What is a 'tranny chaser'?

[peggygee]

"Be vwerry quiet"

"I'm chasing twannies"

"Hehh, hehh, hehhh" http://i92.photobucket.com/albums/l2/magi43/elmer2.jpg

:roll:


Taken from this site
http://www.geocities.com/trannychasersanonymous/

Tranny Chasers are men who want to pursue homosexual acts without dealing with another man dominating them. They fetishize transgender women-particularly the penis. That’s why there are few, if any, websites devoted to post-op transsexual women.

Tranny Chasers generally come in three basic categories—I know this is oversimplification, but it works in the short run. They all share one common denominator: they all want to explore homosexual relations and perform the ‘bottom’ role.

They want to be sodomized, but call it ‘topped’ so that they don’t have to deal with the psychological reality of wanting to be dominated by a person with a penis. Moreover, many are married & cheating on wives or girlfriends. They will say or do anything in order to have sex with a transgendered woman including lying about their marriage status, stds, level of experience, and sexual preferences/desires.

The three types are as follows:

Gender Issues type: These types themselves have cross-dressed, but for some reason stop. Often they lack the courage and admire other braver or more passable tranz people. They tend to seek out tranz women in order to live out their own transgendered feelings through sexual contact with a transsexual woman.

They, are less interested in physical beauty/passability and are more likely to have fetishes. (rubber, ‘maid’ costumes, etc) They also are often willing to ‘play’ the man, but actually prefer themselves in a more traditional feminine role. Of course, this causes trouble with the transgendered person who he has approached. These types also will lie at first about their own transgendered feelings or their fetishes. They fear rejection. This is the least harmful of the Tranny Chaser cancer.

“Admirer” type: This category includes the guys who lurk in gay bars, date tranz women—generally only the passable. But if they are really ‘horny’ any male in female clothes will do. These guys pretend that they are ‘nice guys’ and ‘compassionate’ and ‘understandting.’ They often claim to want to ‘date’ you or pretend to want a long-term relationship. However, this type will not introduce you to their friends or family (unless they have Gay family or friends), and they seek discrete liaisons. They constantly stress that they are ‘nice guys’ and that they are ‘understanding’ or our minority community. They insist that they are straight. They claim to be attracted to ‘T-girls” because we are ‘more feminine’ whatever that means.

A further part of their pose is to pretend knowledge of our community. . In reality, their database of knowledge is based upon porno tapes and watching one episode of the old “RuPaul Show” on TV. Although these guys try to hint they are open to a long-term relationship, but in reality, they are looking for fantasy fulfillment. Their fantasy ususally involves fellating a penis underneath a skirt, or being ‘taken’ anally. These fanatsies operate independantly of what the transwoman desires. One of the key phrases of this type are ‘I want this to be about you…” Once they have been sodomized or performed fellatio or both on a transwoman, these men often experience intense guilt.

Therefore, once the “excitement” is over, they are usually done with that particular transgendered person. However, they have a way of popping-up months later, expecting the transsexual woman to be overjoyed to hear from them. That is because they think we are pathetic, marginal and incapable of attracting a ‘normal’ relationship. In addition, these guys are likely to seek out ‘newbies’ in public places such as gay bars or tranz bars because they are easier to exploit and more likely to put up with their sexual demands for penetration. They are predators, wrapped up in deep denial of their homosexuality. Like this old fool, James “Bud” Durman.

Here is a telling quote from a tranny chaser who tries to defend his tastes. He is most likely of the ‘boyfriend’ type as he indicated he had trolled through gay bars looking for ‘beautiful Shechicks.”

“It comes down to one thing. I am
>going to be 40, I wanted to experience something new, I dont get turned on by men
>when I see them I get turned on by attractive, tranxz women, I indeed met one
>weeks ago. could I have finally made my fantasy reality yes I chose not to. I
>ddnt find her attractive enough, I dont really want to know anythingmore than
>what turns me on or excited me, as far as sucking dick to me a woman like
>yourself for me is like a clit, I dont see it as a @#%$ “

He doesn’t see her ‘clit’ as a penis because he’s in homosexual denial.

“Date or Client”: These men, the third type of chaser, almost exclusively seek out professional escorts…They have a pathological community based on several web message boards that review escorts (in the most pejorative terms: the main criteria is how willing the transwoman is to sodomize them and the size of her genitalia). Their websites have endless photos of “packed panties” or ‘bigshecocks.” Moreover, they gossip constantly about escorts and who has the biggest penis and who is most willing to enthusiastically sodomize men for cash. They have endless debates upon the meirts of safe sex (can you believe that?) and on how to ‘bottom’ best.

Most of these men are delusional middle-aged men (crisis) who bemoan the fact that a twenty year old escort has trouble maintaining an errection looking at their sagging rear end. This group almost certainly consists of sexual addicts or men on the way to becoming sex addicts. Delusional behavior is a big part of sexual addiction, and these men deny that they are homosexuals, even after being sodomized hundreds of times by escorts. These men frequently practice unsafe sex, even though they primarily have sex with escorts, and are most often anal bottoms. Some will progress into the type of men arrested at a rest-stop for performing fellatio. Others are pederasts. This is a progressive disease (Sexual Addiction)

Many of these men are married and return home to the innocent wife after having been sodomized without a condom. In order to keep up the front, they will penetrate their innocent wife, exposing her to diseases. As sexual addiction progresses, the addict loses a perspective on reality. Hence ‘client’ types iinsistence that they are ‘straight’ even though they have been sodomized hundreds of times (many end-up in adult bookstore culture or acting out in public places with Gay or bisexual men). These men use language that hides their sexual preferences. Instead of them being ‘fucked’ they are ‘topped.’ Because of their sexual denial and self-hatred, these men can be tremendously dangerous. All of this is so that they do not have to deal with the reality of their sexuality. On one hand, they are to be pitied, but on the other hand, they also exploit our community.

Overall, “tranny chaser” denotes a particular type of male that desires to be penetrated anally or to perform fellatio, yet seeks out transgendered people so that he does not have to deal with the emotions and reality behind his homosexual desires. The transsexual person then is only an oject-scarecly more than a penis, hence outrage when a ts woman is impotent or disinterested in dominating them sexually.

[Taom]

I'd have to say that the article is heavily biased against any male who is attracted to a tgirl. I never considered myself a tranny chaser, as I'm not out to only get sex. I have no problem admitting that she has a cock, or that I like to let my partner have the dominant role from time to time. I'm not homosexual, straight, or bisexual. I am what I am. I refuse to use gender or sexual organs to decide wether I am attracted to someone.
I guess I got off on a tangent there. Back on topic, I feel that the article is heavily biased and ignorant. I was originally going to quote some of the ignorant statements, but there's simply too many.

I do however think that this could spart an interesting conversation.

[peggygee]

:popcorn

http://i92.photobucket.com/albums/l2/magi43/popcorncrop.jpg

[ottorocket]

link doesnt work Peg

[Taom]

lol@peggy
exactly what I'm doing now that I opened up my big mouth

[peggygee]

link doesnt work Peg

A 1,000 apologies, but that is the article in it's entirety.

[lahabra1976]

The trouble with talking about homosexuality denial is that its something that can't be proven or disproved. Okay lets say you are really in homosexual denial and someone ask you "are you homosexual?" Than by definition of denial your response would be "no."

Lets say on the other hand you aren't in homosexual denial and you really do have no interest in men. Than your response to the question is still "no."

And consider the third scenario were you are in homosexual denial and someone ask you "are you homosexual?" If you said "yes" in this situation you are lying by definition (cause you aren't in denial anymore, you just admitted it). Here you are just simply homosexual without denial.

[Taom]

not many wanna discuss this topic with us peggy. and here i thought it'd get interesting *pouts*

[Jericho]

[Sticks head above parapet] :shock:

Matchbox psychology has a lot to answer for!

The bitter rantings of someone who's just found out she has parity with the minge sisters.

Tranny chasers - There's no big secret, no ulterior motive, no dark design - It' pure, it's simple...It's sex!

If a girl needs some elaborate man-hating construct to make her feel better after she's just found out she's been used, then more power to her, she's just found out what it's like to be a gg [they've been doing it for years]; But, it doesn't change the reality. That for the majority of tranny chasers...It's just sex.

Like the saying goes, All men are bastards

Some grow out of it, some don't. :roll:

[hwbs]

when a girl likes u , ur her husband...when its over u are a chaser, lmao

[peggygee]

when a gir likes u , ur her husband...when its over u are a chaser, lmao

That's hot. :lol: :lol:

http://i92.photobucket.com/albums/l2/magi43/comeian.jpg

[eze]

I'd have to say that the article is heavily biased against any male who is attracted to a tgirl. I never considered myself a tranny chaser, as I'm not out to only get sex. I have no problem admitting that she has a cock, or that I like to let my partner have the dominant role from time to time. I'm not homosexual, straight, or bisexual. I am what I am. I refuse to use gender or sexual organs to decide wether I am attracted to someone.
I guess I got off on a tangent there. Back on topic, I feel that the article is heavily biased and ignorant. I was originally going to quote some of the ignorant statements, but there's simply too many.

I do however think that this could spart an interesting conversation.


I have to agree 100%
'

Although I am still young and would need to tell my parents, being in a relationship with a tgirl would help the understanding of it all. I dont seek Tgirls for pure sexual pleasure, although my first experiences may be like that, I would considering just having a relationship with a girl or tgirl. It doesn't matter. I dont call myself gay or bi, or straight, I am what I am. Although I guess you can say, I find the more "passable girls" attractive then I do the non passable ones, but then I can say, these are the types of tgirls I like, everyone in this world in beautiful in one way or another, even if I find them not attractive someone else will. So to label nearly any guy as a tranny chaser is wrong.

We live in a society where being "gay" is wrong. So you have to understand and deal with men who just want to live out a fantasy.

[MacShreach]

Hi Peggy, nice to meet you and I see you have another of your thought-provokers there.

IIRC that site has been around a long while--two years at least--but frequently goes tits-up when its bandwidth gets overloaded--probably whenever someone posts a link to it on sites like this.

Although its tone is excessively shrill and defensive I basically think the article is on the money and reflects the attitude of a significant number of men who post here. They are indeed seeking to be sodomised and dominated by a person with a uniquely male characteristic, a dick, without ever having to admit that they are as queer as nine-bob notes.

However there are also men here who freely admit they are either gay or bisexual and seem to be relaxed with it. I do take some contention with the notion that "tranny chasers" as defined in the article are automatically psychopathic and will go on to become sex criminals; for most men this whole thing never gets past the fantasy stage. Nevertheless I do think such men would have to be treated with great caution, especially by any transsexual woman they were sexually involved with.

I think transsexual women are often in a very lonely position, particularly if they are pre-op, especially when they encounter men who do not want to practise sex that reinforces their femininity-- ie they want to be buggered by them. It is clear that pre-op escorts frequently lie to their customers; a significant number will only perform acts of penetration for money and if asked privately and anonymously in the context of a journalistic interview will say they do it for cash but they would never do it in love. When these girls go post-op they often, unsurprisingly, steer well clear of the type of men who were formerly their clients.

However there is still the issue to be dealt with, for the post-op woman, that at least for the foreseeable future, a man having a relationship with such al woman voluntarily foregoes one of the biggest reinforcements of maleness there is, fatherhood, unless the man is older and has already achieved this.

Furthermore the language used amongst such men and current on sites like this, terms such as "topping" and "bottoming" are straight out of the gay lexicon. I never, ever heard a genetic woman describe herself or even be described as "a bottom" (although it is possible that within the lesbian world there are usages I don't know about.) Why therefore would a transsexual woman want to have such terms applied to her? She is a woman, and words like "top" and "bottom" in this context are part of gay male language.

It is also very clear that a good many "transsexuals" working in the sex industry are not women at all but simply gay men who have adopted the garb of femininity to the extent of changing their bodies. Naturally the business of gay sex with other men is not an issue for them. I must admit this was something I was really unprepared for when I began looking into this area closely. I can understand why genuinely transsexual woman want to distance themselves from people like that, although often I find the tone used by some transsexual women is too strident. Gender and sexuality are very broad churches and there is no black and white, only shades of grey. Whatever turns you on turns you on and nobody should be judgemental about consensual sex acts.

However, having said all that, there are clearly also pre-op TS women who are genuinely women who do like to use their penises in a penetrative manner yet who are determined to have GRS as soon as they can afford it. I believe this is an extention of role-play in that, as women, they are turned on by their unique ability to transform themselves from the female, penetrated, role to the male penetrating role. That must be a pretty powerful sexual hit, and indeed I have spoken to several girls who have said exactly that.

I am personally quite boring sexually, though I try hard to make it entertaining (I am a man who likes to penetrate women) but I think I can see how it might be that some men--often quite powerful, dominant men--might be turned on by being forcefully taken. I can also see how such a man might be thilled by this but unable, because of his normal dominance, to do it with someone he identified as another man. Enter the TS. Nadia has made some good comments on this recently.

Unfortunately, and to return to the article, the problem with this is that the woman is objectified-- she just becomes whatever pretty shape is pushing the penis, and judging by some of the views routinely expressed here, she doesn't have to be that pretty, as long as the dick is up to the task.

I think it's tough enough for genetic women to deal with that kind of objectification and they at least have a few real anchor-points to hold on to; for a transsexual woman, particularly a pre-op, this must be quite difficult; after all they are trying to establish a self-identity that in general society does not want them to have and also have to literally fight their bodies to get there.

It's a shame because in fact some women who have become women, whether or not they retain the elements of their anatomy that are in question here, are amongst the smartest, most fascinating, strong and genuinely funny women, for that matter people, I have ever met or communicated with. I guess you just don't go through all that stuff without developing strength of character.

Now I do realise that there will be indignant howls of pique from the knob-jockeys who will cry that this is retrograde, that the world has no need of definitions like "gay" or "straight," and to an extent I sympathise with them. But that's just cause I'm a sympathetic person and having to take a cold hard reality check can be tough.

[Kriss]

when a gir likes u , ur her husband...when its over u are a chaser, lmao

:lol: :claps

oops , nearly forgot....

:popcorn

[Ecstatic]

Tranny Chasers are men who want to pursue homosexual acts without dealing with another man dominating them. They fetishize transgender women-particularly the penis. That’s why there are few, if any, websites devoted to post-op transsexual women.

Tranny Chasers generally come in three basic categories—I know this is oversimplification, but it works in the short run. They all share one common denominator: they all want to explore homosexual relations and perform the ‘bottom’ role.

This is definitely oversimplification. While there are definitely elements of truth here, it sounds like the author was mad at someone or more likely generalized a series of experiences and observations of forums like this. That these three types exist, I don't doubt, but I think other types exist as well. Here's a statement made in another forum:


Trannychaser is a term used for people interested in a subsection of paraphilia regarding transsexuals. In general, a trannychaser is someone who is attracted to male-to-female transsexuals (although some 'chasers find female-to-males equally as attractive) solely on the grounds that the individual is transsexual.

What is paraphilia?


A paraphilia is a condition in which a person's sexual arousal and gratification depend on fantasizing about and engaging in sexual behavior that is atypical and extreme. A paraphilia can revolve around a particular object (e.g., children, animals, underwear) or around a particular act (e.g.,inflicting pain, exposing oneself). - http://health.discovery.com/centers/sex/sexpedia/paraphilia.html
However, note that a paraphilic condition is one in which gratification depends upon the extreme sexual fantasy, fixation or situation. Not all men who are attracted to m2f transsexuals (or even only to pre-op transsexuals) are paraphilic; some are, and some are not.

This piece does however illustrate why I'm only slightly more comfortable with the term "admirer" than I am with "tranny chaser": neither represents the truth and depth of my attraction, though one is less insulting (both to myself and to those to whom I am attracted).

Hey MacS, how's by you? Long time, my friend!

[TJT]

I don't want to be buggered by anyone. Hell,I dread my annual prostate exam and thats just a finger?

I think you're right though. It's psychologically safe way for a lot of guys to deal with bi and gay tendencies they may not want to face.

"There's a dick down there but she looks like a girl,so it doesn't count?" "

"BTW,I always wanted to.... uh.....could you put that in there?"

[sucka4chix]

That article has about as much validity as a survey done by the cigarette makers on the dangers of smoking! Or an article about homosexuality written by Tim Hardaway. Way way way off the mark. I'm pretty laid back, and I don't stir up alot of sh*t, but in the words of DMX, "y'all gon' make me lose my mind up in here!!" I'm gonna start callin' bullshit bullshit, and that's some dark brown been constipated for days BULLSHIT!

[lahabra1976]

"There's a dick down there but she looks like a girl,so it doesn't count?" "



Well I think this is where the worlds definition of gay,straight,bissexual is messed up. They think by being with someone who looks like a girl and has a penis means you like men. They think your interest is defined by the sexual organ/parts and that is all that matters.

Well I tell you what I love breast, but just cause a woman has big breast and a ugly face doesn't mean I have an interest in her. I love nice butts, but just cause a woman has a nice butt and a ugly face doesn't mean I want to be with her.

Point is the interest a person has in someone isn't simply defined by sexual organs, its much more than that. I think someone who loves transexuals has no problem admitting the girl he is with has a penis. Its right there its not like you can ignore it, especially the big ones :) But there is the beauty and the breast and the butt, personality...That attract him also.

So it is absolutely wrong to believe that just cause a man likes being with a transexual that has a penis means that he likes men also cause he may not like the look of men's faces in terms of beauty and the fact they have no breast, etc.

[yodajazz]

[Sticks head above parapet] :shock:

Matchbox psychology has a lot to answer for!

The bitter rantings of someone who's just found out she has parity with the minge sisters.

Tranny chasers - There's no big secret, no ulterior motive, no dark design - It' pure, it's simple...It's sex!

If a girl needs some elaborate man-hating construct to make her feel better after she's just found out she's been used, then more power to her, she's just found out what it's like to be a gg [they've been doing it for years]; But, it doesn't change the reality. That for the majority of tranny chasers...It's just sex.

Like the saying goes, All men are bastards

Some grow out of it, some don't. :roll:

I agree with this. And the problem is that the article seems to put down every one who would be attracted to them sexually. However, sexual attraction is a part of many very good relationships.

The article over simplified by placing almost all into three categories. And then went on to over simplify within the categories it defined. Over simplification can be worse than nothing at all because it paints a false picture.

I believe that the site is down completely. I remember reading it a couple of years ago. I was incensed and wrote the site. We exchanged maybe three mails. My correspondent did admit that it was not that bad that someone would want to please them sexually.

Over all I agree with most of the responses to this thread. Thanks again Peggy for bringing it up.

[TSChaser]

I didn't pick this nickname, it's what some of the tgirls I know jokingly call me, so I went with it.

I have to agree with those on the side of "oversimplification", I don't fit into any of the described categories.

Interesting article though; excellent topic.

TSChaser

[BeardedOne]

I'd have to say that the article is heavily biased against any male who is attracted to a tgirl.

Just peeked at the thread, so I may have more to offer later.

I agree on this note. While I can relate to =some= of the 'admirer' role and =some= of the date/client' role, I can't exactly place myself in either of those categories without spilling over into some othe rdefinition.


This is definitely oversimplification. While there are definitely elements of truth here, it sounds like the author was mad at someone or more likely generalized a series of experiences and observations of forums like this.

Did Ann Coulter write this drivel?


This piece does however illustrate why I'm only slightly more comfortable with the term "admirer" than I am with "tranny chaser": neither represents the truth and depth of my attraction, though one is less insulting (both to myself and to those to whom I am attracted).

Some horse's ass signed off on a post one night by calling me a 'chaser'. Personally, I thought of it as a sort of promotion (And stated as such). Some of us, in our own minds anyway, have taken on the term in some small way similar to how gays adopted 'queer', lesbians took on 'dyke' and blacks embraced 'nigger' in ways that they could refer to themselves in a non-derogatory manor. When Richard Pryor pronounced "This nigger's crazy!" and Lea Delaria proclaimed on national teevee that she was a "Biiiiiggg DYKE!" they took the fire and brimstone out of the words and threw them into everyday lexicon.

So, am I a 'chaser' because I'm dick-centric and like the big ones? No way to tell, really. In the end (Mine or thiers) it's up to the gulrs to decide.


MacShreach

Many words. Whoa! :shock:

Very thought out and on the mark. I'll have to digest this some. I see myself in there somewhere...Somewhere.

[otherguy]

A very old page (who uses geocities anymore?) that misses the mark. Let's all pick holes in it, shall we?

Why must all tranny chasers be in search of domination? I've never been topped or 'penetrated' as MacShreach puts it, and don't really have any burning desire to--there are other things I'm in to.

[otherguy]

Did Ann Coulter write this drivel?

I'd like to see an HA poll on whether Ann Coulter pitches, switches or catches.

[Hara_Juku Tgirl]

when a girl likes u , ur her husband...when its over u are a chaser, lmao

:lol: Lmao Cheers to that Pickles..very funny! :lol:

Here's my definition:

A Trannychasers is someone who hits up on every single TG/TS/TV/CD that they come across with. Everything seems like a game to them with hopes of "Which transexual is going to put out first?" Which means these types of men are only in it for self gratification of sex and not really interested in the transexual as a person or a relationship.

As OPPOSED to:

An Admirer is someone whos already trancended (over and beyond just looking for sex) and is mindful and acknowledges the fact that theres more to a transexual woman than what lies between her legs, a pretty face and body. Theres the whole personality factor, compassion, understanding, intelligence amongst other things that are also important attributes and acknowledges that each transexual as unique individuals.

;)

~Kisses.

HTG

[hwbs]

:smoking just an observation ..not picking a fight...

[Hara_Juku Tgirl]

:smoking just an observation ..not picking a fight...

Nah you're super COOL in my book! :P

Honestly, a chaser is the TG equivalent of a player/womaniser (quanity of conquest is the name of their game). That's it!

~Kisses.

HTG

[Aragon21]

I like HaraJuku's definitions. The original definitions all assume that the man doesn't consider transexual M2F as women but rather view them as men.

I view transexuals as just a subset of women. Just as I can group asian, black, or white women together and say that is a unique group of women based on a commonality that the other women don't share with them. But all those groups are still women.

Let's put it another way I like triangles. I can see isosceles, equilateral, right, etc. I don't like rectangles, so even though a right triangle shares a trait with a rectangle (90 degree angle) doesn't mean it isn't a triangle.

To assume as the author did that being interested in transexuals is about homosexuality or being topped, belittles what a transexual is and to follow that line of thought would mean a transexual cannot have a happy, healthy relationship with a straight man.

[Hara_Juku Tgirl]

Thanks Aragon21. :P

~Kisses.

HTG

[peggygee]

Well if nothing else the original post, statements by transwomen and
responses by the gentlemen show that women are from Venus, men
are from Mars, and gay men are trying to get into Uranus. :roll:

Sorry, lousy joke that I've been wanting to use for the longest.

Seriously, it really does appear as if what many transwomen want is
very different from what some of the men that are into them
want.

Yes, I realize that this we have had this discussion or some variation of
it many times. But it bears repeating that the 'cock worshipping' that
many men do of transwomen is clearly not what these women desire.

And I will agree that the article oversimplifies the state of affair between
the genders.

However tranny chasers do exist, and they often wil manifest themselves
in the form of the gender, admirer, or client type. Sadly so, their numbers
are disproportionate to the men who genuinely value transwomen for
the qualities that these women want to be desired for.

It's been posited that seeking a women because she has a penis is akin
to desiring and seeking out large breasted women, or blondes, or thin
or heavy women, that it is jsut another physical characteristic.

Is that a bad thing, not neccesarily, if that is what both parties are
comfortable with.

But for the most part transwomen do not want to be desired or chased
for their penises.

To do so makes them a fetish object.

And that's a bad thing.

[Kriss]

women are from Venus, men
are from Mars, and gay men are trying to get into Uranus.
Sorry, lousy joke that I've been wanting to use for the longest.

Oh no that's pure class Peggygee. And I intend to use it a lot. Just you wait, I got some seriously 'wrong' material brewing........

[Kabuki]

[quote]and blacks embraced 'nigger'

I don't mean to hijack this thread, but I just wanted to say that some...the key word being "some" of the black community embraced the n word...although there's a slight difference in the word. "Nigger" is the version used by hateful individuals, and "Nigga" is the word that has been embrace by some of the black culture. I don't agree with both versions of the word, but I'm not going to talk about social studies involving the subject. I just think that people have certain views of the African-American community that aren't true. Most times they're not really informed about the true nature of that community. The media shows you the version that they want you to see. I don't know...it's frustrating to live with stereotypes in this world.

Anyways, you may now return to your original subject now :wink:

[peggygee]

Hi Peggy, nice to meet you and I see you have another of your thought-provokers there.


Although its tone is excessively shrill and defensive I basically think the article is on the money and reflects the attitude of a significant number of men who post here. They are indeed seeking to be sodomised and dominated by a person with a uniquely male characteristic, a dick, without ever having to admit that they are as queer as nine-bob notes.



The pleasure is all mine, and yup we're stretching those cerebral muscles
again.

I truly enjoyed reading your response, not so much because I
agreed with many of you points, but also because of the
extremely articulate way in which you conveyed them.

Also now the Yanks will know the conversion rate for 'queer as a $3 bill',
that would be 9 bob. :)




I think transsexual women are often in a very lonely position, particularly if they are pre-op, especially when they encounter men who do not want to practise sex that reinforces their femininity-- ie they want to be buggered by them. It is clear that pre-op escorts frequently lie to their customers; a significant number will only perform acts of penetration for money and if asked privately and anonymously in the context of a journalistic interview will say they do it for cash but they would never do it in love. When these girls go post-op they often, unsurprisingly, steer well clear of the type of men who were formerly their clients.



Actually the point of the article's author and many transwomen. For 'some'
transwomen the use of their penis may negate their femininity. Yes they
may do it for money, but their preference in their private lives and loves
is to be treated fully as women.




Furthermore the language used amongst such men and current on sites like this, terms such as "topping" and "bottoming" are straight out of the gay lexicon. I never, ever heard a genetic woman describe herself or even be described as "a bottom" (although it is possible that within the lesbian world there are usages I don't know about.) Why therefore would a transsexual woman want to have such terms applied to her? She is a woman, and words like "top" and "bottom" in this context are part of gay male language.


Yeah, I have always thought those terms were straight from Christopher
Street, or the Tenderloin, or the West End. A clever use of semantics
to defray any possible loss of masculinity.




It is also very clear that a good many "transsexuals" working in the sex industry are not women at all but simply gay men who have adopted the garb of femininity to the extent of changing their bodies. Naturally the business of gay sex with other men is not an issue for them. I must admit this was something I was really unprepared for when I began looking into this area closely. I can understand why genuinely transsexual woman want to distance themselves from people like that, although often I find the tone used by some transsexual women is too strident. Gender and sexuality are very broad churches and there is no black and white, only shades of grey. Whatever turns you on turns you on and nobody should be judgemental about consensual sex acts.



And much like the 'travestis' of Latin America there are some who have
adopted the garb and personas of womanhood purely for sexual
gratification and or monetary gain.

[The Guardian]

Hi Peggy, nice to meet you and I see you have another of your thought-provokers there.

IIRC that site has been around a long while--two years at least--but frequently goes tits-up when its bandwidth gets overloaded--probably whenever someone posts a link to it on sites like this.

Although its tone is excessively shrill and defensive I basically think the article is on the money and reflects the attitude of a significant number of men who post here. They are indeed seeking to be sodomised and dominated by a person with a uniquely male characteristic, a dick, without ever having to admit that they are as queer as nine-bob notes.

However there are also men here who freely admit they are either gay or bisexual and seem to be relaxed with it. I do take some contention with the notion that "tranny chasers" as defined in the article are automatically psychopathic and will go on to become sex criminals; for most men this whole thing never gets past the fantasy stage. Nevertheless I do think such men would have to be treated with great caution, especially by any transsexual woman they were sexually involved with.

I think transsexual women are often in a very lonely position, particularly if they are pre-op, especially when they encounter men who do not want to practise sex that reinforces their femininity-- ie they want to be buggered by them. It is clear that pre-op escorts frequently lie to their customers; a significant number will only perform acts of penetration for money and if asked privately and anonymously in the context of a journalistic interview will say they do it for cash but they would never do it in love. When these girls go post-op they often, unsurprisingly, steer well clear of the type of men who were formerly their clients.

However there is still the issue to be dealt with, for the post-op woman, that at least for the foreseeable future, a man having a relationship with such al woman voluntarily foregoes one of the biggest reinforcements of maleness there is, fatherhood, unless the man is older and has already achieved this.

Furthermore the language used amongst such men and current on sites like this, terms such as "topping" and "bottoming" are straight out of the gay lexicon. I never, ever heard a genetic woman describe herself or even be described as "a bottom" (although it is possible that within the lesbian world there are usages I don't know about.) Why therefore would a transsexual woman want to have such terms applied to her? She is a woman, and words like "top" and "bottom" in this context are part of gay male language.

It is also very clear that a good many "transsexuals" working in the sex industry are not women at all but simply gay men who have adopted the garb of femininity to the extent of changing their bodies. Naturally the business of gay sex with other men is not an issue for them. I must admit this was something I was really unprepared for when I began looking into this area closely. I can understand why genuinely transsexual woman want to distance themselves from people like that, although often I find the tone used by some transsexual women is too strident. Gender and sexuality are very broad churches and there is no black and white, only shades of grey. Whatever turns you on turns you on and nobody should be judgemental about consensual sex acts.

However, having said all that, there are clearly also pre-op TS women who are genuinely women who do like to use their penises in a penetrative manner yet who are determined to have GRS as soon as they can afford it. I believe this is an extention of role-play in that, as women, they are turned on by their unique ability to transform themselves from the female, penetrated, role to the male penetrating role. That must be a pretty powerful sexual hit, and indeed I have spoken to several girls who have said exactly that.

I am personally quite boring sexually, though I try hard to make it entertaining (I am a man who likes to penetrate women) but I think I can see how it might be that some men--often quite powerful, dominant men--might be turned on by being forcefully taken. I can also see how such a man might be thilled by this but unable, because of his normal dominance, to do it with someone he identified as another man. Enter the TS. Nadia has made some good comments on this recently.

Unfortunately, and to return to the article, the problem with this is that the woman is objectified-- she just becomes whatever pretty shape is pushing the penis, and judging by some of the views routinely expressed here, she doesn't have to be that pretty, as long as the dick is up to the task.

I think it's tough enough for genetic women to deal with that kind of objectification and they at least have a few real anchor-points to hold on to; for a transsexual woman, particularly a pre-op, this must be quite difficult; after all they are trying to establish a self-identity that in general society does not want them to have and also have to literally fight their bodies to get there.

It's a shame because in fact some women who have become women, whether or not they retain the elements of their anatomy that are in question here, are amongst the smartest, most fascinating, strong and genuinely funny women, for that matter people, I have ever met or communicated with. I guess you just don't go through all that stuff without developing strength of character.

Now I do realise that there will be indignant howls of pique from the knob-jockeys who will cry that this is retrograde, that the world has no need of definitions like "gay" or "straight," and to an extent I sympathise with them. But that's just cause I'm a sympathetic person and having to take a cold hard reality check can be tough.

Having recently come off a 1+ year truly unique relationship with a Transgendered Female (no I was not a "bottom"), I find your synopsis to be one of the most insightful comments I have read on this board.

What is this top/bottom shit. Call me a romantic, but whatever happened to "making love"? :?

[posty]

This doesn't seem that complicated. It's possible to like a woman because she has a penis, and it's possible to like a woman in spite of the fact she has a penis.

[ezed]

Gentlemen, Ladies, let me put this question to rest. The esteemed Doctor Fullofshit has definatifely define the term "Tranny Chaser".

"After sucking a T-girl to orasam AND SWALLOWING...this would be a 'Tranny Chaser"............

[Trogdor]

Simple, some seltzer, rum and a twist of lime. ~rimshot~ :mrgreen:

[MacShreach]

Hey MacS, how's by you? Long time, my friend!

Hi Ec, I'm great, you? I have to fly this morning but I'll PM you later to bring you up to speed--some stuff happening you might be interested in.

Best Mac

[MacShreach]

And much like the 'travestis' of Latin America there are some who have
adopted the garb and personas of womanhood purely for sexual
gratification and or monetary gain.

Hi again Peggy

To be fair, travesti culture is as complicated as transsexual culture anywhere and has to be seen within the broader Latin culture it exists within.

I think you're quite right that some travesti become so because of their socio-economic condition or even, to put it bluntly, to have a life at all, but you can't generalise from that. After all even just within the Brazilian porn movie business there are people like the former Lisa Lawer who after years working as a travesti in the sex industry went back to being a man and got married and on the other hand people like Christina Bianchini and Fernanda Rubia and many others, who moved on to GRS after they had saved the cash.


Having said that I agree that there are boys and young men, particularly those from poorer backgrounds, who transition for economic reasons. The extent to which such boys do become TS in order to satisfy the demands of men with money who desire the fetish of the cock attached to a feminine body, especially where there is coercion, which does definitely happen, is a pretty nasty secret which could do with some light being cast on it.

[tgirlzoe]

oh lordy. not this shit again.

we had a wikipedia edit war with her. she accused those of us reverting her changes as being fake transsexuals ~ undercover "chasers".

i had a lovely email conversation with her, perhaps not so productive, however. you can read it here (http://justanormalgirl.livejournal.com/1722.html). it's from way back in the day ~ dec 2005 ~ so my life has changed a bit in the past year and a half.

some of my frustration with the author:

First you called me a man because you said no trans woman would disagree with you. When I told you that I've been out as trans for 5 years and was well-established in the online trans "community", you said that I was only a girl on the Internet and knew nothing about real life. When I told you that not only was I living as a girl but stealth (minus my roommate), you reverted to calling me ugly and immature. Yeah, real useful.

(For the record, soon after this discussion I moved into the dorms entirely stealth. I didn't say a word to Housing or to my roommates. I live off-campus again now and I don't come out to people anymore. I did before because I worried that if they'd find out, they'd freak out and I'd be out of a room real fast. I don't like being homeless. I trust that my current housemates wouldn't kick me out if they found out what was between my legs.)

[BlackAdder]

Geocities is full of shit...

"Nigger" is the version used by hateful individuals, and "Nigga" is the word that has been embrace by some of the black culture."


an this my friend, is just pure sophistry....Its the same word...SAME WORD...

Sigh....

[TomSelis]

I'm black and "Nigger" and "Nigga" offend me no matter who says it.

[CrazyAboutTGirls]

I must say that despite it being a reductive and generalised argument (well it would have to be 1000 pages to not be) I saw some of my own behaviour in the categories Peggy described.

However, would it been seen as 'chasing' for a straight guy to go out and sleep with a girl on a Saturday night, and then not feel it necessary / want to date? Or indeed to do this habitually?

Men and women like sex. If you want to have it, you must meet those people you want to have sex with. There is no real shame in this, or problem with it amongst responsible, consenting adults. I have been to t-girl clubs, met t-girls and had sex. However, it is not up to me to then date them, or introduce them to my friends or anything else.

Also, the religious conotations / association while shame of the word sodomy are used in the article in the most pejorative way.

[Willie Escalade]

A very old page (who uses geocities anymore?) that misses the mark. Let's all pick holes in it, shall we?

Why must all tranny chasers be in search of domination? I've never been topped or 'penetrated' as MacShreach puts it, and don't really have any burning desire to--there are other things I'm in to.
Same here. I have no desire to be topped...although I'll admit I've thought about it (as we all have).

[hwbs]

show some fucking self respect and let the topic fall to the bottom , lmao

[Davyboy]

I have to say that I found this topic the most informative I have read on HA. Currently, I've been going through a spiral of drink, drug and sex addiction which has concerned me extremely. I have worries that I have many of the characteristics of the client type when I have been drinking and doing coke or meth which has been something of a vicious spiral recently.

I have to say that having read this article it has encouraged me to do what has been on my mind for a while and seeking some counselling on this issue.

I have had relationships with transgendered women but the thought of introducing them to family and friends has always led to me taking the cowards route out and subsequently only going to professional escorts.

All very worrying but I am on a massive comedown after drinking and doing drugs and escorts since Thursday night. Hopefully this will be a trigger to help me make the necessary steps in the right direction.

[kingaddictx]

The piece was overly generalize and simplistic. Sounds like a mad at the world jaded girl who's mad at the game.

sticks and stones lil one.