot of steps
but i am 23 and will NEVER see the biz (porn ) cause i guess thats what your talking about
sorry just not my thing

vannesa is on a higher level ... like a god ... beautiful , wise , intelligent.... and so on


sorry for failing to realize the error in my ways

now PLEASE FORGIVE ME


and if you don't i still have a facial to go to today a 2:30


microd yea
See, stop being so insecure with yourself. As the post was made towards Melissa not you.

[mimiplastique]

okay you make great points !!!
i am officially done arguing with her

yea that bitch has made alot of steps
but i am 23 and will NEVER see the biz (porn ) cause i guess thats what your talking about
sorry just not my thing

vannesa is on a higher level ... like a god ... beautiful , wise , intelligent.... and so on


sorry for failing to realize the error in my ways

now PLEASE FORGIVE ME


and if you don't i still have a facial to go to today a 2:30


microd yea
See, stop being so insecure with yourself. As the post was made towards Melissa not you.


no i was kind of responding to what you wrote in the nightmare post

[RangeHova]

Excellent, excellent post RangeHova. I just have a question on the part I put in bold. Did you mean to say 'that' instead of 'than'. And did you mean to say that, "she went back to being a boy"?

I didn't mean to say that but I did mean to sday that during that time where she got religious, she lived as a male (actually kind of in between due to her breast, hips, and feminine looks) but now she is back to living as a female.


I take an opposing view that being a tv is just a milder case of being ts; a milder case of GID, if I can use that term. Some expressed it behind close doors, maybe only as a sexual release. Others feel the need to dress on go out and interact with others, but they revert back to their male role also. I believe that they see their feminine expression as a real part of themselves.

I would say that I partially agree with this. I say partially because I don't feel like someone who is just getting off on wearing panties, heels and a wig as being someone who see themselves as a female. It is just a sexual kink. There is no gender identity issue if you are just getting off on female clothing. The same with fulltime girls that pass and have had implants, hormones, and/or silicone work. If she self identifies as a male, if she transitions primarily for the sake of doing drag, walking the ballroom runway, escorting, or status then she doesn't truly have a gender identity issue.

Anyone who has seen the documentary Trantasia, saw the girl from Chicago, Tiara Russell, she clearly does not see herself as a female. I meet her a while back and she was struggling with the idea of getting breast implants because she wasn't sure that she wanted to wake up looking at her body that way but felt like she couldn't take her stage work any further without them. There are a significant number of girls who think like that. For them transitioning and body changes are a lot less about living as a female.

It all comes down to what is inside the person. It is a case by case thing. That is why I resist the blanket generalizations that seem so based on how a person looks or how they make us feel.

So little of this stuff is black or white. For most girls on this board, it probably was pretty clearly laid out for them. Still, it is all case by case.

[TsVanessa69]

Mimi can change her signature now to my newest video clip:

http://www.xtube.com/play_re.php?v=ZTHaE-S624-


do you guys realize how people wanted to buy the last one she posted??

[yodajazz]

Excellent, excellent post RangeHova. I just have a question on the part I put in bold. Did you mean to say 'that' instead of 'than'. And did you mean to say that, "she went back to being a boy"?

I didn't mean to say that but I did mean to sday that during that time where she got religious, she lived as a male (actually kind of in between due to her breast, hips, and feminine looks) but now she is back to living as a female.


I take an opposing view that being a tv is just a milder case of being ts; a milder case of GID, if I can use that term. Some expressed it behind close doors, maybe only as a sexual release. Others feel the need to dress on go out and interact with others, but they revert back to their male role also. I believe that they see their feminine expression as a real part of themselves.

I would say that I partially agree with this. I say partially because I don't feel like someone who is just getting off on wearing panties, heels and a wig as being someone who see themselves as a female. It is just a sexual kink. There is no gender identity issue if you are just getting off on female clothing. The same with fulltime girls that pass and have had implants, hormones, and/or silicone work. If she self identifies as a male, if she transitions primarily for the sake of doing drag, walking the ballroom runway, escorting, or status then she doesn't truly have a gender identity issue.

Anyone who has seen the documentary Trantasia, saw the girl from Chicago, Tiara Russell, she clearly does not see herself as a female. I meet her a while back and she was struggling with the idea of getting breast implants because she wasn't sure that she wanted to wake up looking at her body that way but felt like she couldn't take her stage work any further without them. There are a significant number of girls who think like that. For them transitioning and body changes are a lot less about living as a female.

It all comes down to what is inside the person. It is a case by case thing. That is why I resist the blanket generalizations that seem so based on how a person looks or how they make us feel.

So little of this stuff is black or white. For most girls on this board, it probably was pretty clearly laid out for them. Still, it is all case by case.

I basically agree with your conclusion that it is an individual thing. I would dispute how much of crossdressing is a sexual fetish and what is viewing themselves as having a partial female identity. From my readings, a typical pattern would be a youth crossdressing purely for sexual release (a fetish), but as they continue they would realize that they have a partially female identity that they feel they need to express. These are the ones that might go out to a club or other social gathering. But they may also be comfortable with expressing their male side. So they then would identify as male, but see themselves as part female. I would define that as a ‘mild’ case of GID. This goes against what many women here believe, but someone of the outside might see it the way I do.

An analogy I would use is basketball. Some players are 24/7. Other’s see themselves as ball players, even though they play only on weekends.
Almost any condition or state, has mild and severe forms. I say that GID is no different.

I would be curious how the person you mentioned, Tiara Russel would respond if questioned. I remember her saying that she did not want to die as a female, but she also did not say she had no 'feminine' feelings either. There as some who only do drag on stage and do say that it is only for entertainment purposes.

[keepingitreal470]

This thread seems to be total bullshit started by an inmature person who needed some attention. But thats not the worse. As some very educational points were brought out by more mature members of the board. The most confusing part to me was this Melissa Carter character. Somebody lied to her and she ran with it, or she has fun park mirrors in her house, or doesn't use mirrors at all. I understand Mimi and Vanessa go back and forth, then Melissa jumps in where she obviously doesn't fit in. Then to use lines on Vanessa that Mimi already used shows a lack of originality. Sad that your need to fit in and be accepted has lead you to make a fool of yourself in a public forum like this. Instead of focusing all that attention on Vanessa, use that energy to better yourself and get your life together. No matter what you say about Vanessa, she is way hotter than you and has alot more going for her. You should sit back and take notes. Your work is mediocre at best and that piss poor attitude makes you look even worse. Mimi is hott, Vanessa is hott and if they go back and forth thats on them, they have personal issues, and have know each other for a while it seems. You jumping in with your bullshit, pointless comments just make you look like the looser you are.Oh shit, LMMFAO BWHAHAHAHAHAHAHA Honestly this is funny as shit. Fuckin hilarious. Fun park mirrors. OMG. I'm laughin so hard I got tears in my eyes. LMAO Damm I havent laughed this hard in a long time. I need a tissue. BWHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!!

[keepingitreal470]

OMG I'm still laughin as I type. Damm I havent laughed this hard in a long time. I need a tissue. Fun Mirrors. BWHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!!

[melissacarter]

This thread seems to be total bullshit started by an inmature person who needed some attention. But thats not the worse. As some very educational points were brought out by more mature members of the board. The most confusing part to me was this Melissa Carter character. Somebody lied to her and she ran with it, or she has fun park mirrors in her house, or doesn't use mirrors at all. I understand Mimi and Vanessa go back and forth, then Melissa jumps in where she obviously doesn't fit in. Then to use lines on Vanessa that Mimi already used shows a lack of originality. Sad that your need to fit in and be accepted has lead you to make a fool of yourself in a public forum like this. Instead of focusing all that attention on Vanessa, use that energy to better yourself and get your life together. No matter what you say about Vanessa, she is way hotter than you and has alot more going for her. You should sit back and take notes. Your work is mediocre at best and that piss poor attitude makes you look even worse. Mimi is hott, Vanessa is hott and if they go back and forth thats on them, they have personal issues, and have know each other for a while it seems. You jumping in with your bullshit, pointless comments just make you look like the looser you are.

Who would take anything you say seriously look at your avatar. Why don't you just go to an adult bookstore and stop pretending it needs to be attached to a girl?

There are men who like fresh caviar there are men who like Oscar Meyer Weiners. You are one of those slugs who can't see the difference.

[melissacarter]

This thread seems to be total bullshit started by an inmature person who needed some attention. But thats not the worse. As some very educational points were brought out by more mature members of the board. The most confusing part to me was this Melissa Carter character. Somebody lied to her and she ran with it, or she has fun park mirrors in her house, or doesn't use mirrors at all. I understand Mimi and Vanessa go back and forth, then Melissa jumps in where she obviously doesn't fit in. Then to use lines on Vanessa that Mimi already used shows a lack of originality. Sad that your need to fit in and be accepted has lead you to make a fool of yourself in a public forum like this. Instead of focusing all that attention on Vanessa, use that energy to better yourself and get your life together. No matter what you say about Vanessa, she is way hotter than you and has alot more going for her. You should sit back and take notes. Your work is mediocre at best and that piss poor attitude makes you look even worse. Mimi is hott, Vanessa is hott and if they go back and forth thats on them, they have personal issues, and have know each other for a while it seems. You jumping in with your bullshit, pointless comments just make you look like the looser you are.Oh shit, LMMFAO BWHAHAHAHAHAHAHA Honestly this is funny as shit. Fuckin hilarious. Fun park mirrors. OMG. I'm laughin so hard I got tears in my eyes. LMAO Damm I havent laughed this hard in a long time. I need a tissue. BWHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!!

Why don't you tell the board what your screen name was before you were banned? You should read this guy's posts on who he thinks is hot. It's a lesson to all girls do not take anything you read on here seriously.

[needsum]

:frustrated :why :screwy

[ANGELDUST]

boooooooo

[keepingitreal470]

This thread seems to be total bullshit started by an inmature person who needed some attention. But thats not the worse. As some very educational points were brought out by more mature members of the board. The most confusing part to me was this Melissa Carter character. Somebody lied to her and she ran with it, or she has fun park mirrors in her house, or doesn't use mirrors at all. I understand Mimi and Vanessa go back and forth, then Melissa jumps in where she obviously doesn't fit in. Then to use lines on Vanessa that Mimi already used shows a lack of originality. Sad that your need to fit in and be accepted has lead you to make a fool of yourself in a public forum like this. Instead of focusing all that attention on Vanessa, use that energy to better yourself and get your life together. No matter what you say about Vanessa, she is way hotter than you and has alot more going for her. You should sit back and take notes. Your work is mediocre at best and that piss poor attitude makes you look even worse. Mimi is hott, Vanessa is hott and if they go back and forth thats on them, they have personal issues, and have know each other for a while it seems. You jumping in with your bullshit, pointless comments just make you look like the looser you are.Oh shit, LMMFAO BWHAHAHAHAHAHAHA Honestly this is funny as shit. Fuckin hilarious. Fun park mirrors. OMG. I'm laughin so hard I got tears in my eyes. LMAO Damm I havent laughed this hard in a long time. I need a tissue. BWHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!!

Why don't you tell the board what your screen name was before you were banned? You should read this guy's posts on who he thinks is hot. It's a lesson to all girls do not take anything you read on here seriously.In all honesty, I could have blasted you for your looks a long time ago. I was nice about it and deceided not to. You should have kept your mouth shut. Ok. You are basically a crossdresser with misquito bumps on your chest in a wig and a skirt. Your pale as a ghost and you think somehow you have the right to talk about the way someone else looks? BWHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!! OMG!!! Where do you get the fucking gaul to talk about the way another person looks. I'm not attracted to white tgirls anyway, but your not even a tgirl. You honestly look like something is wrong with you. Sickeness? Illness? I dont know. Now. This could have been avoided had you left me alone. You started this. Remember that. My posts on who I think is hot? My friend in my avatar is hot. She's actually a tgirl unlike yourself. And your not on the same planet as her as far as looks.

[menacingmethods86]

I wonder how long it'll be until Mimi and Jennifer are bitter enemies?

[melissacarter]

This thread seems to be total bullshit started by an inmature person who needed some attention. But thats not the worse. As some very educational points were brought out by more mature members of the board. The most confusing part to me was this Melissa Carter character. Somebody lied to her and she ran with it, or she has fun park mirrors in her house, or doesn't use mirrors at all. I understand Mimi and Vanessa go back and forth, then Melissa jumps in where she obviously doesn't fit in. Then to use lines on Vanessa that Mimi already used shows a lack of originality. Sad that your need to fit in and be accepted has lead you to make a fool of yourself in a public forum like this. Instead of focusing all that attention on Vanessa, use that energy to better yourself and get your life together. No matter what you say about Vanessa, she is way hotter than you and has alot more going for her. You should sit back and take notes. Your work is mediocre at best and that piss poor attitude makes you look even worse. Mimi is hott, Vanessa is hott and if they go back and forth thats on them, they have personal issues, and have know each other for a while it seems. You jumping in with your bullshit, pointless comments just make you look like the looser you are.Oh shit, LMMFAO BWHAHAHAHAHAHAHA Honestly this is funny as shit. Fuckin hilarious. Fun park mirrors. OMG. I'm laughin so hard I got tears in my eyes. LMAO Damm I havent laughed this hard in a long time. I need a tissue. BWHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!!

Why don't you tell the board what your screen name was before you were banned? You should read this guy's posts on who he thinks is hot. It's a lesson to all girls do not take anything you read on here seriously.In all honesty, I could have blasted you for your looks a long time ago. I was nice about it and deceided not to. You should have kept your mouth shut. Ok. You are basically a crossdresser with misquito bumps on your chest in a wig and a skirt. Your pale as a ghost and you think somehow you have the right to talk about the way someone else looks? BWHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!! OMG!!! Where do you get the fucking gaul to talk about the way another person looks. I'm not attracted to white tgirls anyway, but your not even a tgirl. You honestly look like something is wrong with you. Sickeness? Illness? I dont know. Now. This could have been avoided had you left me alone. You started this. Remember that. My posts on who I think is hot? My friend in my avatar is hot. She's actually a tgirl unlike yourself. And your not on the same planet as her as far as looks.

look at that disgusting pig in yr avatar, that says it all. Your taste like yr brains is up yr ass.

[melissacarter]

This thread seems to be total bullshit started by an inmature person who needed some attention. But thats not the worse. As some very educational points were brought out by more mature members of the board. The most confusing part to me was this Melissa Carter character. Somebody lied to her and she ran with it, or she has fun park mirrors in her house, or doesn't use mirrors at all. I understand Mimi and Vanessa go back and forth, then Melissa jumps in where she obviously doesn't fit in. Then to use lines on Vanessa that Mimi already used shows a lack of originality. Sad that your need to fit in and be accepted has lead you to make a fool of yourself in a public forum like this. Instead of focusing all that attention on Vanessa, use that energy to better yourself and get your life together. No matter what you say about Vanessa, she is way hotter than you and has alot more going for her. You should sit back and take notes. Your work is mediocre at best and that piss poor attitude makes you look even worse. Mimi is hott, Vanessa is hott and if they go back and forth thats on them, they have personal issues, and have know each other for a while it seems. You jumping in with your bullshit, pointless comments just make you look like the looser you are.Oh shit, LMMFAO BWHAHAHAHAHAHAHA Honestly this is funny as shit. Fuckin hilarious. Fun park mirrors. OMG. I'm laughin so hard I got tears in my eyes. LMAO Damm I havent laughed this hard in a long time. I need a tissue. BWHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!!

Why don't you tell the board what your screen name was before you were banned? You should read this guy's posts on who he thinks is hot. It's a lesson to all girls do not take anything you read on here seriously.In all honesty, I could have blasted you for your looks a long time ago. I was nice about it and deceided not to. You should have kept your mouth shut. Ok. You are basically a crossdresser with misquito bumps on your chest in a wig and a skirt. Your pale as a ghost and you think somehow you have the right to talk about the way someone else looks? BWHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!! OMG!!! Where do you get the fucking gaul to talk about the way another person looks. I'm not attracted to white tgirls anyway, but your not even a tgirl. You honestly look like something is wrong with you. Sickeness? Illness? I dont know. Now. This could have been avoided had you left me alone. You started this. Remember that. My posts on who I think is hot? My friend in my avatar is hot. She's actually a tgirl unlike yourself. And your not on the same planet as her as far as looks.

Yea I'm not a tgirl I'm actually recognized as female

good luck fucking that swine I thought that picture was a joke holy shit yr serious

[keepingitreal470]

This thread seems to be total bullshit started by an inmature person who needed some attention. But thats not the worse. As some very educational points were brought out by more mature members of the board. The most confusing part to me was this Melissa Carter character. Somebody lied to her and she ran with it, or she has fun park mirrors in her house, or doesn't use mirrors at all. I understand Mimi and Vanessa go back and forth, then Melissa jumps in where she obviously doesn't fit in. Then to use lines on Vanessa that Mimi already used shows a lack of originality. Sad that your need to fit in and be accepted has lead you to make a fool of yourself in a public forum like this. Instead of focusing all that attention on Vanessa, use that energy to better yourself and get your life together. No matter what you say about Vanessa, she is way hotter than you and has alot more going for her. You should sit back and take notes. Your work is mediocre at best and that piss poor attitude makes you look even worse. Mimi is hott, Vanessa is hott and if they go back and forth thats on them, they have personal issues, and have know each other for a while it seems. You jumping in with your bullshit, pointless comments just make you look like the looser you are.Oh shit, LMMFAO BWHAHAHAHAHAHAHA Honestly this is funny as shit. Fuckin hilarious. Fun park mirrors. OMG. I'm laughin so hard I got tears in my eyes. LMAO Damm I havent laughed this hard in a long time. I need a tissue. BWHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!!

Why don't you tell the board what your screen name was before you were banned? You should read this guy's posts on who he thinks is hot. It's a lesson to all girls do not take anything you read on here seriously.In all honesty, I could have blasted you for your looks a long time ago. I was nice about it and deceided not to. You should have kept your mouth shut. Ok. You are basically a crossdresser with misquito bumps on your chest in a wig and a skirt. Your pale as a ghost and you think somehow you have the right to talk about the way someone else looks? BWHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!! OMG!!! Where do you get the fucking gaul to talk about the way another person looks. I'm not attracted to white tgirls anyway, but your not even a tgirl. You honestly look like something is wrong with you. Sickeness? Illness? I dont know. Now. This could have been avoided had you left me alone. You started this. Remember that. My posts on who I think is hot? My friend in my avatar is hot. She's actually a tgirl unlike yourself. And your not on the same planet as her as far as looks.

Yea I'm not a tgirl I'm actually recognized as female

good luck fucking that swine I thought that picture was a joke holy shit yr seriousA female??? Are you serious?? YOU'RE A FUCKING MAN WHITE BOY. Fucking casper the ghost transvestite. Did you remember to shave that fucking shadow this morning you fucking clown. You are an insult to all girls who want to transition. Ugggggghhhhhhh How can a man be attracted to a little white boy like yourself unleess he likes boys. Take your cracker ass back to the doctor who you paid for those mosquito bumps. Ask him for some ass and some dick like my friend got. Oh, I forgot, your white, you cant get it like that. BWWHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!! Ugly ass motherfucker. Dont you ever come for me or my friend ever again. Or I'll send animal control out to capture you in a net you fucking beast. BWHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!!!

[melissacarter]

I'm chucklin loser, oh and banned loser who came back under another name. Brush yr teeth you have pork breath from eating that pig

hey what was yr name before you got banned loser

[TsVanessa69]

This thread seems to be total bullshit started by an inmature person who needed some attention. But thats not the worse. As some very educational points were brought out by more mature members of the board. The most confusing part to me was this Melissa Carter character. Somebody lied to her and she ran with it, or she has fun park mirrors in her house, or doesn't use mirrors at all. I understand Mimi and Vanessa go back and forth, then Melissa jumps in where she obviously doesn't fit in. Then to use lines on Vanessa that Mimi already used shows a lack of originality. Sad that your need to fit in and be accepted has lead you to make a fool of yourself in a public forum like this. Instead of focusing all that attention on Vanessa, use that energy to better yourself and get your life together. No matter what you say about Vanessa, she is way hotter than you and has alot more going for her. You should sit back and take notes. Your work is mediocre at best and that piss poor attitude makes you look even worse. Mimi is hott, Vanessa is hott and if they go back and forth thats on them, they have personal issues, and have know each other for a while it seems. You jumping in with your bullshit, pointless comments just make you look like the looser you are.Oh shit, LMMFAO BWHAHAHAHAHAHAHA Honestly this is funny as shit. Fuckin hilarious. Fun park mirrors. OMG. I'm laughin so hard I got tears in my eyes. LMAO Damm I havent laughed this hard in a long time. I need a tissue. BWHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!!

Why don't you tell the board what your screen name was before you were banned? You should read this guy's posts on who he thinks is hot. It's a lesson to all girls do not take anything you read on here seriously.In all honesty, I could have blasted you for your looks a long time ago. I was nice about it and deceided not to. You should have kept your mouth shut. Ok. You are basically a crossdresser with misquito bumps on your chest in a wig and a skirt. Your pale as a ghost and you think somehow you have the right to talk about the way someone else looks? BWHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!! OMG!!! Where do you get the fucking gaul to talk about the way another person looks. I'm not attracted to white tgirls anyway, but your not even a tgirl. You honestly look like something is wrong with you. Sickeness? Illness? I dont know. Now. This could have been avoided had you left me alone. You started this. Remember that. My posts on who I think is hot? My friend in my avatar is hot. She's actually a tgirl unlike yourself. And your not on the same planet as her as far as looks.

Yea I'm not a tgirl I'm actually recognized as female

good luck fucking that swine I thought that picture was a joke holy shit yr seriousA female??? Are you serious?? YOU'RE A FUCKING MAN WHITE BOY. Fucking casper the ghost transvestite. Did you remember to shave that fucking shadow this morning you fucking clown. You are an insult to all girls who want to transition. Ugggggghhhhhhh How can a man be attracted to a little white boy like yourself unleess he likes boys. Take your cracker ass back to the doctor who you paid for those mosquito bumps. Ask him for some ass and some dick like my friend got. Oh, I forgot, your white, you cant get it like that. BWWHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!! Ugly ass motherfucker. Dont you ever come for me or my friend ever again. Or I'll send animal control out to capture you in a net you fucking beast. BWHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!!!
i thought it was just me that saw this crossdresser was going too far with the botched boob job fresh off the table! And that boy ass body, could never come for me ever. Glad somebody else see's where I am coming from
The fun mirrors must be fogged up or the drugs are finally taking their toll on the few brain cells that didn't fry when she was smokin that crack!!!

[melissacarter]

Right, now the cow speaks, not a surprise this moron likes you, take a look at his avatar.

I don't need to justify me, you are slug and you give trannies a bad name

[keepingitreal470]

This thread seems to be total bullshit started by an inmature person who needed some attention. But thats not the worse. As some very educational points were brought out by more mature members of the board. The most confusing part to me was this Melissa Carter character. Somebody lied to her and she ran with it, or she has fun park mirrors in her house, or doesn't use mirrors at all. I understand Mimi and Vanessa go back and forth, then Melissa jumps in where she obviously doesn't fit in. Then to use lines on Vanessa that Mimi already used shows a lack of originality. Sad that your need to fit in and be accepted has lead you to make a fool of yourself in a public forum like this. Instead of focusing all that attention on Vanessa, use that energy to better yourself and get your life together. No matter what you say about Vanessa, she is way hotter than you and has alot more going for her. You should sit back and take notes. Your work is mediocre at best and that piss poor attitude makes you look even worse. Mimi is hott, Vanessa is hott and if they go back and forth thats on them, they have personal issues, and have know each other for a while it seems. You jumping in with your bullshit, pointless comments just make you look like the looser you are.Oh shit, LMMFAO BWHAHAHAHAHAHAHA Honestly this is funny as shit. Fuckin hilarious. Fun park mirrors. OMG. I'm laughin so hard I got tears in my eyes. LMAO Damm I havent laughed this hard in a long time. I need a tissue. BWHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!!

Why don't you tell the board what your screen name was before you were banned? You should read this guy's posts on who he thinks is hot. It's a lesson to all girls do not take anything you read on here seriously.In all honesty, I could have blasted you for your looks a long time ago. I was nice about it and deceided not to. You should have kept your mouth shut. Ok. You are basically a crossdresser with misquito bumps on your chest in a wig and a skirt. Your pale as a ghost and you think somehow you have the right to talk about the way someone else looks? BWHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!! OMG!!! Where do you get the fucking gaul to talk about the way another person looks. I'm not attracted to white tgirls anyway, but your not even a tgirl. You honestly look like something is wrong with you. Sickeness? Illness? I dont know. Now. This could have been avoided had you left me alone. You started this. Remember that. My posts on who I think is hot? My friend in my avatar is hot. She's actually a tgirl unlike yourself. And your not on the same planet as her as far as looks.

Yea I'm not a tgirl I'm actually recognized as female

good luck fucking that swine I thought that picture was a joke holy shit yr seriousA female??? Are you serious?? YOU'RE A FUCKING MAN WHITE BOY. Fucking casper the ghost transvestite. Did you remember to shave that fucking shadow this morning you fucking clown. You are an insult to all girls who want to transition. Ugggggghhhhhhh How can a man be attracted to a little white boy like yourself unleess he likes boys. Take your cracker ass back to the doctor who you paid for those mosquito bumps. Ask him for some ass and some dick like my friend got. Oh, I forgot, your white, you cant get it like that. BWWHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!! Ugly ass motherfucker. Dont you ever come for me or my friend ever again. Or I'll send animal control out to capture you in a net you fucking beast. BWHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!!!
i thought it was just me that saw this crossdresser was going too far with the botched boob job fresh off the table! And that boy ass body, could never come for me ever. Glad somebody else see's where I am coming from
The fun mirrors must be fogged up or the drugs are finally taking their toll on the few brain cells that didn't fry when she was smokin that crack!!!You know it Vanessa. This is one busted butch queen with a wig.

[melissacarter]

I smell bacon oh shit it's the brown farm animals making noise

[keepingitreal470]

I'm chucklin loser, oh and banned loser who came back under another name. Brush yr teeth you have pork breath from eating that pig

hey what was yr name before you got banned loserAre you high?? You must either be a heavy drug user or completely delusional to think you even compare with my friend. Crack is a helleva drug aint it white boy? Thank god for hung angels, cause this is the only place where a man would look at you. But the problem is they're fuckin sick demented pervs that will tell anything with a wig that it looks good. Thats your problem in a nutshell, dude. Rock on fuckin crackheaded bitch. UGLY MOTHERFUCKER!!!!!! ONE UGLY ASS DUDE.

[melissacarter]

from your cubicle you can take over the world, right pig lover? Back to work slug.

[keepingitreal470]

from your cubicle you can take over the world, right pig lover? Back to work slug.Just go away and die already cracker ass motherfucker.

[melissacarter]

lol, ok black man lol

[mimiplastique]

LMAO THIS THREAD IS LIKE A ROLLER COASTER ....

CHANGING THE TITLE ...

[melissacarter]

yes, how about "Animals and the men who love them"

[melissacarter]

Here I'll contribute to the theme

I call this one Cow on the Moon

[mimiplastique]

OMG lol JUST READING THE REST CATCHING UP

THIS HAS GOT TO BE THREAD OF THE YEAR !!!!

[tsntx]

no my thread started 2nights ago and is already 5 pages longer is the best thread ever

cow on the moon! lmao









mooo-ve over butter-face

[melissacarter]

It's deviants like this who ruin the planet fucking animals don't you know by now that's how we got venereal disease?

[melissacarter]

no my thread started 2nights ago and is already 5 pages longer is the best thread ever

TSNTX's Q&A thread was original and interesting, not just another attack thread aimed at a former friend. Say what you will about JJ, she at least thinks "out of the box."

It was all leading up to my Cow on the Moon comment, that gives the thread value

It blows my mind keepingitreal is serious about that picture on his avatar

Talk about whale-watching hey keepingitreal, show us her blowhole

[Coroner]

Hey Melissa, are you taking sides?

[Ryz]

This thread seems to be total bullshit started by an inmature person who needed some attention. But thats not the worse. As some very educational points were brought out by more mature members of the board. The most confusing part to me was this Melissa Carter character. Somebody lied to her and she ran with it, or she has fun park mirrors in her house, or doesn't use mirrors at all. I understand Mimi and Vanessa go back and forth, then Melissa jumps in where she obviously doesn't fit in. Then to use lines on Vanessa that Mimi already used shows a lack of originality. Sad that your need to fit in and be accepted has lead you to make a fool of yourself in a public forum like this. Instead of focusing all that attention on Vanessa, use that energy to better yourself and get your life together. No matter what you say about Vanessa, she is way hotter than you and has alot more going for her. You should sit back and take notes. Your work is mediocre at best and that piss poor attitude makes you look even worse. Mimi is hott, Vanessa is hott and if they go back and forth thats on them, they have personal issues, and have know each other for a while it seems. You jumping in with your bullshit, pointless comments just make you look like the looser you are.Oh shit, LMMFAO BWHAHAHAHAHAHAHA Honestly this is funny as shit. Fuckin hilarious. Fun park mirrors. OMG. I'm laughin so hard I got tears in my eyes. LMAO Damm I havent laughed this hard in a long time. I need a tissue. BWHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!!

Why don't you tell the board what your screen name was before you were banned? You should read this guy's posts on who he thinks is hot. It's a lesson to all girls do not take anything you read on here seriously.In all honesty, I could have blasted you for your looks a long time ago. I was nice about it and deceided not to. You should have kept your mouth shut. Ok. You are basically a crossdresser with misquito bumps on your chest in a wig and a skirt. Your pale as a ghost and you think somehow you have the right to talk about the way someone else looks? BWHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!! OMG!!! Where do you get the fucking gaul to talk about the way another person looks. I'm not attracted to white tgirls anyway, but your not even a tgirl. You honestly look like something is wrong with you. Sickeness? Illness? I dont know. Now. This could have been avoided had you left me alone. You started this. Remember that. My posts on who I think is hot? My friend in my avatar is hot. She's actually a tgirl unlike yourself. And your not on the same planet as her as far as looks.

Yea I'm not a tgirl I'm actually recognized as female

good luck fucking that swine I thought that picture was a joke holy shit yr serious
http://i153.photobucket.com/albums/s234/Linkytmnd/huh.jpg

[ted naves]

The bottom line, if you like Crossdressers, those who are women for short periods of time then revert back to men, most likely you are gay.


If that's what you like, then that's what you like.

I'm guessing, but, by the sounds of it, probably you.
*shrug*

Um, no I think that being gay is judged by who you fall in love with, and not, in some instances,what personal fetish you might maintain for a short amount of time.

I mean, there may be some guys here who blow, fuck, and kiss other men but don't fall in love with them. They may fall in love with women. That makes them bisexual. It's not just about the sexuality, it's about the heart. I've never grabbed a guys crotch but I've danced shirtless with them on gay dance floors before . Am I gay.No, but if I was, I'd respond just as honestly. I happen to love women but if I did fall in love with a guy, it wouldn't be by choice.

I'm bored so I'm typing..............

[ted naves]

from your cubicle you can take over the world, right pig lover? Back to work slug.Just go away and die already cracker ass motherfucker.

YEah, BTW Mods, this is racist.

Normally I wouldn't care becuase it's just words( I really don't care ) but as a society we need to start playing fairly. Once that N* word stops becoming a big deal, so will this.

[keepingitreal470]

no my thread started 2nights ago and is already 5 pages longer is the best thread ever

TSNTX's Q&A thread was original and interesting, not just another attack thread aimed at a former friend. Say what you will about JJ, she at least thinks "out of the box."

It was all leading up to my Cow on the Moon comment, that gives the thread value

It blows my mind keepingitreal is serious about that picture on his avatar

Talk about whale-watching hey keepingitreal, show us her blowholeShut the fuck up bitch. I know you use the mens bathroom, cause any woman that saw you in theirs would call the fucking cops. Not one guy on this board thinks you're hot. NOT ONE. You probably fucking stank too. Like a wet dog. www.bigdickbitch.com Thats my friend's site. You wanna know where it ranks among personal sites? At the very top motherfucker. What do you have besides a crack pipe and a 5 o'clock shadow. Ugliness makes people bitter. Your a bitter white dude that just cant pass for trans. Ugly as sin, no ass, no dick, and very manly features. My friend saw what you said and she laughed at your clown side show bob ass. Go back to the carnival a play the bearded lady like you did before electrolosis. I know you made more money doing that than your failed attempt at prostitution.

[yodajazz]

I don't see any purpose in this bickering. Is someone supposed to win? No it's more like we all lose because of the hateful words put out on this thread. There is already enough hate towards the trans community in this world. Too many people, who are not willing to let someone just live thier life. There's too much judging, and not enough loving. If we can't do it ourselves, how do we expect anyone else to do it?

It is written, that whatever you may have, it is worthless, if you don't have love. The most beautiful woman becomes ugly, when she expressing hate.

I love you all for the giving of yourself to us strangers. I love you for the strength to be who you think you need to be. I love you for bringing more beauty into humanity. But I don't not love you for finding ugliness in what I love. Yes we are all unique individuals, but we are also part of something greater than ourselves. We are a community struggling for a place in this world. So think for a minute about what you love, and realize that someone loves the same things as you do. We are fortunate to have this place, this forum. It could be gone with the flick of a switch. Think of something positive that you might miss, and appreciate it while it is here. Peace!

[Coroner]

The mods should do some dirt work.

[needsum]

Fat turd on the rocks!!!!! Holy shit I nearly puked up my breakfast after reading that!! Hahahahahahahahahaha!


http://smiliesftw.com/x/avatar54063_2.gif (http://smiliesftw.com/search.php?f=tag&q=xmas)

[melissacarter]

from your cubicle you can take over the world, right pig lover? Back to work slug.Just go away and die already cracker ass motherfucker.

YEah, BTW Mods, this is racist.

Normally I wouldn't care becuase it's just words( I really don't care ) but as a society we need to start playing fairly. Once that N* word stops becoming a big deal, so will this.

He's already been banned and is hiding behind this new name

oh wait I smell pork

[mimiplastique]

from your cubicle you can take over the world, right pig lover? Back to work slug.Just go away and die already cracker ass motherfucker.

YEah, BTW Mods, this is racist.

Normally I wouldn't care becuase it's just words( I really don't care ) but as a society we need to start playing fairly. Once that N* word stops becoming a big deal, so will this.

He's already been banned and is hiding behind this new name

oh wait I smell pork

bump

[TsVanessa69]

Here I'll contribute to the theme

I call this one Cow on the Moon
Its ok.Id rather be a cow thn an idiot like you!!!!!
you are the LAST person to talk about looks.
But bitch, I'm good. I have a job, a man and lovin life!!!!!!
No matter what some hatin fool on HA has to say, bitche aren't happy and I am!!!!
Kick rocks with you bare feet in that cornfield and I hope you decorated your trailer for Xmas!!!!!!!!!

[TsVanessa69]

This thread seems to be total bullshit started by an inmature person who needed some attention. But thats not the worse. As some very educational points were brought out by more mature members of the board. The most confusing part to me was this Melissa Carter character. Somebody lied to her and she ran with it, or she has fun park mirrors in her house, or doesn't use mirrors at all. I understand Mimi and Vanessa go back and forth, then Melissa jumps in where she obviously doesn't fit in. Then to use lines on Vanessa that Mimi already used shows a lack of originality. Sad that your need to fit in and be accepted has lead you to make a fool of yourself in a public forum like this. Instead of focusing all that attention on Vanessa, use that energy to better yourself and get your life together. No matter what you say about Vanessa, she is way hotter than you and has alot more going for her. You should sit back and take notes. Your work is mediocre at best and that piss poor attitude makes you look even worse. Mimi is hott, Vanessa is hott and if they go back and forth thats on them, they have personal issues, and have know each other for a while it seems. You jumping in with your bullshit, pointless comments just make you look like the looser you are.Oh shit, LMMFAO BWHAHAHAHAHAHAHA Honestly this is funny as shit. Fuckin hilarious. Fun park mirrors. OMG. I'm laughin so hard I got tears in my eyes. LMAO Damm I havent laughed this hard in a long time. I need a tissue. BWHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!!

Why don't you tell the board what your screen name was before you were banned? You should read this guy's posts on who he thinks is hot. It's a lesson to all girls do not take anything you read on here seriously.In all honesty, I could have blasted you for your looks a long time ago. I was nice about it and deceided not to. You should have kept your mouth shut. Ok. You are basically a crossdresser with misquito bumps on your chest in a wig and a skirt. Your pale as a ghost and you think somehow you have the right to talk about the way someone else looks? BWHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!! OMG!!! Where do you get the fucking gaul to talk about the way another person looks. I'm not attracted to white tgirls anyway, but your not even a tgirl. You honestly look like something is wrong with you. Sickeness? Illness? I dont know. Now. This could have been avoided had you left me alone. You started this. Remember that. My posts on who I think is hot? My friend in my avatar is hot. She's actually a tgirl unlike yourself. And your not on the same planet as her as far as looks.

Yea I'm not a tgirl I'm actually recognized as female

good luck fucking that swine I thought that picture was a joke holy shit yr serious
http://i153.photobucket.com/albums/s234/Linkytmnd/huh.jpg
Doesn't some of the shit that this freak says make you see the damages that are caused by excessive crack usage!!!

[ted naves]

Mimi, that's an insanely fucking hot bump. You're looking hotter and hotter every day.

[cantona5]

WOW, this is so nasty on here - is it wrong for me to sit back and enjoy this?!?!?!

[mimiplastique]

Mimi, that's an insanely fucking hot bump. You're looking hotter and hotter every day.

thank you baby

[melissacarter]

Here I'll contribute to the theme

I call this one Cow on the Moon
Its ok.Id rather be a cow thn an idiot like you!!!!!
you are the LAST person to talk about looks.
But bitch, I'm good. I have a job, a man and lovin life!!!!!!
No matter what some hatin fool on HA has to say, bitche aren't happy and I am!!!!
Kick rocks with you bare feet in that cornfield and I hope you decorated your trailer for Xmas!!!!!!!!!

You have a man?

You have a gay male prostitute

You have a job?

You're an HIV counselor but you fuck men bareback on youtube

Lovin life?

If I were you I would find the nearest razor blade but hey I have self respect

You have been made a complete fool you ought to give up before it gets worse

[TsVanessa69]

Here I'll contribute to the theme

I call this one Cow on the Moon
Its ok.Id rather be a cow thn an idiot like you!!!!!
you are the LAST person to talk about looks.
But bitch, I'm good. I have a job, a man and lovin life!!!!!!
No matter what some hatin fool on HA has to say, bitche aren't happy and I am!!!!
Kick rocks with you bare feet in that cornfield and I hope you decorated your trailer for Xmas!!!!!!!!!

You have a man?

You have a gay male prostitute

You have a job?

You're an HIV counselor but you fuck men bareback on youtube

Lovin life?

If I were you I would find the nearest razor blade but hey I have self respect

You have been made a complete fool you ought to give up before it gets worse
The only way it could get worse, is if I looked like you.
If I did have a razor blaze i would love to slide it back and forth on your throat.
How was I made a fool of?
You are the fool, an old faggot who couldn't cut it as a man so you took crossdressing to the extreme.
I love the bullshit you post, cuz this is the only place you get life.
In real life, nobody even knows who you are.

[Floyd R]

Melissa,

Why do you insist on attacking Vanessa? What has she personally done to you that warrants your attacks? My advise to you is to stay out of the feud going on between Vanessa and Mimi. You are too classy to get caught up into this mess.




Here I'll contribute to the theme

I call this one Cow on the Moon
Its ok.Id rather be a cow thn an idiot like you!!!!!
you are the LAST person to talk about looks.
But bitch, I'm good. I have a job, a man and lovin life!!!!!!
No matter what some hatin fool on HA has to say, bitche aren't happy and I am!!!!
Kick rocks with you bare feet in that cornfield and I hope you decorated your trailer for Xmas!!!!!!!!!

You have a man?

You have a gay male prostitute

You have a job?

You're an HIV counselor but you fuck men bareback on youtube

Lovin life?

If I were you I would find the nearest razor blade but hey I have self respect

You have been made a complete fool you ought to give up before it gets worse

[sugdaddie69]

Anyone who gets between other peoples disputes then takes it personally themselvesis is classless not classy

[TsVanessa69]

Anyone who gets between other peoples disputes then takes it personally themselvesis is classless not classy
Thank you very much.
Mimi started this thread to get some attention from me. Then the farmhand jumped in. I don't understand. I knew he is a crossdresser, but Mimi wasn't really addressing crossdressers, she just needed to post something to show she misses me. We already have spoken on the phone. Like others pointed out, Melissa Carter is :crap so depserate to fit in. The fun mirrors and excessive partying with farm animals has him dillusional.

[melissacarter]

Melissa,

Why do you insist on attacking Vanessa? What has she personally done to you that warrants your attacks? My advise to you is to stay out of the feud going on between Vanessa and Mimi. You are too classy to get caught up into this mess.




Here I'll contribute to the theme

I call this one Cow on the Moon
Its ok.Id rather be a cow thn an idiot like you!!!!!
you are the LAST person to talk about looks.
But bitch, I'm good. I have a job, a man and lovin life!!!!!!
No matter what some hatin fool on HA has to say, bitche aren't happy and I am!!!!
Kick rocks with you bare feet in that cornfield and I hope you decorated your trailer for Xmas!!!!!!!!!

You have a man?

You have a gay male prostitute

You have a job?

You're an HIV counselor but you fuck men bareback on youtube

Lovin life?

If I were you I would find the nearest razor blade but hey I have self respect

You have been made a complete fool you ought to give up before it gets worse

I'm too classy to make threats you're right

But I won't allow trash to talk down to me

Vanessa has been talking shit to me for as long as I can remember

Vanessa is the anti-TS, the White Castle of tgirls, her feud with Mimi is meaningless to me

I am a college graduate, well spoken, artistic, thoughtful well above the ghetto life Vanessa speaks from and it's about time she gets put in her place

Vanessa is a disgrace to the transdgender community, a cartoon image of everything we don't want to be seen as

[TsVanessa69]

Melissa,

Why do you insist on attacking Vanessa? What has she personally done to you that warrants your attacks? My advise to you is to stay out of the feud going on between Vanessa and Mimi. You are too classy to get caught up into this mess.




Here I'll contribute to the theme

I call this one Cow on the Moon
Its ok.Id rather be a cow thn an idiot like you!!!!!
you are the LAST person to talk about looks.
But bitch, I'm good. I have a job, a man and lovin life!!!!!!
No matter what some hatin fool on HA has to say, bitche aren't happy and I am!!!!
Kick rocks with you bare feet in that cornfield and I hope you decorated your trailer for Xmas!!!!!!!!!

You have a man?

You have a gay male prostitute

You have a job?

You're an HIV counselor but you fuck men bareback on youtube

Lovin life?

If I were you I would find the nearest razor blade but hey I have self respect

You have been made a complete fool you ought to give up before it gets worse

I'm too classy to make threats you're right

But I won't allow trash to talk down to me

Vanessa has been talking shit to me for as long as I can remember

Vanessa is the anti-TS, the White Castle of tgirls, her feud with Mimi is meaningless to me

I am a college graduate, well spoken, artistic, thoughtful well above the ghetto life Vanessa speaks from and it's about time she gets put in her place

Vanessa is a disgrace to the transdgender community, a cartoon image of everything we don't want to be seen as
So being a drug addict and a prostitute is what we want to be seen as? With bad fashion sense? Girl please. You just needed some attention and you choose to find it here, because you get it no where else. This HA member said it best in their e-mail to me:
I don't follow the catfights. I try and live my own life. But when ignorant bitches like Melissa post, I really feel compelled to say something.

You were attacked, provoked and it's not fair. Melissa can't even come up with a decent argument besides "ur ugly kekeke", which is pathetic.

You're a very, very attractive woman with a diva look I'd kill to have, and so would that trailer-park trashmouth Melissa. She knows it, I know it, you know it. Let her wallow in five-dollar handjob hell.

And the ghetto?? Bitch please, you live in a trailer in a cornfield.
Not a chance in hell you could ever be better than me. This is HA. I'm shure that you have more than proven your level of education with these articulate post you make :jerkoff

[TsVanessa69]

I am a college graduate, well spoken, artistic, thoughtful well above the ghetto life Vanessa speaks from and it's about time she gets put in her place

More reasons to rise above the bickering, imo.
I was unaware that the wilderness even had schools much less college.
If you were artistic you would have much better fashion sense. Maybe some sexy lingerie, perfume, a touch of gloss. You always portray a poor farm hand dreaming of making it to the big city one day. Alway barefoot and hungry. I love the shots of you laying in the cemetary with all those tombstones. I hope you don't dig up graves as a past time

[Tepres]

I am a college graduate, well spoken, artistic, thoughtful well above the ghetto life Vanessa speaks from and it's about time she gets put in her place

More reasons to rise above the bickering, imo.
I was unaware that the wilderness even had schools much less college.
If you were artistic you would have much better fashion sense. Maybe some sexy lingerie, perfume, a touch of gloss. You always portray a poor farm hand dreaming of making it to the big city one day. Alway barefoot and hungry. I love the shots of you laying in the cemetary with all those tombstones. I hope you don't dig up graves as a past time

I'm not taking sides in this argument. But the thought of having sex in a grave yard, turns me on.

[mimiplastique]

I am a college graduate, well spoken, artistic, thoughtful well above the ghetto life Vanessa speaks from and it's about time she gets put in her place

More reasons to rise above the bickering, imo.
I was unaware that the wilderness even had schools much less college.
If you were artistic you would have much better fashion sense. Maybe some sexy lingerie, perfume, a touch of gloss. You always portray a poor farm hand dreaming of making it to the big city one day. Alway barefoot and hungry. I love the shots of you laying in the cemetary with all those tombstones. I hope you don't dig up graves as a past time

I'm not taking sides in this argument. But the thought of having sex in a grave yard turns me on.WOULD THE THOUGH OF HAVING SEX WITH A DEAD BODY TURN YOU ON TOO ???