Transexuals in Prison?

[drock]

What happens to them once they get put in prison?

The reason I ask is because this one Tranny I used to know is in prison now.. I was asking another chick where she was and she told me she had been locked up for over four months, so being the conscious thinker that I am, I began to wonder what's going on with her?

Is she is a male populated and not segreated prison?

Is she allowed any harmonal treatment?

Or perhaps by chance did she get locked up with all the females???

And I hate to say this but I was also wondering was she being used as the community sex tool in the prison yard, or perhaps was she enjoying the attention from the sex starved inmates?

I know a bit out there with the last one, but i'm a curious typa guy....

[macjay18]

THat is a good question an interesting case comes to mind which is that of Sylvia boots who shot a rival transsexual. This is a good article/blog about the incident or accident however you look at things
http://butchdykeboy5326.yuku.com/topic/1428/t/Re-So-what-happened-to-Sylvia-Boots.html?page=-1

She is held in a male prison and I guess i wouldnt like to guess what would happen to a pretty little thing like her in there. But in saying that from all reports it sounds like she has had it tough in recent years (prior to prison). ie. getting shot in the head and beaten up and surviving.

[blackrob]

THat is a good question an interesting case comes to mind which is that of Sylvia boots who shot a rival transsexual. This is a good article/blog about the incident or accident however you look at things
http://butchdykeboy5326.yuku.com/topic/1428/t/Re-So-what-happened-to-Sylvia-Boots.html?page=-1

She is held in a male prison and I guess i wouldnt like to guess what would happen to a pretty little thing like her in there. But in saying that from all reports it sounds like she has had it tough in recent years (prior to prison). ie. getting shot in the head and beaten up and surviving.

i heard about her.

[KiraHarden]

What happens to them once they get put in prison?

The reason I ask is because this one Tranny I used to know is in prison now.. I was asking another chick where she was and she told me she had been locked up for over four months, so being the conscious thinker that I am, I began to wonder what's going on with her?

Is she is a male populated and not segreated prison?

Is she allowed any harmonal treatment?

Or perhaps by chance did she get locked up with all the females???

And I hate to say this but I was also wondering was she being used as the community sex tool in the prison yard, or perhaps was she enjoying the attention from the sex starved inmates?

I know a bit out there with the last one, but i'm a curious typa guy....

In wisconsiin you are held in a male prison, but seperated from gen pop

As far as hormones, if your under dr care for prescribed estrogen before arrest and serving time. They wiill provide them to you

If your doing black market estrogen. Your shit outta luck

I'm guessing these girls do have it very rough, but better than the prison biitches in there if they hook up with top guys.

Edit: I just called my brother who just got out of prison

he did say I would be highly sought after property looking the way I do and protected,(your the closest thing to a woman some of these guys will ever see again) due to breasts etc.

I would get pulled into arayan nation and be used by the top leaders and also pimped out. For drugs favors etc.

Either way its gotta still be a nightmare

[SarahG]

What happens to them once they get put in prison?

The reason I ask is because this one Tranny I used to know is in prison now.. I was asking another chick where she was and she told me she had been locked up for over four months, so being the conscious thinker that I am, I began to wonder what's going on with her?

Is she is a male populated and not segreated prison?

Is she allowed any harmonal treatment?

Or perhaps by chance did she get locked up with all the females???

And I hate to say this but I was also wondering was she being used as the community sex tool in the prison yard, or perhaps was she enjoying the attention from the sex starved inmates?

I know a bit out there with the last one, but i'm a curious typa guy....

In wisconsiin you are held in a male prison, but seperated from gen pop

As far as hormones, if your under dr care for prescribed estrogen before arrest and serving time. They wiill provide them to you

If your doing black market estrogen. Your shit outta luck

I'm guessing these girls do have it very rough, but better than the prison biitches in there if they hook up with top guys.

Edit: I just called my brother who just got out of prison

he did say I would be highly sought after property looking the way I do and protected,(your the closest thing to a woman some of these guys will ever see again) due to breasts etc.

I would get pulled into arayan nation and be used by the top leaders and also pimped out. For drugs favors etc.

Either way its gotta still be a nightmare

Actually Wisconsin won't distribute hrt to inmates, there is a state law prohibiting that state from dispensing HRT to trans inmates- only state in the country to do so. I don't know all the specifics here, the law itself is Wis. Stat. § 302.386.... there has been a couple cases regarding this law since its enactment, but they dealt with people who were already getting hrt in the wisconsin system. I suspect that any newcomer would be bound to the law and everyone already in is just "grandfathered in"- but I haven't taken the time to read either of these cases so do not hold me to that.

Some places will keep a trans inmate, especially if the sentence is short- in solitaire, or on profile thinking its safer. Either way you're almost always going to be in the male prison if preop.

If you don't get HRT with a prescription, its very hard to get it once you're in jail, even if you were DIY before.

If you have the prescription, they can have their prison doctors reevaluate what dosages to put you on.... in practice that can mean cutting your dosages down to some insignificant amount, so low you might as well not be on hrt. They do this for two reasons, one is to just be mean, and the other is to save money for the prison system. Its very common for prisons to cut back when an inmate gets in meds if its not life critical (like diabeties medicine is). I take over 18 prescriptions a day, I am sure I wouldn't be getting most of them if I were in most systems.

[KiraHarden]

What happens to them once they get put in prison?

The reason I ask is because this one Tranny I used to know is in prison now.. I was asking another chick where she was and she told me she had been locked up for over four months, so being the conscious thinker that I am, I began to wonder what's going on with her?

Is she is a male populated and not segreated prison?

Is she allowed any harmonal treatment?

Or perhaps by chance did she get locked up with all the females???

And I hate to say this but I was also wondering was she being used as the community sex tool in the prison yard, or perhaps was she enjoying the attention from the sex starved inmates?

I know a bit out there with the last one, but i'm a curious typa guy....

In wisconsiin you are held in a male prison, but seperated from gen pop

As far as hormones, if your under dr care for prescribed estrogen before arrest and serving time. They wiill provide them to you

If your doing black market estrogen. Your shit outta luck

I'm guessing these girls do have it very rough, but better than the prison biitches in there if they hook up with top guys.

Edit: I just called my brother who just got out of prison

he did say I would be highly sought after property looking the way I do and protected,(your the closest thing to a woman some of these guys will ever see again) due to breasts etc.

I would get pulled into arayan nation and be used by the top leaders and also pimped out. For drugs favors etc.

Either way its gotta still be a nightmare

Actually Wisconsin won't distribute hrt to inmates, there is a state law prohibiting that state from dispensing HRT to trans inmates- only state in the country to do so. I don't know all the specifics here, the law itself is Wis. Stat. § 302.386.... there has been a couple cases regarding this law since its enactment, but they dealt with people who were already getting hrt in the wisconsin system. I suspect that any newcomer would be bound to the law and everyone already in is just "grandfathered in"- but I haven't taken the time to read either of these cases so do not hold me to that.

Some places will keep a trans inmate, especially if the sentence is short- in solitaire, or on profile thinking its safer. Either way you're almost always going to be in the male prison if preop.

If you don't get HRT with a prescription, its very hard to get it once you're in jail, even if you were DIY before.

If you have the prescription, they can have their prison doctors reevaluate what dosages to put you on.... in practice that can mean cutting your dosages down to some insignificant amount, so low you might as well not be on hrt. They do this for two reasons, one is to just be mean, and the other is to save money for the prison system. Its very common for prisons to cut back when an inmate gets in meds if its not life critical (like diabeties medicine is). I take over 18 prescriptions a day, I am sure I wouldn't be getting most of them if I were in most systems.

If your all ready under care for gid and taking presribed estrogen. Before entering the wisconsin penal system. You will receive treatment to continue.
My testicles are gone, I need very little estrogen. I have to be on either estrogen or testosterone to fuction properly

[SarahG]

What happens to them once they get put in prison?

The reason I ask is because this one Tranny I used to know is in prison now.. I was asking another chick where she was and she told me she had been locked up for over four months, so being the conscious thinker that I am, I began to wonder what's going on with her?

Is she is a male populated and not segreated prison?

Is she allowed any harmonal treatment?

Or perhaps by chance did she get locked up with all the females???

And I hate to say this but I was also wondering was she being used as the community sex tool in the prison yard, or perhaps was she enjoying the attention from the sex starved inmates?

I know a bit out there with the last one, but i'm a curious typa guy....

In wisconsiin you are held in a male prison, but seperated from gen pop

As far as hormones, if your under dr care for prescribed estrogen before arrest and serving time. They wiill provide them to you

If your doing black market estrogen. Your shit outta luck

I'm guessing these girls do have it very rough, but better than the prison biitches in there if they hook up with top guys.

Edit: I just called my brother who just got out of prison

he did say I would be highly sought after property looking the way I do and protected,(your the closest thing to a woman some of these guys will ever see again) due to breasts etc.

I would get pulled into arayan nation and be used by the top leaders and also pimped out. For drugs favors etc.

Either way its gotta still be a nightmare

Actually Wisconsin won't distribute hrt to inmates, there is a state law prohibiting that state from dispensing HRT to trans inmates- only state in the country to do so. I don't know all the specifics here, the law itself is Wis. Stat. § 302.386.... there has been a couple cases regarding this law since its enactment, but they dealt with people who were already getting hrt in the wisconsin system. I suspect that any newcomer would be bound to the law and everyone already in is just "grandfathered in"- but I haven't taken the time to read either of these cases so do not hold me to that.

Some places will keep a trans inmate, especially if the sentence is short- in solitaire, or on profile thinking its safer. Either way you're almost always going to be in the male prison if preop.

If you don't get HRT with a prescription, its very hard to get it once you're in jail, even if you were DIY before.

If you have the prescription, they can have their prison doctors reevaluate what dosages to put you on.... in practice that can mean cutting your dosages down to some insignificant amount, so low you might as well not be on hrt. They do this for two reasons, one is to just be mean, and the other is to save money for the prison system. Its very common for prisons to cut back when an inmate gets in meds if its not life critical (like diabeties medicine is). I take over 18 prescriptions a day, I am sure I wouldn't be getting most of them if I were in most systems.

If your all ready under care for gid and taking presribed estrogen. Before entering the wisconsin penal system. You will receive treatment to continue.
My testicles are gone, I need very little estrogen. I have to be estrogen or testosterone to fuction

Has the law been overturned completely or repealed then?

Because that's the only way you'd be able to legally receive hrt- of any kind- in the Wisconsin state jails. This law doesn't care whether you're getting HRT diy or threw a prescription. You could be diagnosed & treated by Blanchard himself, it won't matter.

[Remy757Photog]

Down her in Virginia, they will give you hormone treatment even if you weren't perscribed to them prior to arrest. You just have to meet with the inhouse social worker (for mental issues) and then jail doctor provides them to you. They give girls without breast the option of going to solitary or staying in gen pop. If you have breast, and staying more than 30 days you automatically go to a Regional Prison where they have a section set aside for gays and tg's. In Regional Prison they don't have to stay in that section, but if a fight breaks out over the girl, they will move her there.

I've heard girls talk about the "Life" they got from inmates in jail, lending the impression that while it may have sucked (no pun intended) they still made the most out of it.

[dave252]

in connecticut here are the factors, if the unit is functional, male prison, if not, womans facility. they get their hormones. very tough for the ones who end up in male prisons, small framed, light skinned males are targets of rape, so imagine the risk of a ts.

[drock]

What happens to them once they get put in prison?

The reason I ask is because this one Tranny I used to know is in prison now.. I was asking another chick where she was and she told me she had been locked up for over four months, so being the conscious thinker that I am, I began to wonder what's going on with her?

Is she is a male populated and not segreated prison?

Is she allowed any harmonal treatment?

Or perhaps by chance did she get locked up with all the females???

And I hate to say this but I was also wondering was she being used as the community sex tool in the prison yard, or perhaps was she enjoying the attention from the sex starved inmates?

I know a bit out there with the last one, but i'm a curious typa guy....

In wisconsiin you are held in a male prison, but seperated from gen pop

As far as hormones, if your under dr care for prescribed estrogen before arrest and serving time. They wiill provide them to you

If your doing black market estrogen. Your shit outta luck

I'm guessing these girls do have it very rough, but better than the prison biitches in there if they hook up with top guys.

Edit: I just called my brother who just got out of prison

he did say I would be highly sought after property looking the way I do and protected,(your the closest thing to a woman some of these guys will ever see again) due to breasts etc.

I would get pulled into arayan nation and be used by the top leaders and also pimped out. For drugs favors etc.

Either way its gotta still be a nightmare

Well I guess the laws of different states vary. The state this chick is Texas, so hopefully they have similar laws there. At first when I didn't see her in a while I thought that she had been deported back to Mexico or something because I don't even think she's a legal citizen, so that could be a whole different scenerio but then again often times they get better treatment than citizens do.. lol.

That's kind of what I was thinking that trannys would be highly sought after, but damn you'd be put in the "Arayan Nation? You might just start a riot from the different gangs wanting to claim you?lol.

[drock]

For some odd reason I thought Sylvia Boots was out of jail but I guess I was wrong about that.

Also I was watching this other tranny vid and this chick who goes by the name of Foxxy said that she'd just got out prison and did a lot of bottoming for the guys in the joint. I don't know if she was kidding or not, but it didn't sound like she was joking about it???

[Shining Star]

IIRC, in NYC if one is in a city lock up (jail), trannies who are pre-op are in the male section, however are isolated in their own cells, unless another trannie comes in, then they bunk up. Rikers Island has a section for gay and transgendered persons.

NYS, I *think*, follows the same sort of thing, for persons who are sent off to prison.

Have heard stories from trannies busted for prossing and had to spend anywhere from a night or two in a NYC local lock up, to serious time at Rikers Island (one month to just about a year), and in all cases am here to tell you the thing to do is keep yourself out of either at any costs.

While it is true trannies and gays often are isolated in jail/prison, that does not mean things are going to be any better in the company of all trannies. If you are not of the "street" and know how to survive on the inside, many of those same trannies and gays can be just as bad as anything in the general population. Least in GP a trannie or gay and become a b**ch to a top dog and thus have some protection. Can honestly say don't even want to think about what that sort of relationship might be like with a butch lesbian trannie calling the shots.

Don't forget guards in prison aren't above pulling stunts either, so a girl can be in a bad situation either way.

Have also heard being in protective custody is not it's all cracked up to be because one's activities are more restricted.

Say if the trannie wants to take a shower, unless there is some sort of section just for trannies, the girl is going to have to wait for a guard to be free to escort her, wait and take her back. This goes on everytime anyone in PC wants to go anywhere. If there isn't a guard available, then tough cheese, one has to wait. There are some inmates who could be in PC, but for the reason above and others, opt to join the GP.

Overall various federal, state and local laws, along with court decisions spell out that while in state custody, the state has the responsibility to insure the safety and security of all inmates.

Thus a very feminine looking trannie with bosom and the rest is not likely to become the cell mate of any "man". Nor is she likely to be allowed to wander around the GP.

[yodajazz]

Here's a post with and interesting perspective. She spent time in a men's jail as a pre op and a women's jail as a post op.

http://www.hungangels.com/board/viewtopic.php?p=518626&highlight=#518626

[NYCe]

IIRC, in NYC if one is in a city lock up (jail), trannies who are pre-op are in the male section, however are isolated in their own cells, unless another trannie comes in, then they bunk up. Rikers Island has a section for gay and transgendered persons.

They closed the gay and transgendered dorm at Rikers and turned it into a P.C. (Protective Custody) building. Most of the trannies are in gen pop now.

[Space_Cowboy]

i recon your friend is the prison bike right now, it would be like tossing a steak into a pool of piranha.

[SarahG]

IIRC, in NYC if one is in a city lock up (jail), trannies who are pre-op are in the male section, however are isolated in their own cells, unless another trannie comes in, then they bunk up. Rikers Island has a section for gay and transgendered persons.

They closed the gay and transgendered dorm at Rikers and turned it into a P.C. (Protective Custody) building. Most of the trannies are in gen pop now.

Wouldn't be the only system to do so. Seems having a "LGBT section" is a dying concept in corrections.

[SarahG]

What you need to know about the Wisconsin § 302.386(5m), enacted January 6, 2006, also known as the “Inmate Sex Change Prevention Act.”

In bill form back in 2005 this was;


2005 − 2006 Legislature
LRB−1941/2
GMM:jld:rs
ASSEMBLY BILL 184

For further information see the state fiscal estimate, which will be printed as
an appendix to this bill. The people of the state of Wisconsin, represented in senate and assembly, do enact as follows:
SECTION
1. 302.386 (5m) of the statutes is created to read:
302.386 (5m) (a) In this subsection:

1. “Hormonal therapy” means the use of hormones to stimulate the
development or alteration of a person’s sexual characteristics in order to alter the person’s physical appearance so that the person appears more like the opposite gender.
2. “Sexual reassignment surgery” means surgical procedures to alter a person’s physical appearance so that the person appears more like the opposite gender.
(b) The department may not authorize the payment of any funds or the use of any resources of this state or the payment of any federal funds passing through the state treasury to provide or to facilitate the provision of hormonal therapy or sexual reassignment surgery for a resident or patient specified in sub. (1).

SECTION 2.0 Initial applicability.
(1) PROVISION OF HORMONAL THERAPY OR SEXUAL REASSIGNMENT SURGERY.
This act first applies to hormonal therapy, as defined in section 302.386 (5m) (a) 1. of the statutes, as created by this act, or sexual reassignment surgery, as defined in section 302.386 (5m) (a) 2. of the statutes, as created by this act, provided on the effective date of this subsection

Then, starting in 2006 with this bill AS THE LAW OF WISCONSIN, corrections immediately went to town and cut EVERY TRANS INMATE IN THE SYSTEM'S HRT DOSAGES IN HALF starting on January 12, 2006

The system then cut off hrt completely on March 13, 2006. Several inmates filed, and got a temporary injunction but it wasn't in effect until AUGUST of 2006.

http://64.233.169.104/search?q=cache:ulqRSeRqi0YJ:bulk.resource.org/courts.gov/pacer/wisconsin/wiedce/2:2006cv00112/39527/10/0.pdf+%C2%A7+302.386(5m)&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=1&gl=us

Yet it seems that the law was still, for some inmates- being followed at least through another year... and in 2007 another inmate had to file a separate temporary injunction, and that one wasn't put into effect until October 2007:

http://64.233.169.104/search?q=cache:fskElgKEKQIJ:bulk.resource.org/courts.gov/pacer/wisconsin/wiedce/2:2007cv00928/44918/7/0.pdf+%C2%A7+302.386(5m)&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=2&gl=us

I can find separate cases were some prisoners were able to successfully join the temp injunction, but in no cases has this law been overturned.

The wonderful (<-Sarcasm) Wisconsin state government had this to say about HRT:

In the official press release announcing the passage of the Inmate Sex Change Prevention Act, state legislators skeptically characterized GID as “a condition in which people claim to feel ‘uncomfortable’ with their biological sex” (emphasis added); further, the legislators referred to hormone therapy and gender-related surgery as “bizarre treat-
ments,” “experimental,” and, in the prison context, amounting to “extreme prison make-overs.” Press Release, Wisconsin Legislature, Suder/Kanavas “Inmate Sex Change Prevention Act” Becomes Law (Jan. 6, 2006), http://www.legis.state.wi.us/assembly/asm
69/news/Press.Suder%20Inmate%20Sex%20Change%20Gov.%20Signi ng.1-6-06.htm

Source for above quote: http://64.233.169.104/search?q=cache:2oplTMIuCVYJ:www.law.harvard.edu/students/orgs/jlg/vol312/447-472.pdf+%C2%A7+302.386(5m)&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=5&gl=us



Then in August 2007, the trans inmates in the system with help from the ACLU and LAMBDA Legal tried to get this to be a class-action lawsuit. Being trans, the odds in the legal system were stacked against them, and the US District Judge (http://newyorklawschool.typepad.com/leonardlink/2007/08/hormone-treatme.html) involved denied the request, after arguing that some on the list weren't even trans (as if he has the credentials to diagnose strangers...).

However none of these efforts have born fruit- THIS IS STILL THE LAW OF WISCONSIN AS OF TODAY, don't believe me? Look up 302.386 5m for yourself:
http://www.legis.state.wi.us/statutes/Stat0302.pdf

See page 18.

I even made it easy for you all and attached a screen shot of the law (below).

So here's my commentary:
1- Wisconsin's state politicians have no trouble violating the civil liberties of trans citizens of that state.
2- You can't assume everyone in the system is there from their own actions. Innocent people do, and in the case of trans people- often, get falsely accused, falsely convicted, and deal with a sense of "justice[?]" that is different entirely from what "Joe the Plumber" would be facing for the same crime(s).
3- Even with the heavy hitters like the ACLU onboard, this law hasn't been overturned. As an individual, do not assume you'll be able to fair any better- you'd be dead wrong.
4- I can't even find anyone going out of their way to fight this bill as of today (Oct. 2008), so for now at least, the law is here to stay.
5- If you're trans, don't live in Wisconsin. If you end up in prison, even if you have a clear GID diagnosis, even if you get HRT with slips- there is NO WAY TO KNOW if you'll be able to get hrt, in fact the odds would be against it, THE LAW WOULD BE AGAINST IT, and even if your legal challenges are successful, it would mean going off HRT for who knows how many months or years while your legal actions are pending!

[Shining Star]

Riker's Island is part of the New York City Corrections Department, thus a local "jail" if one likes. Thus not just for those who commit felonies, but any crime.

Jails in the United States, normally are local and where accused persons are locked up either awhile awaiting trial and or sentence, or serving time for minor offences of which the term is less than one year. Convicted felons, those committed to serve longer than one year are transferred to state custody, that is to say sent to prison.

In many local areas such as NYC, trannies make up a good part of "jail" population because of the prossing.

Ever since Mayor G and his "quality of life" bit, all prossing arrests (along with other what were once considered "minor" crimes like fare beating, smoking a joint in the street, etc) are now put through the system, that is to say processed. Which means the accused will spend some time in jail. Could be one night, could be longer.

NYC has also developed something called "Community Based Courts" to deal with "minor" offences, which are designed to make sure that such things, including prossing are not handled lightly.

Again under Mayor G, there was a feeling in both government and the community that minor offenders were getting a "slap on the wrist" and dealt with lightly for many reasons, including over crowding and high case loads in the criminal justice/court system. Many times judges would either dismiss or deal with such offences lightly, just to free up the docket. Well not any more.

Community courts are designed to make sure the offenders are not only "punished" but can receive services if required.

Prossing arrests are community courts serve not only some jail time (usually overnight, but can be longer), but are fined and must do community service as well (just like Naomi Campbell).

Lately, perhaps in response to the "explosion" of prossing in NYC, LE, and the courts have been cracking the whip. From what one hears even prosses with first offences are being sent down for terms of one month (30 days), up to a year upon conviction.

As for closing gay/trannie sections and moving such persons into the GP, it sort of makes sense and can be blamed in large part to the "gay rights" movement.

Think about it; years ago there weren't that many trannies, nor openly gay persons, at least not routinely involved in a criminal lifestyle, however today one sees scores of adverts on Eros and other places for prossing. Even if only a fraction of such persons are arrested, it represents a substantial increase in population. States and local governments already spend vast sums on correction departments, and like large businesses, saw value in merging "departments" to save costs.

It is not just prossing that brings trannies and gays into the system. There is a whole world of "thugs", if that is the right word of trannies that rob, assult, steal and everything else that goes with the word. The Christopher Street/Water front area of NYC used to be a quiet gay stroll and such, even with the prossing down by the Meat Packing area, but for awhile that changed when serious street types invaded and began commiting crimes not only on "dates", but anyone else in the area as well.


Taxpayers aren't going to complain, after all most think those in jail/prison have too good a life anyway at their expense.

Will say one thing about trannies going to jail or prison. From dealing with those who have sadly had the experience, it can be a life changing event.

Girls who thought prossing was just a "game" and took things lightly, have a vastly different view once they hear what the state calls them (prostitutes), and get put through the system. To those not expecting nor accustomed to such things, incarceration can be a hard thing to deal with. The hard closing of those doors and the clink of those locks is NOT a pleasant sound.

Be it in a local lock up or prison, the result is the same, you are no longer in control of your life for the most part. You go where someone tells you to go, when they tell you to go. You do what someone tells you to do when they tell you to do it. What you can and cannot do is under someone else's say so.

Some girls come out and at once change their lives, or try to, others for various reasons fall right back into the life they had before.

Problem today is because of all the mandatory sentencing and arrests, coupled along with the new information age, it is VERY difficult if not impossible to hide an arrest and or incarceration. For a someone already being the 8 ball, this can only make things worse. Within days or a few weeks of an arrest or incarceration, simply "Googling" a persons name or DOB will bring everything up, which makes finding a job, apartment, or even a partner very difficult.

[KiraHarden]

What you need to know about the Wisconsin § 302.386(5m), enacted January 6, 2006, also known as the ?Inmate Sex Change Prevention Act.?

In bill form back in 2005 this was;


2005 ? 2006 Legislature
LRB?1941/2
GMM:jld:rs
ASSEMBLY BILL 184

For further information see the state fiscal estimate, which will be printed as
an appendix to this bill. The people of the state of Wisconsin, represented in senate and assembly, do enact as follows:
SECTION
1. 302.386 (5m) of the statutes is created to read:
302.386 (5m) (a) In this subsection:

1. ?Hormonal therapy? means the use of hormones to stimulate the
development or alteration of a person?s sexual characteristics in order to alter the person?s physical appearance so that the person appears more like the opposite gender.
2. ?Sexual reassignment surgery? means surgical procedures to alter a person?s physical appearance so that the person appears more like the opposite gender.
(b) The department may not authorize the payment of any funds or the use of any resources of this state or the payment of any federal funds passing through the state treasury to provide or to facilitate the provision of hormonal therapy or sexual reassignment surgery for a resident or patient specified in sub. (1).

SECTION 2.0 Initial applicability.
(1) PROVISION OF HORMONAL THERAPY OR SEXUAL REASSIGNMENT SURGERY.
This act first applies to hormonal therapy, as defined in section 302.386 (5m) (a) 1. of the statutes, as created by this act, or sexual reassignment surgery, as defined in section 302.386 (5m) (a) 2. of the statutes, as created by this act, provided on the effective date of this subsection

Then, starting in 2006 with this bill AS THE LAW OF WISCONSIN, corrections immediately went to town and cut EVERY TRANS INMATE IN THE SYSTEM'S HRT DOSAGES IN HALF starting on January 12, 2006

The system then cut off hrt completely on March 13, 2006. Several inmates filed, and got a temporary injunction but it wasn't in effect until AUGUST of 2006.

http://64.233.169.104/search?q=cache:ulqRSeRqi0YJ:bulk.resource.org/courts.gov/pacer/wisconsin/wiedce/2:2006cv00112/39527/10/0.pdf+%C2%A7+302.386(5m)&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=1&gl=us

Yet it seems that the law was still, for some inmates- being followed at least through another year... and in 2007 another inmate had to file a separate temporary injunction, and that one wasn't put into effect until October 2007:

http://64.233.169.104/search?q=cache:fskElgKEKQIJ:bulk.resource.org/courts.gov/pacer/wisconsin/wiedce/2:2007cv00928/44918/7/0.pdf+%C2%A7+302.386(5m)&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=2&gl=us

I can find separate cases were some prisoners were able to successfully join the temp injunction, but in no cases has this law been overturned.

The wonderful (<-Sarcasm) Wisconsin state government had this to say about HRT:

In the official press release announcing the passage of the Inmate Sex Change Prevention Act, state legislators skeptically characterized GID as ?a condition in which people claim to feel ?uncomfortable? with their biological sex? (emphasis added); further, the legislators referred to hormone therapy and gender-related surgery as ?bizarre treat-
ments,? ?experimental,? and, in the prison context, amounting to ?extreme prison make-overs.? Press Release, Wisconsin Legislature, Suder/Kanavas ?Inmate Sex Change Prevention Act? Becomes Law (Jan. 6, 2006), http://www.legis.state.wi.us/assembly/asm
69/news/Press.Suder%20Inmate%20Sex%20Change%20Gov.%20Signi ng.1-6-06.htm

Source for above quote: http://64.233.169.104/search?q=cache:2oplTMIuCVYJ:www.law.harvard.edu/students/orgs/jlg/vol312/447-472.pdf+%C2%A7+302.386(5m)&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=5&gl=us



Then in August 2007, the trans inmates in the system with help from the ACLU and LAMBDA Legal tried to get this to be a class-action lawsuit. Being trans, the odds in the legal system were stacked against them, and the US District Judge (http://newyorklawschool.typepad.com/leonardlink/2007/08/hormone-treatme.html) involved denied the request, after arguing that some on the list weren't even trans (as if he has the credentials to diagnose strangers...).

However none of these efforts have born fruit- THIS IS STILL THE LAW OF WISCONSIN AS OF TODAY, don't believe me? Look up 302.386 5m for yourself:
http://www.legis.state.wi.us/statutes/Stat0302.pdf

See page 18.

I even made it easy for you all and attached a screen shot of the law (below).

So here's my commentary:
1- Wisconsin's state politicians have no trouble violating the civil liberties of trans citizens of that state.
2- You can't assume everyone in the system is there from their own actions. Innocent people do, and in the case of trans people- often, get falsely accused, falsely convicted, and deal with a sense of "justice[?]" that is different entirely from what "Joe the Plumber" would be facing for the same crime(s).
3- Even with the heavy hitters like the ACLU onboard, this law hasn't been overturned. As an individual, do not assume you'll be able to fair any better- you'd be dead wrong.
4- I can't even find anyone going out of their way to fight this bill as of today (Oct. 2008), so for now at least, the law is here to stay.
5- If you're trans, don't live in Wisconsin. If you end up in prison, even if you have a clear GID diagnosis, even if you get HRT with slips- there is NO WAY TO KNOW if you'll be able to get hrt, in fact the odds would be against it, THE LAW WOULD BE AGAINST IT, and even if your legal challenges are successful, it would mean going off HRT for who knows how many months or years while your legal actions are pending!

No if your a trans, dont be a stupid ho and break the law, that's what that means you put yours self there. Your not getting hrt due to your own actions

Why give free hrt to a felon, that money should be going to a law abiding tg anyway.

Now some of these bitches think the state should pay for srs as well while they do time. Fuck that!
I was giving estrogen in jail... I got mine lol. Did I deserve it. Fuck no,

would I cry about it if they had said no.
No I woudnt

I would look in mirror and put blaMe where blame is due.

L

[Shining Star]

IIRC, by various laws and court decisions, if one is under any sort of medical treatment prior, the system must provide same. Things get a bit different when "men" who previously have shown no "gay" interest or such declare themselves to be "transgendered" and wish prison officials/the state to supply the required medications and medical care.

If one "Googles" transgendered in prison, there are many court cases of persons suing the state to force prison officals to supply the above, with various results. IIRC, there is an ongoing case in the Boston area.

Jail, per se is not that much of a deal, since in theory one will be out in less than one year. However if one is doing ten, twenty or more years, or even life, that is a different story.

Courts have held that prisons must provide the same medical care equal to what the local population could receive, nevermind if the inmate would be able to pay for it on the outside. Prisons have been forced or did so on their own to provide all sorts of expensive medical care, even to inmates who are on life or even death row. We speaking of kidney or other organ transplants, and other serious and expensive medical care.

In turn some states have responded by doing what is called "compassionate release". Which merely means releasing an ill inmate before his sentence is over. While in theory this may seem like a good thing, often it is nothing more than dumping an ill, often seriously ill person onto the streets to fend for themselves. Yes, state and local "welfare" is supposed to pick up from there, but that often does not happen, the the person usually dies of their illness.

It is a sad commentary on the United States, that for many inmates of state and federal prisons, they receive the best medical care in their lives.

[SarahG]

IIRC, by various laws and court decisions, if one is under any sort of medical treatment prior, the system must provide same.

Except in Wisconsin, a few girls have gotten temporary injunctions but the law has not been overturned, it's still on the books, the injunctions aren't for ever, and not all girls have been successful at getting them. Google with the information in my prior post if you don't believe me.



No if your a trans, dont be a stupid ho and break the law, that's what that means you put yours self there. Your not getting hrt due to your own actions

Why give free hrt to a felon, that money should be going to a law abiding tg anyway.

Now some of these bitches think the state should pay for srs as well while they do time. Fuck that!
I was giving estrogen in jail... I got mine lol. Did I deserve it. Fuck no,

would I cry about it if they had said no.
No I woudnt

I would look in mirror and put blaMe where blame is due.

L

There are a few problems with that:

1) A significant chunk of people in our exploding prison population (which, by the way, is a bigger portion of our population then you'll find anywhere else, in any other country- in the world) haven't done anything illegal. Look at how many capital cases have had someone falsely convicted, only to be let free with an "oops, sorry about that" 20 years later. If that can happen with capital cases, you can bet on it being worse for lesser crimes, because the "bar" is lower so to speak. Someone on death row is going to have a better chance at overturning a false conviction then someone doing 10 years on a lesser crime (this is partly why capital punishment is more expensive than life imprisonment, all the legal challenges add up for the taxpayers, fast).

2) It would be fairly easy to show there is a bias in the system on every level when dealing with trans citizens, whether it be with police, courts, or corrections. A tgirl accused of a crime is not going to get the same sense of justice that Joe the white Plumber would be getting. So any problems already noted (see #1) will be even worse, when the accused is trans.

3) The cost of HRT is, in the grand scheme of health care programs (be they the VA, medicare, medicaid, or corrections) negligible. Its not going to break any budget by covering it, because trans people make up such a small percentage of the population, and of those who claim they are trans- not everyone is going to get that diagnosis (on the inside or the outside).

4) Health of inmates is, at least on paper- taken seriously. There are ethical and legal implications when an inmate's health is neglected. A lot of people think its crazy that most states with executions, can't execute those who are ill or having major health problems addressed... this is to discourage situations in which people are beaten, tortured and raped for days, weeks, months or years leading up to an execution (after all, why care if they're just going to be killed anyway? right?). This is the United States, we don't (on paper) do shit like that, and for important reasons. Corrections are ethically and legally required to cater to the health needs of inmates for a nearly infinitely long list of noncritical medical conditions (that is to say; situations where the failure to treat does not result in direct physical death). You don't see prisons being able to go, at least legally; "well, you know what, if I don't give you this then it won't kill you, so shutup and go back to your cell." This scenario doesn't change when the inmate is trans.

5) Prisons cannot just remove HRT access from trans inmates that have been getting them already on the inside because of double jeopardy concerns. Especially in cases where a plea bargain was made, the inmate made that plea with the understanding that they'd continue to get HRT on the inside (depending on the situation the DA might have even made that part of the deal). Revoking that medication would be comparable to retroactively harshening their sentence, if not also cruel and unusual punishment.

I realize our country has a "well, if you do something bad- then deal with it" attitude, but that doesn't mean we can do whatever we want to inmates, and it doesn't mean that all inmates are rightfully accused, rightfully convicted, or rightfully punished for their crimes.

[KiraHarden]

The sky is falling, (he sky is faliing.

[brickcitybrother]

I don't know what the reality is like for most but there is a US Supreme Court case about a TS who was placed in prison in Gen Pop. It was a very sad state of affairs.

[justatransgirl]

Kira - your comment from your brother made me giggle. A guy who works for me is a member of the AB. He didn't know I was trans when I hired him and I was a little concerned when I found out about him. Then when he found out I was trans, he was like "oh I knew a t-girl girl in prison." Totally cool with it.

As to the housing thing here's a question for you legal folks.

I am legally a female. I have a court order AND (soon will have) a birth certificate that says so. I have had an orchiectomy, BUT, I still have a penis. So legally I am a woman without internal sex organs and with a protruding large clitoris.

So... the question is if I went to jail would they be required to house me in a womens jail? Because I am legally a woman. Or would they put me with the men because I have a penis?

It gets into an interesting legal definition of who and what makes a woman.

Hugs,
TS Jamie :-)

[KiraHarden]

Kira - your comment from your brother made me giggle. A guy who works for me is a member of the AB. He didn't know I was trans when I hired him and I was a little concerned when I found out about him. Then when he found out I was trans, he was like "oh I knew a t-girl girl in prison." Totally cool with it.

As to the housing thing here's a question for you legal folks.

I am legally a female. I have a court order AND (soon will have) a birth certificate that says so. I have had an orchiectomy, BUT, I still have a penis. So legally I am a woman without internal sex organs and with a protruding large clitoris.

So... the question is if I went to jail would they be required to house me in a womens jail? Because I am legally a woman. Or would they put me with the men because I have a penis?

It gets into an interesting legal definition of who and what makes a woman.

Hugs,
TS Jamie :-)

Good to see you back girl

[SarahG]

Kira - your comment from your brother made me giggle. A guy who works for me is a member of the AB. He didn't know I was trans when I hired him and I was a little concerned when I found out about him. Then when he found out I was trans, he was like "oh I knew a t-girl girl in prison." Totally cool with it.

As to the housing thing here's a question for you legal folks.

I am legally a female. I have a court order AND (soon will have) a birth certificate that says so. I have had an orchiectomy, BUT, I still have a penis. So legally I am a woman without internal sex organs and with a protruding large clitoris.

So... the question is if I went to jail would they be required to house me in a womens jail? Because I am legally a woman. Or would they put me with the men because I have a penis?

It gets into an interesting legal definition of who and what makes a woman.

Hugs,
TS Jamie :-)

Would probably depend on whether that's determined by the actual law of a given state, or the policies of corrections of a given state.

If the state law determines what prison people go to, then it might boil down to what that state's legal definition of a girl is. If its the correction's policy, then it could be anything including genitalia, even if you're legally female.

Also just because you're legally female in one state, doesn't mean you would be in another. That's why postops can't marry GB's in all states (and why postop marriages wouldn't be recognized in every state).

The feds would probably go by what it takes to get a passport, which like with the SSA- would require the full surgery notes; which would reveal you haven't had SRS, and you'd be off to the male fed prisons. Even if you can get the feds to issue you a passport and change their SSA records- using new female documentation from CA, that doesn't mean those changes would hold up to legal scrutiny.

But for a state, especially a state that says you're legally female knowing you haven't had srs... then in that state specifically, you'd think it would allow you to go to a female prison. BUT, I can also see this being one of those odd cases that would require litigation in order to have a solid answer, even if there are laws outlining what prisons people go to already.

Thought to ponder: what would the state you're in do with a hermaphrodite? Do they even know (probably not...right?)? The system might not designed to deal with unusual cases.

Is the sky falling? Well no, but it would suck to be thrown in the male prison, in a state that says you're legally female, for who knows how long while the issue plays out in court. It would suck even more if you didn't do what you were charged with, or if that state, after arresting you- decided that HRT access should be revoked from trans inmates of all types (however I would think that decision would be an unlikely one in CA... yet it is telling that Wisconsin is the only state to try this, and not Tenn or Ohio which are known for bad trans related state policies & laws).

A lot of states define sex by blood (XX vs XY), in theory you could have someone who is intersexed who has a functional vagina but is XY, all from birth, would have a female BC originally, and whose blood situation wouldnt be known right away (meaning all their documentation is female from the start). Assuming this person doesn't transition as a FtM would, then you have someone who is legally male but has all female genitalia naturally... in texas the person would be legally male, regardless what their paperwork says... I kinda doubt texas would send such an individual to the male prison, but I can see it confusing the hell out of the bureaucrats- forcing the issue into the courts.

[APD2]

The BBC did a documentary on San Quentin recently....

From 1.40 Louis interviews a transgendered inmate:
http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=ZC57JubKx20&feature=related

[JohnnyWalkerBlackLabel]

Before: http://blogs.bet.com/entertainment/whattheflick/wp-content/uploads/2008/07/tyler_perry2.jpg

Jail http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZO7-QJGVdM4&feature=related

After http://i112.photobucket.com/albums/n173/dlp705534/Madea.gif

Nuff Said

[blckhaze]

Before: http://blogs.bet.com/entertainment/whattheflick/wp-content/uploads/2008/07/tyler_perry2.jpg

Jail http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZO7-QJGVdM4&feature=related

After http://i112.photobucket.com/albums/n173/dlp705534/Madea.gif

Nuff Said


LMAO
*wonders how many heads this joke will go over, and laughs harder*

[Shining Star]

Think it would allcome down to what is between one's legs. The potential for disaster by putting any sort of "male" (pardon the term), in a true female population, out weights the emotional concerns of the trannine being with men.

A "male" in a women's lock-up would be just as much a target or perhaps sought after as a "female" in the male section. Consider also there are just as many females that "hate" trannies as males, so things might not be any easier on that side of the fence. At least in the male population a trannie can find a husband for protection. A pre-op trannie whose member does not function is of no use to any woman, thus has little or no bargining power.

For the most part it is all going to boil down to gender as defined by visable sexual organs down below. Even if a six-foot two linebacker post-op was put in to lock-up, despite her apperance, she is not going to go in with the male population, because she has a vagina. Either she will go with the females, or other arrangements will have to be made.

Id means something and nothing as far as various federal and local agencies are concerned. There are many pre-op trannies running around with various IDs saying female, but that hasn't stopped them from being listed as "male" by the court and correctional system. You can research this further by examining the arrest, court and correction records (all of which are public information), and looking for pre-ops known to you and see what gender is listed. Or, simply as any trannie you know that has been busted to show you her papers.

[Shining Star]

Once again I say, think many girls have the same deluded ideas about jail/prison as they do about womanhood. Speaking with or (god forbid), being arrested and locked-up will quickly disabuse anyone of any fancy notions.

Long story short, if you think LE does not like gays and transgendered persons, much less criminals, corrections aren't that thrilled with them either. Consider also their ranks are filled from the same pool of applicants as LE, so you aren't going to have many enlightened souls. Make their job difficult while you are inside, and they can make yours VERY difficult.

Escorting and what not has become so widespread in the TS community, that many girls assume or even think that LE and the courts have the same sort of generous attitude, and nothing could be farther from the truth.

Time and time again have sat in various NYC courts and watched other low level offenders (smoking a joint on the street, having an opened can of beer or booze on the street, and so forth), get their charges either outright dismissed or six month conditional discharge (where if one is not arrested again in six months, the charges are dismissed and case sealed), where hoes most always get jail time, fines and community service.

Worse, allot of girls enter the system with no legal representation on retainer, or don't even know of an attorney to contact, thus rely on the public defenders office. Knowing nothing about how the system works is a huge disadvantage.

For instance many think just because they are arrested on minor charges, they can plead "not guilty" and will be allowed to go home and await trial. While that is true in theory, the courts can impose bail, which in NYS can be up to 4K for low level crimes. As many girls have found out, just because you have that money stashed under your mattress or in the bank does not mean the court will accept it. Most all states require bail money to be from legitimate sources. So if the DA can prove one has no visable means of support, and that those funds likely have come from prossing, then you are out of luck. Think you can simply say "my uncle gave it to me", think again. Judge will simply ask you to state on the record the source of funds, and probably may verify your story.

Yes, jails and prisons have improved much over the years, but that has brought about it's own backlash, which means the general population has little sympathy for those incarcerated or have been. Reasoning goes this is the USofA, and persons not guilty of a crime do not go to jail/prison, ergo you must have been guilty of SOMETHING and got what you deserved.

The United States has the largest prison population in the Western world. That does not even include various local jails.

Obviously the longer one is incarcerated, the more it can change you, but locking up first time minor offenders with career criminals, in some cases violent criminals does not provide the sort of "rehabilitation" the powers that be think it does.

[SarahG]

Think it would allcome down to what is between one's legs. The potential for disaster by putting any sort of "male" (pardon the term), in a true female population, out weights the emotional concerns of the trannine being with men.

A "male" in a women's lock-up would be just as much a target or perhaps sought after as a "female" in the male section. Consider also there are just as many females that "hate" trannies as males, so things might not be any easier on that side of the fence. At least in the male population a trannie can find a husband for protection. A pre-op trannie whose member does not function is of no use to any woman, thus has little or no bargining power.

For the most part it is all going to boil down to gender as defined by visable sexual organs down below. Even if a six-foot two linebacker post-op was put in to lock-up, despite her apperance, she is not going to go in with the male population, because she has a vagina. Either she will go with the females, or other arrangements will have to be made.


Generally, I agree completely with the above. "Other arrangements" is what I propose is the better solution (although there probably is no perfect solution...).



There are many pre-op trannies running around with various IDs saying female, but that hasn't stopped them from being listed as "male" by the court and correctional system. .

I agree with most of this, but what TS Jamie was talking about, was a slightly different situation.

It is one thing if you get papers that say female by "fooling" some lowly paid DMV worker with a letter from the surgeon who did your orchi (or living in a state like Texas that lets preops have female DL's). In the Texas example, your DL may say female, but the state of texas defines sex status based on BLOOD only (meaning XX = female for life, XY = male for life). I don't know if its corrections policy, or the state law itself but I do know that Texas will IGNORE your legal sex status and go by genitalia in determining what place to put an inmate.

But this is a bit different...

Its another thing entirely because in this case, the state actually SAYS with a court order, that you're legally female (meaning a judge looked over the facts and made a decision in the matter).... in California things are a bit odd in terms of the legal definition of sex, I don't know all the case law here but basically you don't have to have SRS to be legally female in California. So if you go before the judge, get the court order- you're female as far as CA is concerned and, afaik, that applies to everything in CA's domain (state taxes, IDs, BCs, marriages, the works).

Someone would have to do the research but it would come down to three possibilities that I can think of:
1- CA state law requires genitalia to dictate what prison type you go to (male or female)
2-CA state law does not mention genitalia but states legal sex status determines what type of prison you go to.
3- CA state law says nothing in the matter, but corrections gets to decide policy matters themselves and can do whatever they want as long as its legal.

If its #1, it won't matter what the state of CA thinks, you'd be going to the male prison if preop.

If its #3, the law doesn't play a role in what prison you go to, and if corrections says you're going to the male prison- then that's where you are going.

If its #2, then it could be taken up in the courts in which case they will either A- agree and send you to the female prison, B- disagree clarify what the law means (meaning #2 would turn into #1- the judge would basically say "well, i hear your case but the law here actually means that you have to go to the male prison even if another judge says you are female), or C- the court will look at the situation and overturn the existing court order and say you are legally male because you have no vagina.

Personally, I don't bet- ever. But if I were the type to bet on stuff, I would bet on 2-C if gambling on how this would play out.

[SugaSweet]

I am willing to join Nefertiti,Priscilla Dandara and Fabiane Spears in a cell this weekend to find out what indeed happens.

[Shining Star]

Speaking for myself, don't know what all the fuss is about. If one were going to spend any significant amount of time behind bars, would much prefer to be with the "male' population than females.

As lesbian behaviour holds no interest, neither does any sort of sexual activity with females, don't see any point of being locked up 24/7 with them.

Finally don't know what some people think is so vastly better or different in a female lock-up verus male. It's not like they are serving tea and cakes in the afternoon, and spend days doing embroidery. Nor is it like some sort of sorority house full of "nice' young ladies. It's a LOCK-UP, only difference is the inmates are female. And these days females can be just a violent thuggish as any man, even worse. There are females out there that will do a beat down or pop a cap into you for nothing more than a Happy Meal. Heck they may even do it for free if the mood strikes them. As a trannie you haven't much to offer such a girl, she may not even "like" you on principle despite your having a vagina and being "hot" looking. Indeed she may kick your ass every chance she gets because you are perpertrating and or because you are a "freak" far as she's concerned.

Remember the same streets that produce male thugs today, are producing the same females, so wouldn't get your hopes up that there is going to be any "lady like" behaviour in a female lock-up.



SS.

[RubyTS]

i've been to rykers island in NY a few times before i really knew what i was doing. They put you with the men unless u have had your SRS. They give u the option of going to PC (Protective custody) which is not worth it because trannies have lots of power in jail, and protective custody is lonely/ Ive never been but i hear they keep u in a cell alone most of the day.

I was in a dorm with about 50 guys. I have a huge mouth so if someone says something stupid i usually entertain myself with backtalk. Jail is very gang organized and the particular gangs stick together.

I remember the last time there was a blk guy who was so upset that i was in that dorm and was ranting about not wanting "homo's" around him. I went off tellin him that i dont wana be there anymore than he dont want me there but he's gonna have to shut up n deal w it, its jail not a vacation. He tried to get loud with me but a bunch of admirers shut it down real quick. A hhispanic guy came over and gave me a cigarette and told me i should move my bed and they would protect me. I got up and him and 4 other hispanics took everything out of my locker and threw it on my mattress, then lifted my mattress and moved it to the other side of the dorm. I sat on my new bed while they all surrounded me. One massaging my feet, another my back and playing with my hair, and 2 telling me how beautiful i am. The fifth was offerring me coffee and cakes. I turned around and smiled at the blk guy who was hating on me. He never bothered me after that. The spanish guys were in a gang that does not discriminate called Neta. The blk guy was blood, and there were tons of crypts and latin kings.

I had sex several times while in jail. I had a "husband" eho worked in the mess hall (kitchen) and would send for me everyday pretending i worked with him. (He had a lot of pull in jail.) We would fuck all the time in the kitchen. It was caught on camera and i hear they had a lot of fun watching it after i got out. He would sell sugar and trade for cigarettes. He gave me packs and stuffed my suit with junk food to take back to my dorm and made me promise not to share with anyone because IT WAS FOR ME. He was very sweet i'll never forget him. Huge cock too!

I had to shower next to men who woulld jerk off while watching me lather my body and i had to deal with a lot of hate from the female CO's. They hated me wearing tank tops because guys would all stare at my nipples.

All in all... jail was fun for me and im sure \this other girl is having a vacation paid for by the state right now!

[Space_Cowboy]

im surprised you left, sounds like they where treating you like a princess!

[RubyTS]

im surprised you left, sounds like they where treating you like a princess!

lol. it was a very interesting experience. That was only the first time. The last time i was actually locked up with DMX the rapper. He was trying to have sex with me but we were in seperate dorms. I ran into an ex boyfriend of mine who became close friends with DMX and they were trying to arrange a dorm transfer. They wanted to run a train on me lol. I was up for it, until i witnessed DMX getting a SEVERE beatdown on the way to the mess hall. I felt so bad for him. The would terrorize him everyday. I dunno y either, but the beatdown i witnessed was because supposedly he didnt want to move his bed. On some simple shyt... i guess just to b able to say that they did. Jail is a lot rougher on the guys

[Shining Star]

As they say in "Shawshank Redemption" " Get busy living, or get busy dying". *LOL*

Once you are incarerated, you have two choices, can make the best of things and your time goes rather "well" (whatever that may mean), or try to fight things and see how far that gets you.

Previous poster has the right idea. I mean what else is one going to do? You are where you are and things is what they is, so make up your mind to it and make the best of things.

Yes, from what one has heard, femmy gays and trannies do have "power" in lock-ups. Why bother beating down and raping some guy when someone is willing to have sex with you and is good at what they are doing. A very pretty trannie must be worth her weight in gold, and with the protection of a husband and or various gangs at her back, no one is likely to bother her.


Girl, how many times have you been to Rikers? And how many more do you intend to go? *LOL*

[Floyd R]

Ruby,

I imagine your stay in jail was very short. Did you have access to hormones while you were in there? The guys treated you nice because you are a beautiful woman but what if you had to serve a long sentence and didn't have access to hormones, makeup, and other necessities needed to stay looking beautiful. Eventually that nice treatment would change into something horrible as your outward appearance starts to change.



im surprised you left, sounds like they where treating you like a princess!

lol. it was a very interesting experience. That was only the first time. The last time i was actually locked up with DMX the rapper. He was trying to have sex with me but we were in seperate dorms. I ran into an ex boyfriend of mine who became close friends with DMX and they were trying to arrange a dorm transfer. They wanted to run a train on me lol. I was up for it, until i witnessed DMX getting a SEVERE beatdown on the way to the mess hall. I felt so bad for him. The would terrorize him everyday. I dunno y either, but the beatdown i witnessed was because supposedly he didnt want to move his bed. On some simple shyt... i guess just to b able to say that they did. Jail is a lot rougher on the guys

[stevenb43]

Kira; I would love to be in prison with you....

[RubyTS]

Ruby,

I imagine your stay in jail was very short. Did you have access to hormones while you were in there? The guys treated you nice because you are a beautiful woman but what if you had to serve a long sentence and didn't have access to hormones, makeup, and other necessities needed to stay looking beautiful. Eventually that nice treatment would change into something horrible as your outward appearance starts to change.



im surprised you left, sounds like they where treating you like a princess!

lol. it was a very interesting experience. That was only the first time. The last time i was actually locked up with DMX the rapper. He was trying to have sex with me but we were in seperate dorms. I ran into an ex boyfriend of mine who became close friends with DMX and they were trying to arrange a dorm transfer. They wanted to run a train on me lol. I was up for it, until i witnessed DMX getting a SEVERE beatdown on the way to the mess hall. I felt so bad for him. The would terrorize him everyday. I dunno y either, but the beatdown i witnessed was because supposedly he didnt want to move his bed. On some simple shyt... i guess just to b able to say that they did. Jail is a lot rougher on the guys


i used to take hormones very steadily when i was about 19 - 22. I did get hormones while i was in jail, but it was only 2 pills a day if i was lucky. Piills dont do much except soften the skin. The shots are what really do it for the girls. I cant speak for anyone else but i dont wear make up very often at all actually. i prefer the natural look. I haven't been taking hormones for a while now so i cant give them credit for my look. Plus i dont grow much hair. My only concern while i was locked up was the fact that there was no conditioner. My guy managed to get me some, however my hair is naturally very "fluffy" and hard to manage without straightening it, or moussing it up, so i just ponied it and called it a day. I felt really bad for some of the other girls though! I remember seeing this one spanish girl with red hair who was GORGEOUS but had the meanest shadow on her face. Thank god for my genes!

[brickcitybrother]

Ruby your story is very interesting. I wonder if it is the exception or the rule.

[xrey]

i've been to rykers island in NY a few times before i really knew what i was doing. They put you with the men unless u have had your SRS. They give u the option of going to PC (Protective custody) which is not worth it because trannies have lots of power in jail, and protective custody is lonely/ Ive never been but i hear they keep u in a cell alone most of the day.

I was in a dorm with about 50 guys. I have a huge mouth so if someone says something stupid i usually entertain myself with backtalk. Jail is very gang organized and the particular gangs stick together.

I remember the last time there was a blk guy who was so upset that i was in that dorm and was ranting about not wanting "homo's" around him. I went off tellin him that i dont wana be there anymore than he dont want me there but he's gonna have to shut up n deal w it, its jail not a vacation. He tried to get loud with me but a bunch of admirers shut it down real quick. A hhispanic guy came over and gave me a cigarette and told me i should move my bed and they would protect me. I got up and him and 4 other hispanics took everything out of my locker and threw it on my mattress, then lifted my mattress and moved it to the other side of the dorm. I sat on my new bed while they all surrounded me. One massaging my feet, another my back and playing with my hair, and 2 telling me how beautiful i am. The fifth was offerring me coffee and cakes. I turned around and smiled at the blk guy who was hating on me. He never bothered me after that. The spanish guys were in a gang that does not discriminate called Neta. The blk guy was blood, and there were tons of crypts and latin kings.

I had sex several times while in jail. I had a "husband" eho worked in the mess hall (kitchen) and would send for me everyday pretending i worked with him. (He had a lot of pull in jail.) We would fuck all the time in the kitchen. It was caught on camera and i hear they had a lot of fun watching it after i got out. He would sell sugar and trade for cigarettes. He gave me packs and stuffed my suit with junk food to take back to my dorm and made me promise not to share with anyone because IT WAS FOR ME. He was very sweet i'll never forget him. Huge cock too!

I had to shower next to men who woulld jerk off while watching me lather my body and i had to deal with a lot of hate from the female CO's. They hated me wearing tank tops because guys would all stare at my nipples.

All in all... jail was fun for me and im sure \this other girl is having a vacation paid for by the state right now!

:smh

[drock]

i've been to rykers island in NY a few times before i really knew what i was doing. They put you with the men unless u have had your SRS. They give u the option of going to PC (Protective custody) which is not worth it because trannies have lots of power in jail, and protective custody is lonely/ Ive never been but i hear they keep u in a cell alone most of the day.

I was in a dorm with about 50 guys. I have a huge mouth so if someone says something stupid i usually entertain myself with backtalk. Jail is very gang organized and the particular gangs stick together.

I remember the last time there was a blk guy who was so upset that i was in that dorm and was ranting about not wanting "homo's" around him. I went off tellin him that i dont wana be there anymore than he dont want me there but he's gonna have to shut up n deal w it, its jail not a vacation. He tried to get loud with me but a bunch of admirers shut it down real quick. A hhispanic guy came over and gave me a cigarette and told me i should move my bed and they would protect me. I got up and him and 4 other hispanics took everything out of my locker and threw it on my mattress, then lifted my mattress and moved it to the other side of the dorm. I sat on my new bed while they all surrounded me. One massaging my feet, another my back and playing with my hair, and 2 telling me how beautiful i am. The fifth was offerring me coffee and cakes. I turned around and smiled at the blk guy who was hating on me. He never bothered me after that. The spanish guys were in a gang that does not discriminate called Neta. The blk guy was blood, and there were tons of crypts and latin kings.

I had sex several times while in jail. I had a "husband" eho worked in the mess hall (kitchen) and would send for me everyday pretending i worked with him. (He had a lot of pull in jail.) We would fuck all the time in the kitchen. It was caught on camera and i hear they had a lot of fun watching it after i got out. He would sell sugar and trade for cigarettes. He gave me packs and stuffed my suit with junk food to take back to my dorm and made me promise not to share with anyone because IT WAS FOR ME. He was very sweet i'll never forget him. Huge cock too!

I had to shower next to men who woulld jerk off while watching me lather my body and i had to deal with a lot of hate from the female CO's. They hated me wearing tank tops because guys would all stare at my nipples.

All in all... jail was fun for me and im sure \this other girl is having a vacation paid for by the state right now!

verying intresting story Ruby and it's good to see you back around here again.

[Shining Star]

Were there many girls in Rikers? If so were they mostly in for prossing?

NYC has begun a program returning to using local jails in each borough, instead of busing inmates out to Rikers and having to bring them back for trial and so forth.

The Manhattan House of Detention gets lots of use, but IIRC, trannies and youngsters are sent to another lock up in Manhattan.

SS

[a994]

Thus a very feminine looking trannie with bosom and the rest is not likely to become the cell mate of any "man".

For one thing, to place her in a cell with a man would literally be that man's death sentence. There would be no end to the number of other inmates who would want to kill him and get his woman.

[xrey]

Thus a very feminine looking trannie with bosom and the rest is not likely to become the cell mate of any "man".

For one thing, to place her in a cell with a man would literally be that man's death sentence. There would be no end to the number of other inmates who would want to kill him and get his woman.

TGs are not kept with the general population. LAWSUIT!

[Shining Star]

Thus a very feminine looking trannie with bosom and the rest is not likely to become the cell mate of any "man".

For one thing, to place her in a cell with a man would literally be that man's death sentence. There would be no end to the number of other inmates who would want to kill him and get his woman.

TGs are not kept with the general population. LAWSUIT!You obviously don't know what you are talking about, since up thread a TG poster clearly related her experiences incarcerated with general population males.

Why don't you do some research before speaking and screaming lawsuit.

SS

[sdman]

Sounds like fun

[slingblade]

in connecticut here are the factors, if the unit is functional, male prison, if not, womans facility. they get their hormones. very tough for the ones who end up in male prisons, small framed, light skinned males are targets of rape, so imagine the risk of a ts.

LOL how do they know if its functional or not? I'm sure some trannies wouldnt mind going to a male prison anyway and getting all that prison dick daily.

[slingblade]

lol. it was a very interesting experience. That was only the first time. The last time i was actually locked up with DMX the rapper. He was trying to have sex with me but we were in seperate dorms. I ran into an ex boyfriend of mine who became close friends with DMX and they were trying to arrange a dorm transfer. They wanted to run a train on me lol. I was up for it, until i witnessed DMX getting a SEVERE beatdown on the way to the mess hall. I felt so bad for him. The would terrorize him everyday. I dunno y either, but the beatdown i witnessed was because supposedly he didnt want to move his bed. On some simple shyt... i guess just to b able to say that they did. Jail is a lot rougher on the guys

SO DMX was trying to run a train on you with his homies. I cant be mad at him for that who wouldnt want to fuck you baby? LOL :fuckin:

[FreddieGomez]

the fuck? she braggin about being in prison like she got a college degree or sumthing...smh

[russtafa]

the fuck? she braggin about being in prison like she got a college degree or sumthing...smh
college of of hard knocks:fuckin:

[bte]

the fuck? she braggin about being in prison like she got a college degree or sumthing...smh

Usually I disagree with you, but you make a valid point.

[slingblade]

I wonder what would happen if Kelly Shore was put in a prison cell with a Big Black Man? :):)

[Silcc69]

LOL how do they know if its functional or not? I'm sure some trannies wouldnt mind going to a male prison anyway and getting all that prison dick daily.

If they are a hooker they'd probably be loosing out on making money.

[slingblade]

If they are a hooker they'd probably be loosing out on making money.

Maybe so but they could control the whole yard practically since most of the guys in there would be trying to fuck them!

[bte]

Maybe so but they could control the whole yard practically since most of the guys in there would be trying to fuck them!

They wouldn't control the whole yard. One tranny can't fight off a pack of ass hungry niggas. That tranny would get rape daily and probably put in protective custody. Damn man, haven't you seen Lock Up on MSNBC on the weekends?

[yodajazz]

the fuck? she braggin about being in prison like she got a college degree or sumthing...smh

The point is, that someone asked about ts experience in prison, and she was open about hers. Someone interviewed on the news, would probably be more one sided, as the point of the story would be how t people are mistreated, or some other point. So Ruby's input, here is more balanced, than any other source, we could find.

I think the type of negative reaction, towards her, had something to do with why Ruby, and others leave the forum. And they also conclude that men are only interested for them in sex. She has returned, and we are very fortunate to have such an open and honest person here.

When I met someone who I know about their spending time in jail, I sometimes wonder, what they did. However, it's still another thing to judge a person, without knowing the circumstances. In the case of Ruby, it could have been related to providing the service, that is often the centerpiece of this forum. Lots of women say that 'johns' should be punished along with the girls. So maybe one day, this thread will have lots of imput from all sides.

[FreddieGomez]

The point is, that someone asked about ts experience in prison, and she was open about hers. Someone interviewed on the news, would probably be more one sided, as the point of the story would be how t people are mistreated, or some other point. So Ruby's input, here is more balanced, than any other source, we could find.

I think the type of negative reaction, towards her, had something to do with why Ruby, and others leave the forum. And they also conclude that men are only interested for them in sex. She has returned, and we are very fortunate to have such an open and honest person here.

When I met someone who I know about their spending time in jail, I sometimes wonder, what they did. However, it's still another thing to judge a person, without knowing the circumstances. In the case of Ruby, it could have been related to providing the service, that is often the centerpiece of this forum. Lots of women say that 'johns' should be punished along with the girls. So maybe one day, this thread will have lots of imput from all sides.

Ruby once said she was quitting the business in May and getting married.

but her prison story sounds like a gay man's fairytale

[justafreak]

good film explains alot!

Cruel and Unusual Trailer to Movie - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_5QP0uBLWf4)

[iagodelgado]

Quite why the thread got bumped after 2 years quiet ...

However, the subject has been studied by a professor from a California university. Because there are a couple of legal cases where an ex-prisoner is suing re crueltly in prison.
In brief, the study found (as expressed by the TS inmates)
1) It's genitals that count. Male genitals = male jail. One story tells of a TS locked up in jail for 7 days, until they looked at the genitals, then it was off to a male prison.
2) Violence against TS (people who present as female in a male prison) is much, much higher than male on male violence.
3) Despite this, most TS would prefer to be in a male prison, where they have access to males.
The study almost certainly included Sylvia Boots (inside for 2nd degree murder) but since about 5% of people id'd as TS did not take part in the study, I can't be certain.

Here's a quiz question. Can you guess how many people (with male genitals) are living 24x7 AS FEMALE in MALE prisons in the state of California? That's how many TS in male jails in California? Frankly, I was gosmacked.

[jerseyboy72]

If you have to go to prison , you better be in a federal prison. They are not that bad. Fuck those state prisons.

[yodajazz]

Ruby once said she was quitting the business in May and getting married.

but her prison story sounds like a gay man's fairytale
She's just recording what's happening. She got the best of the situation. That's something all of us do.

[slingblade]

Ruby once said she was quitting the business in May and getting married.

but her prison story sounds like a gay man's fairytale

I dont see what one has to do with the other and you know guys are going to want to fuck her if shes on lock down with them.

[russtafa]

they would become property of the gangs in prison

[megaduece]

I just received a hand written letter from Sylvia (Amara Vadillo)today 6/1/12. She said that she does not get a lot of mail from people who used to be close to her now that she is in prison, but that she does appreciate it when people contact her.

All I did was find the information on the net and sent her a letter. I did not expect to get a reply, but I did.

[megaduece]

Well, I just received a hand written letter from Sylvia (Amara Vadillo)today 6/1/12. She said that she does not get a lot of mail from people who used to be close to her now that she is in prison, but that she does appreciate it when people contact her.

All I did was find the information on the net and sent her a letter. I did not expect to get a reply, but I did.

[Silcc69]

I'd love to here from Sylvia herself. How lnog has she been locked up for?

[megaduece]

Since 2007. You can contact her here.


AMARA VADILLO, V-49531
CALIFORNIA MEDICAL FACILITY
P.O. BOX 2000
VACAVILLE, CA 95696-2000

[FreddieGomez]

I dont see what one has to do with the other and you know guys are going to want to fuck her if shes on lock down with them.

yeah but she would probably get raped almost every day.

to which is a gay man's ultimate fantasy.

and let me add:

That aint shit to be bragging about wit hiv bein so prevalent in prison!

[Silcc69]

yeah but she would probably get raped almost every day.

to which is a gay man's ultimate fantasy.

My nigga you stay talkin reckless. You make this site fun as hell at times.

[FreddieGomez]

My nigga you stay talkin reckless. You make this site fun as hell at times.

Just keepin shit real

lol..

[maddygirl]

ooops lol

[drb05]

I happened to be a guest of the federal government for "a year and a day" (10 1/2 months with good behavior) at a "mixed security" jail. Most of the inmates were in for drugs (no violence), immigration, white collar, or organized crime (the older guys mostly). Not a dangerous place really for anyone. It looked more like a community college than a prison except for the razor wire.

There were a few t-girls (maybe 20 or so out of 8 or 9 hundred). I'm given to believe that all pre-op t-girls are sent to male prisons (and referred to as men by the prison employees, especially the mostly sub-human guards) although I didn't see any with breast implants, maybe they went elsewhere. According to the several I got to know they didn't get any hormones after they got in and were forced to improvise cosmetics and hair dye (whatever they used, the blondes had a bit of green tint in the sun). Some of them worked wonders with the khaki uniforms and white tee shirts!

Interestingly, on my second trip to the SHU (special housing unit aka "the hole"; 23 hour lockdown) I spent a few days with a "cellie" who was a new girl, just coming in. When they first put her in my cell I was totally shocked because she was pretty damned hot! She was a small, thin Hispanic girl with small tits (actually not so small for "natural", but they went away by the next time I saw her a few months later). She was very sweet, too and I wish to hell I'd have made some kind of move. I was freaked out since I hadn't accepted my desire for t-girls.

I wish I could tell you we spent our three days together making wild love (I'll write it for you if you want, cause I've fantasized about it a lot), but it just wasn't so. The closest we got was a little cuddling the first night because she was crying in fear of the 2 years she had ahead. After a minute, though, I started getting hard and had a strong urge to kiss her, so I freaked. One night I heard her jacking off and I couldn't help but
do it too (in my lower bunk, not with her). I came in no time flat and was left with a lot of confusing feelings.

About half the girls there were in relationships (mostly with very big guys) and the other half were single. I heard a few of them really got around, one supposedly blew 8 or 9 guys one after another for 2 packs of tuna each (it's tuna, not cigarettes that is the monetary unit in todays prisons). There seemed to be no stigma about having sex with these girls, since they were totally female in appearance (mostly).

[Silcc69]

I happened to be a guest of the federal government for "a year and a day" (10 1/2 months with good behavior) at a "mixed security" jail. Most of the inmates were in for drugs (no violence), immigration, white collar, or organized crime (the older guys mostly). Not a dangerous place really for anyone. It looked more like a community college than a prison except for the razor wire.

There were a few t-girls (maybe 20 or so out of 8 or 9 hundred). I'm given to believe that all pre-op t-girls are sent to male prisons (and referred to as men by the prison employees, especially the mostly sub-human guards) although I didn't see any with breast implants, maybe they went elsewhere. According to the several I got to know they didn't get any hormones after they got in and were forced to improvise cosmetics and hair dye (whatever they used, the blondes had a bit of green tint in the sun). Some of them worked wonders with the khaki uniforms and white tee shirts!

Interestingly, on my second trip to the SHU (special housing unit aka "the hole"; 23 hour lockdown) I spent a few days with a "cellie" who was a new girl, just coming in. When they first put her in my cell I was totally shocked because she was pretty damned hot! She was a small, thin Hispanic girl with small tits (actually not so small for "natural", but they went away by the next time I saw her a few months later). She was very sweet, too and I wish to hell I'd have made some kind of move. I was freaked out since I hadn't accepted my desire for t-girls.

I wish I could tell you we spent our three days together making wild love (I'll write it for you if you want, cause I've fantasized about it a lot), but it just wasn't so. The closest we got was a little cuddling the first night because she was crying in fear of the 2 years she had ahead. After a minute, though, I started getting hard and had a strong urge to kiss her, so I freaked. One night I heard her jacking off and I couldn't help but
do it too (in my lower bunk, not with her). I came in no time flat and was left with a lot of confusing feelings.

About half the girls there were in relationships (mostly with very big guys) and the other half were single. I heard a few of them really got around, one supposedly blew 8 or 9 guys one after another for 2 packs of tuna each (it's tuna, not cigarettes that is the monetary unit in todays prisons). There seemed to be no stigma about having sex with these girls, since they were totally female in appearance (mostly).

Sub human really!?

[danoblue]

Wow this is a strange and a bit scary thread and also a bit of a turn on.

Ruby's story was very erotic.

I've always wondered what happened to Sylvia Boots. I know she killed someone.

I wonder if being in prison (for life I'm guessing) is similar to Ruby's story and she is using her "power"

I've been a fan of Sylvia's films.

Ruby's avatar is really sexy, just saying. What a hottie, the fantasies I will be having about her story.

[Marty Mcfly]

A good TS would have an Easy time in Prison if she gets the right Man
Those dudes are so horny they rape each other..For someone that looks totally female she would be a prison Queen.

[GOLDENBEAR]

yeah but she would probably get raped almost every day.

to which is a gay man's ultimate fantasy.

and let me add:


That aint shit to be bragging about wit hiv bein so prevalent in prison!

That's what I was thinking myself. Unless you don't care whether you live or die, who in their right mind would want to be railed by random dudes in prison?

[Ryz]

yeah but she would probably get raped almost every day.

to which is a gay man's ultimate fantasy.

and let me add:

That aint shit to be bragging about wit hiv bein so prevalent in prison!

http://gifsoup.com/view6/3781812/higherthanamuthafucka-o.gif

[kmersh]

Due to mistakes I made earlier in life, I was a guest of the State for 1yr 2 months and I was placed in the Sensitive Needs Yard (SNY) due to my sexual preference.

My "cellie" was a transsexual and we hit things off from day one, she helped me adjust to prison life and explained the politics of prison to me.

She did have breast implants and had some other surgeries (on her face) but had not had the final surgery at the time (and to date has not had the final surgery, we still keep in touch), the state did not provide her with any hormones (even though she had prescription before getting locked up), while I understand the need for keeping costs down, I always felt that she had a medical disorder and deserved the privilege of medication.

K

[drb05]

Sub human really!?

(re my reference to "mostly sub-human" guards)


Perhaps a bit harsh, but if you'd ever been there you might not think so. While a few were truly good people and another 10 or 20 per cent were decent, the majority were, to varying degrees, ignorant jerks who cured their bordom by insulting and humiliating prisoners and feeling tough because the inmates never stood up to them (they couldn't, of course).

The t-girl I mentioned was put in with me specifically because I was a "fag" due to the fact that I took time to ask about the books on the book cart; anybody who likes to read anything but "Guns n Ammo" is apparently a fag.

Mark Twain once said "If you want to see the dregs of society, go down to the jail... and watch the changing of the guard"