Interesting Night on New York Television

[Nowhereboy]

Tonight on New York television were two programs that both dealt, in very different ways, with transgender issues. Of course both were on at exactly the same time. The first was the CBS crime drama, "Without a Trace" which dealt with the dissapearance of a woman. It turned out that this woman was a m2f transsexual nd it attempted to show some of the issues transgendered people have to deal with. In this case, it was the separation of he m2f from her family, including her own children. At the same time, on PBS, Channel 13, "In the Life" a Gay and Lesbian Newsmagazine dealt with several transgender issues. All in all, a very interesting night on Television

[geekmeat]

Yeah I saw it too.
It was a little too politcally correct for me.
First of all the male to female person was flawless!
Of course they always get a genetic female to play her.

Dr.Phil had a female to male transexual on his show.

Transexuals are everywhere!!!!!

Dr.Phil is a redneck........hes a doctor but hes a redneck doctor and thats NOT ok.

I can tell he disaproved of it and was very "clinical" in his treatment and verbage towards the f-t-m.

I HATE TEXas!!

[blckhaze]

not necessarily J. Sure some people go that route, and as a christian, i see it first had, but me personally, i dont persecute a person for not believing what i do. Everyone has different roads to take. Ultimalety i would love for everyone to christian, but I cant force anyone to follow my beliefs, because all the will do is create resentment, which is the opposite of my goal. Religon can create a barrier, but thats because some people are set in their ways and dont want to change.
To youpoint that the Bible is outdated. i disagree vehemently. The Bible is guide to how to live ones life acording to the teachingsof Christ. Sure, there are things that we give up that may seem stupid to people on the outside, but in the long run, we come out much more happier with our live because we avoid making desicions that could threaten, not only our lives, but the lives of our friends and family. Furthermore the Bible has predicted many of the events proceeding its completion.

[Nowhereboy]

I will not get into a debate over the validity and accuracy of the writings in the Bible, that is a discussion for another day. I will however, comment on some of the other aspects of the conversation so far. Geekmeat said that the episode was a little to PC, she was too flawless and was played by a genetic female. This is all true, but remember, in the story, the new people in her life had no idea that she was transgendered, this would have been far less believable if she was not believable. It is a significant story detail that the choirmaster at her new church had no idea that anything was out of the ordinary.
As to Dr. Phil, I am not certain that I would classify him as redneck. To be fair, I have never watched his show, but I did see him quite often when he was on Oprah, the ex-wife had it on, and it seems to me that what is referred to as his clinical treatment, is pretty much the way he treats all of the people he talked with. It is a sort of, 'you don't seem to want to admit your responsibility' part of his entire approach. So this sounds like a consistent methodology for him. Again, I stress that I do not watch his show and that I did not see this episode, so I could be far off base.
As to Texas, not my favorite place in the world either, but any state that can produce an Ann Richards, "Poor George, he was born with a silver foot in his mouth", and a Barbara Jordan can't be all bad.

[Felicia Katt]

cmon geak u really think its the redneck in him thats the problem? how come urban people or country folk in scandinavia dont hate gays or dissaprove of many traditional things? BECAUSE THEYRE NOT RELIGIOUS FUCKING IDIOTS!!!
lets just be honest, you guys dont like my religion bashing because of ur beliefs, u have to admit i makes sense...damnit!!!
dont u get it? RELIGION=HATE!!! period...tradition is stupid and people who live their lives by an old book of outdated values are morons...have a great fucking weekend everyone...

J, for god's sake, please try some decaf products!!! :)

More seriously, since when is Scandinavia a godless bastion of secular acceptance? it took just one quick Google to find this link which shows that 89 per cent of the population of Norway is evangelical Lutheran.

http://library.thinkquest.org/18802/norkirke.htm

And it seems to me I have seen a few Churches in cities here as well.

Religion isn't the problem. The problem is that the wall between Church and State here is crumbling, and too many of its bricks are being thrown, instead of replaced. Some religions are too politicized and some politicians too sanctimonious, The answer isn't too ban religion, or abandon faith, but to support a strong, independent judiciary who will balance and check legislative and executive pandering to the religious right.

Felicia

[hondarobot]

Wow.

That was a great post, Felicia!

I'm not part of this whole debate, but that was pretty cool.

[Nowhereboy]

Felicia,

Could not agree with you more. In fact I would take it one step further. Religion itself is not the problem, the problems arise because people are involved and people will do what people have always done. Whether they use religion or politics or economics as the hammer, there will always be people that seek to rule over other folks. When those people use religion as their hammer, they seem to suffer from an intolerable arrogance that says I am doing what I do because God tells me to do this. Aside from the amazing arrogance that allows these people to believe that they are as important as Moses and Abraham (you know, God spoke to them also) there is the idea that no one should be allowed to question them, they are doing God's work.

One of the most important things to remember is that for these people, religion is a weapon and if that weapon was taken away from them, they would soon find a replacement weapon. I personally am not a religious person, but I do recognize that many great accomplishments have been achieved in the name of religion. It is not the tool that is to blame, it is the person wielding it.

One last matter, for now, the concept of Separation of Powers is one of the bedrock principles that this nation was built upon, it is currently under attack. We all learned about the idea of checks and balances when we were in grade school, the current governmental culture seeks to overturn it in order to force their agenda through to fruition. What this country needs, what it has always needed, is to maintain three strong, independent, and co-equal branches of government in order to rein in extremism in any branch of that government.

I apologize for running on so much, but I feel this is too important to ignore

[thatguy]

The good 'ole USofA were one of the first countries to make a solid distinction between Church and State thereby releasing our citizens of any obesience to the Anglican Church and its leader, the King. It does not mean that its lessons, morals or ideals cannot become part of the government. Only we, the people, keep them separate. What the people believe, they have the right to legislate, as long as these ideas are not directly communicated by Church to State.

The idea of our government is that it exists by the people and they can change it however they want. If you or I feel the current crop of shite does not represent us, we have every right to disagree and assemble others who feel the same. The whole 'for the people' line means nothing. Majority rules in our government, face it. Learn to politik.

[Nowhereboy]

thatguy,

If the majority truly ruled in this country, we would be in much better condition then we are now. And no, I am not just talking about George W. Bush. How many people voted in the last Presidential election? About 110 million? This in a nation of almost 300 million. Apathy rules in our nation, it creates a kind of vacuum,and since nature abhors a vacuum the professional political machine steps into the vacuum and takes control for itself. We ARE to blame and so we ARE the solution.

I feel it is particularly important for the many people that make up this community, both the boards and the entire transgendered community, wake up and become involved. If we do not, then we run the risk of being sacrificed on the altar of political convenience. No politician that stands for national office would hesitate to hold this community up as an example of 'everything that is wrong with America' in order to gain funding. It is up to us to see that that never happens

[Felicia Katt]

Wow.
That was a great post, Felicia!
I'm not part of this whole debate, but that was pretty cool.
Thank you. Come on in, the water is fine. and its not Holy :)


Felicia

[Felicia Katt]

Faith can move mountains. Religion can strip mine them.

Thatguy, while I respect your point of view, I have to disagree with it. Legislation, to be upheld, generally has to have, at the very least, a rational basis. By its very spiritual principles, religion is a non-rational process. So enacting laws based purely on religious beliefs won't meet even that loose test.

For matters involving fundamental rights and liberties, legislation has to be even more than just rational, it has to survive strict scrutiny. Which faith based laws clearly shouldn't do.

The nature of our democracy isn't just what the majority wants. It what it can have within the framework of our Constitution, as it is interpreted and enforced by the Courts.

Felicia

[Nowhereboy]

Felicia,

Very well stated.

This very judicial independence is under attack in our country and not by some lunatic fringe element. It is under attack by the very people that currently control our federal government, witness Congressman Tom Delay's thinly veiled threats to the judges in the Terri Schiavo case

[Hugh Jarrod]

Felicia,

Very well stated.

This very judicial independence is under attack in our country and not by some lunatic fringe element. It is under attack by the very people that currently control our federal government, witness Congressman Tom Delay's thinly veiled threats to the judges in the Terri Schiavo case


Agreed, he's threatening to hold them all accountable? For what doing their job? No for interpreting the law differently than him. In a case that shouldn't have involved congress anyway, if they cared about people's health and lives so much they would do something about health care in this country.

[Felicia Katt]

Bill Mahr recently put it this way

All these politicians seem to forget they swore an oath and put their hand on the Bible to uphold the Consitution, not the other way around.

Felicia

[Mugai_hentaisha]

A buddya practicing Wiccan (close to it) once said it best in a prayer when his girlfriend dragged him to a baptist church, where the whole congretion was forewarned of his arrival and tried to gang up on him to "save" him. He played along and then right in the middle of the sermon when the church was at its quietist he prayed out loud:

"Dear Jesus protect me from your followers! Amen."

Got up broke up with his girlfriend on the spot and left.

I laughed

[Mugai_hentaisha]

Bill Mahr recently put it this way

All these politicians seem to forget they swore an oath and put their hand on the Bible to uphold the Consitution, not the other way around.

Felicia

i found this:

Article. VI. of the U.S. Consititution



Clause 3: The Senators and Representatives before mentioned, and the Members of the several State Legislatures, and all executive and judicial Officers, both of the United States and of the several States, shall be bound by Oath or Affirmation, to support this Constitution; but no religious Test shall ever be required as a Qualification to any Office or public Trust under the United States.

Now it may just be me and it most likely is :twisted:

But couldn't putting your hand upon the Christian bible be considered a religious test?

[Nowhereboy]

Mugai,

Likely not, though I agree strongly with your sentiments. Remember, you must place your hand on a bible to offer testimony in many courts throughout the land. If a Muslim was elected to office and preferred to place his or her hand on the Koran, I doubt any legal complaint could carry the day.

It is fascinating, yesterday my mother faxed me a copy of a political cartoon and she asked for my opinion of it. The cartoon disturbed her ( she is very religious, especially since my father died). The cartoon showed delivery men carrying a large crate labelled 'Religion' in the front door of the Capitol while other delivery men stealthily carried a crate labelled 'Ethics' out the back door of the Capitol. I loved this cartoon, she saw it as an attack on religion in general, I explained to her that I saw it more as an attack on Congress' hypocracy. Congressional hypocracy, now there is an item from the Department of Redundancy Department.

An old joke. If con is the opposite of pro, then what is the opposite of progress?

[Felicia Katt]

You can swear an oath to tell the truth without a Bible, or on the Koran or whatever. If you lie in Court, worry about going to prison, not Hell

As far as the The Constitution goes, Article I, Section 9, paragraph 3 provides that: "No Bill of Attainder or ex post facto Law will be passed." A bill of attainder is a legislative act which inflicts punishment without judicial trial and includes any legislative act which takes away the life, liberty or property of a particular named or easily ascertainable person or group of persons because the legislature thinks them guilty of conduct which deserves punishment

Article 1, Section 10 prohibits "[laws] impairing the obligation of contracts"and makes it unlawful for the government to step in and void a contract which was legally binding according to the law the day it was agreed upon.

It seems clear that the Schiavo law was pretty blatantly unconstitutional. It was aimed at only one individual, and made him and only him go through another entirely new legal process. And it very clearly impaired his well established rights, through his contract of marriage, under Florida law.

Is it just me, or does this kind of abuse of power and of the legislative process seem more like a high crime and misdemeanor than fibbing about a little office hanky panky?

Felicia

[Hugh Jarrod]

Bill Mahr recently put it this way

All these politicians seem to forget they swore an oath and put their hand on the Bible to uphold the Consitution, not the other way around.

Felicia

I really miss Politically Incorrect.

[Hugh Jarrod]

Of course they always get a genetic female to play her.

Yeah I pointed that out when Cold Case Files (also on CBS) did an episode about a trangendered gurl, I wish they could've given the role to a TG. Though I give it up to CBS for using a TS actually many TSs to play TSs in the 100th episode of CSI, they actually used Cassandra an actress/bartender who works at Diva's in SF.

[Mugai_hentaisha]

You can swear an oath to tell the truth without a Bible, or on the Koran or whatever. If you lie in Court, worry about going to prison, not Hell

As far as the The Constitution goes, Article I, Section 9, paragraph 3 provides that: "No Bill of Attainder or ex post facto Law will be passed." A bill of attainder is a legislative act which inflicts punishment without judicial trial and includes any legislative act which takes away the life, liberty or property of a particular named or easily ascertainable person or group of persons because the legislature thinks them guilty of conduct which deserves punishment

Article 1, Section 10 prohibits "[laws] impairing the obligation of contracts"and makes it unlawful for the government to step in and void a contract which was legally binding according to the law the day it was agreed upon.

It seems clear that the Schiavo law was pretty blatantly unconstitutional. It was aimed at only one individual, and made him and only him go through another entirely new legal process. And it very clearly impaired his well established rights, through his contract of marriage, under Florida law.

Is it just me, or does this kind of abuse of power and of the legislative process seem more like a high crime and misdemeanor than fibbing about a little office hanky panky?

Felicia

Our present Admin has made an art form out of "end running" around the consitution, while proclaming, "they are upholding our rights."
lets look at the biggies;

Congress gives the President (in this case King George) the power for one man to declare War.

The Terry Schivo law.

The Patriot Act

Some can even argue Faith based initives

it seems that with all of these with the exception of Faith based initives ( which was an Executive order). That they were all brought about by a "knee jerk" reaction. Maybe we as a people should petition congress to outlaw bills based on "knee jerk" reactions.

The power to declare war has been a tacky issue since Korea, (nice note not since WW2 has congress ever declared war). and how many wars have we been in?...............Korea (police Action,yeah right) Vietnam (police Action again yeah right), Gerenda (sp), Panama (there is a post in itself) Desert Storm pt 1, Kosovo (bombing campaign), and War on Terror which includes Afghanistan, Iraqi Freedom, ( which beat out such titles as Get our WMD's back, and Saddam and Osama are in Cahoots.) or as i like to call it Desert Storm pt 2 and our future war with Iran.

As so beautifully put by......now what was the name of that document????? oh yeah the CONSITUTION!!!!!!

Section. 8. (powers of Congress)

Clause 11: To declare War, grant Letters of Marque and Reprisal, and make Rules concerning Captures on Land and Water;

What is happening people

[Felicia Katt]

I really miss Politically Incorrect.

He has a weekly show on HBO, called Real Time

[Mugai_hentaisha]

I really miss Politically Incorrect.

He has a weekly show on HBO, called Real Time

Yeah he does that is the only reason my Mom keeps HBO

[Hugh Jarrod]

I really miss Politically Incorrect.

He has a weekly show on HBO, called Real Time

Yeah I know but I haven't been able to catch it.

[Felicia Katt]

You should, its good. Good guests and topics and a great ending feature called New Rules. very good polictical humor/commentary

Felicia

[Nowhereboy]

Bill Maher did a great bit last Friday (April 1), about the report that came out that week on an 8 year study. This study was conducted about those young people who had signed virginity pledges, you know, 'I promise to not engage in sex until I find true love and get marreid". Turns out that these students were found to have just as high an incidence of STDs as all other students. Plus, they were found to have been more than 6 times as likely to have engaged in oral sex and 4 times more likely to have engaged in Anal sex. He then asked the basic question, "Where were these virginity pledges when I was in High School?" and "the only people that were having Anal sex when I was in High School... were the guys that missed" The panelists were laughing so hard that there were some tears.

[partlycloudy]

I really miss Politically Incorrect.

He has a weekly show on HBO, called Real Time

Yeah I know but I haven't been able to catch it.

you can dl caps of it from the net.