History of transexuals 70's, 80's and early 90's

[Youngmc]

Can anyone share what the scene was like in those decades, if there any clubs, was it better then or now, more or less gilrs? I like to know the evolution of this scene that i've grown to indulge in and embrace as my lifestyle. I'd like to know the history of what im getting into.

[trapmasta]

stay away from it.
at least the ghetto girls

[Youngmc]

....im from boston too and yea, i love jacques, but its not as good as it was a couple years ago, but its all we have for now.

[peggygee]

Can anyone share what the scene was like in those decades, if there any clubs, was it better then or now, more or less gilrs? I like to know the evolution of this scene that i've grown to indulge in and embrace as my lifestyle. I'd like to know the history of what im getting into.

Well, if I tell you some of the herstory, then somebody is gonna call me a 'granny tranny', then I am going to have to 'bust a cap' in some one, or start a flame war, or 'catch a case' :lol:

But, I can sum it up it four words.

IT WAS FUCKING INTENSE !!

In good, and bad ways. :shrug

[hiwatt1000]

...wasn't there La Cage aux Folie on La Cienaga in West Hollywood in the early 80's? That and Pennyfeathers, right next door...I just recall there being tons of transsexuals there...not just the staff, the dancers, but the chicks that'd hang-out around there...I remember seeing Pasha Lee there and doing a silent, "whoa..." to myself when I saw her in real-life...trippy...and I remember working in Downtown L.A. around that time and up 'til '89...and me and these Japanese guy's I worked with used to cruise down to one of these fucking scary Mexican bars along 7th street...we'd throw back a beer or two and wait for traffic lighten up before we hit the road...and El Caribe used to go off...tons of Mexican [latin] and Black transsexuals...you'd get a Corona for a few bucks, smoke at the bar, Michael Jackson on the jukebox and these really raw trannies of varying convincing looks and styles would just run the place...insane...and for a few bucks, a handjob or a blow job in your car would do the trick...a lot of traffic around there...pretty much L.A. used to have a cool scene back then...the gay culture wasn't mainstream, gentrified and pussy-like with wimpy muscle-men, it was cross-over and the energy was cool...even for straight dudes wanting to "check it out"...I would see some real rookie types that flourished into Lonny Brown and another one of those circa 1988 trannies...now, you get these top-drawer chicks that want to be chicks, but like gay guys...now it seems llike there's a ghetto for the trannie scene that is kinda lame compared to "back then"...now, if you don't have the look of some twerpy Abercombie-Fitch...or however you spell it type of dude and hang out at a gay bar every night...and disguise yourself as an ATM...you ain't gettin' shit, man...I used to love flirting with the chicks at that smoky, bar...'Stones comin' outta the crappy sound system and the smell of Aqua Net and cheap perfume...they'd act all sexy in front of the cracked mirror at the side of the bar...man, fun time...if you weren't there...sorry. You missed a great time that waasn't spent rulling broadband and actually went out to see some action...you didn't have to pay to get in some bar and wasn't nearly as inaccessible as it is nowadays...$350 to get fucked, or fuck some plastic chick that writes crap about you on some forum...about how she hates getting slobbered on some chubby dude with sticky balls...what do you expect, cunt...it's a dude...half those then chicks would get $10.00 and get butt-fucked in the front seat of my car, I go back...drink and two hours later do the same thing with another one...wasn't hard...you didn't have this bullshit barage of passing soomeone's "email me a photo..." test and L.A. SUN was the rag that had every chick with a dick in town peddling their wares...you could park anywhere in L.A. back then and West Hollywood wasn't this uptight stuff gay enclave as it is now...with horendous parking and $1.7 million will get you a shit, but charming 730 square foot rabbit hutch...it was rock-n-roll, star-struck sightings and the Peanuts scene was killer...it was fun, it was new it didn't require a membership...and the chicks appreciated you...pheeww...thanks...

[Perverted Monk]

^^^Good Shit Hiwatt

I actually remember hearing about La Cage aux Folie back in the 80's, but I was way to young to do anything about it then

[ragendude]

Its 1989 I am in LA a musician, with a little success and my 2nd wife decides to leave and with her departure I decide I am going to live the way I want to and not care what anyone thinks so I start openly dating TS girls. I had been seeing TS prostitutes on the low for about 6-7 yrs now but I wanted to meet and get to know these beauties, it was the late 80s, and all the girls I met, I found either on the street and we did quick anxiety filled sex in the car or in some seedy motel. I saw Serena Saunders(Pasha) dying in one such motel when a girl took me back to her room and Serena was there also.
Then I heard about Peanuts and the Queen Mary. I tried the Queen Mary first. I was overjoyed at the beautifully sexy girls I found there , not all mind you there were still alot of Old Men wearing thier wives old ass wig, but some of them were mind blowing, The first night I met Heather Fontaine, hot but way too drunk, And a latin gal named Anaee. Drop Dead gorgeous. We went back to her place and fucked for hours....for nothing. The thing was back then there was not a lot of "straight guys " seeking TS girls, very few really. So if you were straight masculine etc you pretty much could have your pick and probably more than 1 sometimes. You didn't have to pay, I not saying sometimes I am saying never. On the street yes but in the clubs I never had to pay and I always scored. The first time I went to peanuts it was much the same except more real fulltime TSs and again it was always free. In fact I met a black girl name Candice at Peanuts she used to do Diana Ross at QM. We had made eye contact at the QM the night before so when she saw me at Peanuts she approached me and asked if I would go home with her. I agreed of course and she took me to a motel, she paid for the motel and we spent the next few months together. In that time the girls were not all completely focused on how much $$, the demand hadn't skyrocketed yet (that wasn't until the late 90s really) and it was not trendy to be dating , or hanging out with TS girls. But all that changed when the Brazilians started making TS porno, and the once lame limp dicked movies suddenly were hot and filled with Beautiful Functional TS/TV. And the race was on. Gia Darling to the bull by the horns and now the TS porn genre was something to take seriously. The major metropolis' were flooded with new TS girls from Mexico and Latin America, the Filipina girls were unbelievable as well as all of the SE Asian girls and the demand was now being answered. But in that the value of the girls went through the roof and the guys were paying or it wouldn't have survived.. I guess they were the good old days for some of us but I am sure the girls who are profitting from the popularity and acceptance of the TS in society are happier now. My opinion only

check out my website for the TS admirers Its Free
http://sexstation69.homestead.com
:shock:

[chocolate ts freak]

...wasn't there La Cage aux Folie on La Cienaga in West Hollywood in the early 80's? That and Pennyfeathers, right next door...I just recall there being tons of transsexuals there...not just the staff, the dancers, but the chicks that'd hang-out around there...I remember seeing Pasha Lee there and doing a silent, "whoa..." to myself when I saw her in real-life...trippy...and I remember working in Downtown L.A. around that time and up 'til '89...and me and these Japanese guy's I worked with used to cruise down to one of these fucking scary Mexican bars along 7th street...we'd throw back a beer or two and wait for traffic lighten up before we hit the road...and El Caribe used to go off...tons of Mexican [latin] and Black transsexuals...you'd get a Corona for a few bucks, smoke at the bar, Michael Jackson on the jukebox and these really raw trannies of varying convincing looks and styles would just run the place...insane...and for a few bucks, a handjob or a blow job in your car would do the trick...a lot of traffic around there...pretty much L.A. used to have a cool scene back then...the gay culture wasn't mainstream, gentrified and pussy-like with wimpy muscle-men, it was cross-over and the energy was cool...even for straight dudes wanting to "check it out"...I would see some real rookie types that flourished into Lonny Brown and another one of those circa 1988 trannies...now, you get these top-drawer chicks that want to be chicks, but like gay guys...now it seems llike there's a ghetto for the trannie scene that is kinda lame compared to "back then"...now, if you don't have the look of some twerpy Abercombie-Fitch...or however you spell it type of dude and hang out at a gay bar every night...and disguise yourself as an ATM...you ain't gettin' shit, man...I used to love flirting with the chicks at that smoky, bar...'Stones comin' outta the crappy sound system and the smell of Aqua Net and cheap perfume...they'd act all sexy in front of the cracked mirror at the side of the bar...man, fun time...if you weren't there...sorry. You missed a great time that waasn't spent rulling broadband and actually went out to see some action...you didn't have to pay to get in some bar and wasn't nearly as inaccessible as it is nowadays...$350 to get fucked, or fuck some plastic chick that writes crap about you on some forum...about how she hates getting slobbered on some chubby dude with sticky balls...what do you expect, cunt...it's a dude...half those then chicks would get $10.00 and get butt-fucked in the front seat of my car, I go back...drink and two hours later do the same thing with another one...wasn't hard...you didn't have this bullshit barage of passing soomeone's "email me a photo..." test and L.A. SUN was the rag that had every chick with a dick in town peddling their wares...you could park anywhere in L.A. back then and West Hollywood wasn't this uptight stuff gay enclave as it is now...with horendous parking and $1.7 million will get you a shit, but charming 730 square foot rabbit hutch...it was rock-n-roll, star-struck sightings and the Peanuts scene was killer...it was fun, it was new it didn't require a membership...and the chicks appreciated you...pheeww...thanks...LOL.... I used to hit those same bars in downtown LA back in the 80's and 90's. I also used to go to the Blacklite on Western Blvd. Yeah, everything you guys say is true. Back then the girls were a lot less money driven, and more about getting with you because they're attracted to you. I had a knack for finding hole in the wall bars that were really trannie bars that not too many knew about. And always was asked if I wanted to go home with them. Not saying I'm Fabio or anything, thats just how it was. There was also a small bar in Hollywood, may have been on Cauhenga between Sunset and Santa Monica. Can't remember the name. And of course the NY scene was just as hot. Sally's when it was on 44th and 8th and right around the corner on 8th was a porno shop with trannies upstairs. About 8 to 10 girls in front of their booths and more inside the peep booth thingy. All kinds of sex went on up their and a lot of drugs. I'll never forget this very attractive black girl who was thick and hung kept pleading with me to meet her after work and go home with her. This was the 80's where I was still curious, but hadn't done the deed with a tgirl. So needless to say, I was nervous. She also lived in Jersey, and I was new to NY, so I didn't take her up on the offer. To this day I still regret that. Thats the way it was though. A lot of sex with no strings attached. Thats why I stay away from the scene today. Like you said Hiwatt, plastic tgirls with plastic attitudes and all thats on their mind is money. They reall don't respect the men like they used to. That nasty term they use "Tranny Chaser" wasn't heard of back then. Girls never said that because they appreciated the fact that men found them attactive and desireable. Sylvia, God bless her soul(who did a couple of porn vids) was one of the nicest girls I ever met. No pretense, no attitude. She just liked sex and weed and having a good time. She could teach the girls today a thing or two about respecting and appreciating men. Hiwatt, do you remember Sylvia and did you ever see her? Just curious.

[ragendude]

Sylvia was one of the Transsexuals I saw in a magazine for the 1st time in around 1981-82 along with another Mexican Girl Claudia/Marissella who I ended up dating for a little while in the early to mid 90s. And I met Sylvia around 1992 when I was getting busy with her roommate and Sylvia strolled in the room and sat down very casually and asked if she could watch...I had no problem with that. She was very nice though!!! Unfortunately she passed away prematurely a few years back of a viagra induced heart attack, this is fact. R.I.P.

[ragendude]

Serena Saunders aka Pasha

[ragendude]

Yes I was lucky enough to meet many of the girls that are now talked of only in stories and fables. Kind of weird because I met most of them on their way down but I was just getting into that scene and finding out later how many of them have died, it's kinda of scary, sio really I gueaa I am more than lucky I'm blessed to have survived ...many did not
i.e. Serena, Stasha, Dana Douglas , Morelle Dekeigh, Lealani, Margo, Julie Bond
I later became good freinds with China Ktty if anyone remebers her she was very hot and only did a few Videos but was very popular, I dated Angel Kelly, I knew Kelly Mancuso even b4 she started making the transition, Lony Brown when she was the waitress at Peanuts, It seemed more glamorous then....ahhh the good ol days

[RangeHova]

I guess I came in right after the glory days but before the modern day era. Like another poster said, the popularity of the new improved porn bumped up the sexual demand.

I was on the fringe of some of the glory days, just watching and not indulging. I meet some of the Sally's Hideaway girls and would save my allowance and lunch money to get my teenage ass to 42nd street (the forty deuce) every chance that I could. Not so much for the transwomen but the scene as a whole. I really loved the club kid days and the early days of the raves.

It was cool to be around so many free kids my own age. It was just as sad. Especially seeing how many incredible people didn't make it.

It is so cool to meet girls that are still with us just to hear thier stories.

I freakin love this site http://www.sallys-hideaway.com/A_History.html

I just wish there were more sites like it. I have often wondered why there weren't more memorial type recognitions of the legends that have passed on.

[ragendude]

It's funny that you mention the lack of any comemorative sites for the TS history. I used to have an MSN group called Sex Station 69 that was fairly popular and it had a "cyber" museum called the Stick pussy Hall of Fame documenting & honoring the past and present performers in the TS/TV genre of porn. The group was deleted by the A-holes at MSN when they suddenly stopped allowing Adult groups . So I have made a new Sex Station 69 and it also has a Stick Pussy Hall of Fame paying tribute to the legends of the past . It is free and getting quite a large amount of content so if you are into TSs go check it out and let me know what you think
http://sexstation69.homestead.com

Here are a couple more "legends" I had the pleasure of knowing

[chocolate ts freak]

Sylvia was one of the Transsexuals I saw in a magazine for the 1st time in around 1981-82 along with another Mexican Girl Claudia/Marissella who I ended up dating for a little while in the early to mid 90s. And I met Sylvia around 1992 when I was getting busy with her roommate and Sylvia strolled in the room and sat down very casually and asked if she could watch...I had no problem with that. She was very nice though!!! Unfortunately she passed away prematurely a few years back of a viagra induced heart attack, this is fact. R.I.P.Wow, I heard her passing was due to something else. Either way, I was pretty bummed to find out she passed away. If she were still living, I'd fly to LA just to see her. Thats just how much fun she was. Btw, this pick in no way does her justice. she was very pretty and was about 10 to 11 inches. And boy she could fuck. She did a video as part of the old Trisexual Encounters series called Master of the House. Check that one out.

[ragendude]

You know how rumours are especially when it comes to a Famous TS dying, its always AIDS, but I have been pretty well rooted in the LA TS scene for quite a while and a freind of mine was Sylvia's toyboy so to speak and he was the first person the Police called when she was found. Apparently a "date" that was with her at the time just left her when it happened and my freinds number was the last number called on her cell phone. Sad really. And you are right that pic does her no justice she was much more glamorous than that. ANd she had some pipe....legendary pipe

[hiwatt1000]

...ya know, I didn't really get to "know" any of the girls back then. As I had mentioned-I was tripping around...bored and stubbled upon something here in in L.A. during a great time. Ya, I had just found out about AIDS...I remember when Klaus Nomi died and then it was Keith Herring [sp?] and Rock Hudson...here I was a bored, jaded dude looking for thrills and there you had it...the Blacklight was a cool place, but you had to sort through the talent...men in dresses and then a few good chicks here and there...AIDS took out a lot of people and I seriously think that had a lot to do with designing the terrain for the gay, lesbian TG culture. Fun, but scary time...

...the other dynamic back in L.A. was that the punk rock scene shared turf with the gay community. There wasn't this crazy categorized nomenclature for people, it was a time and place where if you didn't fit it back home, the Carter era America had a place for you...your closest big city to wherever you're from...the Regan era America slowly put an end to that. So, before punk rock became a crazy commercialized garbage front for crappy music and the gay community became just as fucking uptight as the Right Wingers trying to chastizes them--80's L.A. was the place to explore and have a great time...I remember how you'd go to a club back then and right next to Debby Harry and Chris Stien [blondie fame] would be a transsexual...you'd chat, have a smoke, move on...you'd go to Seven Seas or some after hours club, like Zero One Gallery and not only would you be hanging out with David Lee Roth, some famous artist dude, but you'd do a line of coke with some transexual in shitter...it was interesting and doing the natural thing of exploring and tripping out on the fringe culture was fuckin' cool...it wasn't a commodity as it is now...as the other posters mentioned-"tranny chaser" wasn't a term and yes, the chicks were stoked that you'd hang out and it seemed as though, if you're here with them...you're of the same mindset/appreciation...it was interesting...ya, this might seem like nostalgia, but when I say interesting–you had people that were creative and a having creativity was a part of their lifestyle...there wasn't a gallery opening party in the '80s that wasn't populated by a large majority of the gay culture...and punk rock culture, too...and along with that came the transsexuals...things now are one big giant strip-mall...ya, the girls a really good looking now and the variety is pretty broad, but it's so saturated with tons of money grubbing chicks that all have the same nose, same tits and same bullshit dialog...nothing interesting...just one big disco shopping plastic surgery trip to the next party...bitchen...

...it's sad that a lot of the people from that era fell to AIDS an other health related ails, but I think of it this way...it was a "moveable feast", to coin Hemmingway, circa Paris 1926...people took, took and took and built a culture out of opportunity and forgot to put back into it...kinda the same thing now...you think Sulka, Pasha and the rest of them would've helped the community more, but you gotta keep in mind...most of them had one main thing on their list of things to do and that was the SRS and gettign the money to cover that...and that meant hustling...that meant and lead onto other things...so, when their dicks got turned inside out, sorry-the scene did, too...sucks, it was fun, now I feel like I need to have nothing short of money to burn, abs of steel and dress like a goon and stand alongside all the rest of the fools drooling over some dude in a dress...

...maybe it'll make a turn, maybe it already has and I'm too jaded to see it...but maybe I'll just have to open my own place...like the ones I used to stubble upon and have that shitty juskebox full of scratchy Donna Summer, Bay City Roller and Rod Stewart 45's...ya, sorry 45's guys... and have cheap beer and smoking allowed...then the cars can stop by and flirt with the girls on the corner...ya, I can see it now...I just might have to do that...

[tsluva]

ragendude wrote:

But all that changed when the Brazilians started making TS porno, and the once lame limp dicked movies suddenly were hot and filled with Beautiful Functional TS/TV. And the race was on. Gia Darling to the bull by the horns and now the TS porn genre was something to take seriously. The major metropolis' were flooded with new TS girls from Mexico and Latin America, the Filipina girls were unbelievable as well as all of the SE Asian girls and the demand was now being answered. But in that the value of the girls went through the roof and the guys were paying or it wouldn't have survived.. I guess they were the good old days for some of us but I am sure the girls who are profitting from the popularity and acceptance of the TS in society are happier now. My opinion only


Interesting views and points.
and you're right in Brazilian Tranny films
( particularly Sunshine productions) resurrected
the trend of feminent, busty, as i do recall .

Actually with all due respect to Gia Darling,who no questioned
has heavily helped create the boom demand for Tgirl films, i believe
it was actually Joey Silvera( and his Rogue Adventures series)
and Devil films and their terrific cast of performers
( vanity, brandy scott, lisa lawrence, gina, megan cavalier
and kimberly devine)

i've always considered Kim Christy (Leoram) to be
the original " pioneer "
of shemale porn as we know it in the beginning
( and primarily the one first who turned me onto transexuals)
with a lot of of girls that were previously mentioned
(pasha, sylvia, sulka, julie bond, carnal candy,jennifer, Leiland,
Kelly michaels. etc.) before unfortunately the era of
TV/crossdressers films and stars that emerged like
Karen Dior, Crystal Crawford, Lana Luster,
Rick Rogue among others dominated the scene
and then after came as you made
mentioned some non-functional/strictly bottom types
(Lony Brown, lana woods, lilenne Li ) before we started
finally started seeing the more intriguing, appealing
and more functional ones when Sunshine, Joey Silvera
and Devil Films broke through.

And keep in mind that Gia Darling stardom actually
originated from Androgeny - Avalon's Production
( Transexual Beauty Queens series ) during the
Silvera era before she gradually built
her own legendary empire of tranny films.
In between the Silvera and Darling eras , we've even
had shemale phenoms like Brazilian Suzanna Holmes
and Australia's Christie Nicole who have awed tranny fans...

Now a trend of Asian tranny films are on the rise, more than
ever but i'm loving the fact that a number of
mainstream studios and stars turned directors/producers
( Nacho, Rocco Tom Byron, Jake Steele, Anabolic, Odyssey etc)
have turned to producing tranny films because of the
obvious popularity and public demand, as well
as AVN notoriety that could come with it
( as Silvera, Nacho have enjoyed ) ... and if it takes producing
shemale films in order for them to get great notice and
acclaim, then so be it !
and who knows what other well known adult star will enter
the fray of tranny films in the very near future.
( rodney moore? jim powers ? ron jeremy ?)
.

[hiwatt1000]

...here's a novel idea...why not turn off the computer, turn off the tv, not rent or buy any of these tranny flicks, or even subscribe to any sites...and how's this...get back out an be social...not a bad idea...see them in person...and maybe it was the convenience of all this accessibilty every taboo now available on the net that's creating terms like "tranny chaser", and...ya know what...I'm gonna do just what I prescribed...turn the computer off and get out and see it all...expect more tales to follow...

[chocolate ts freak]

You know how rumours are especially when it comes to a Famous TS dying, its always AIDS, but I have been pretty well rooted in the LA TS scene for quite a while and a freind of mine was Sylvia's toyboy so to speak and he was the first person the Police called when she was found. Apparently a "date" that was with her at the time just left her when it happened and my freinds number was the last number called on her cell phone. Sad really. And you are right that pic does her no justice she was much more glamorous than that. ANd she had some pipe....legendary pipeTrust me, I know all about that pipe. Hey Ragen, did you know many of the Santa Monica Blvd. girls back in the early 90's? There was a girl by the name of Sunny who was sooo fucking sexy. I remember running into her one night on some side street around Santa Monica/La Brea. She smoked a primo with me, and I was so high I went down and started sucking her. We weren't hidden or covered by anything so we couldn't continue, but we finished at a later date. Man she was sexy. I lived pretty wild back then and I'm also very fortunate that I survived unscathed. Just wondering if you knew her. By far, she had to be one of my best street pick-ups. My best LA bar pick-up was a girl named Pepper. Very dark skinned girl. Kinda thick. Loved topping and 3 somes. Met her at the Blacklite. Actually, back then, if you wanted to find a hot black tgirl, you could cruise Western Blvd from Santa Monica to about 3rd st. I had some luck back then doing that also. I imagine its no where near the same.

[chocolate ts freak]

Here is the vid that best shows off Sylvia. I think I'll order it and watch it real soon. Thats her scene in the upper right hand corner.

[ragendude]

Yes I did know Sunny and you are right she was sexy as hell out there. And the Blacklite was such a pit but it had action, sleaze, charisma. It has changed alot out there. Different attitude and priorities I guess. New generations come and things change, It has to be that way. I used to take my Harley down to the Taco stand/ Car wash on Santa Monica & La Brea on Friday or Saturday night and just park it and kick back and watch the show. I was high and just tripping on the girls. How many of them there were and how different each of these working girls were from each other. There would be 40 or 50 girls on that corner. There would always be a few fights, now that is something to see when the girls kick off their 6" stillettoes and start bombing on each other. It is at this point you are snapped back to reality that these are men. They fight like men and do some serious damage. Or when the Sheriffs Deputies would roll up in the parking lot and you would see 40 or 50 girls in 6" stilletoes take off in a dead sprint in every different direction, lets see some of these GGs do that. It was amazingly entertaining. I actually made quite a few freinds out there with the girls, one little tiny asian girl with long ass hair and tiny body Fucking sexy and she knew it, Linda Lee, I was so infatuated with her, chasing her around like she was a crack dealer & I a crack head, giving her rides all over LA county, even giving her jackets & shirts when she was working the street and freezing her ass off in a little tiny dress. The other Queens hated her cuz she was clocking that money, off the hook really. I didn't see her for more than 10 years and then I ran into her in jail. Still very pretty, very sexy but even nastier and more direct then ever. She went a little over the edge with the crack & meth so she is kinda out there now. To get back to the point Yes I did know sunny she was cool, I became heavily saturated into the Latin Drag scene when I started seeing a well known showgirl who performs still today, she was performing at Tempo, Plaza, Arena , Circus, Robbie's in Pomona and I got to see how many Latina Queens are out there in LA as well as SF, NYC, Miami, TX. The Latins and particularly the Mexican girls have dominated the scene now for quite awhile, especially the streets, that is all you will see at SM & Western now. I never realized that they were so many girls until I started going to the drag shows my GF performed in...unbelievable and gorgeous some of them, even today I think they get more and more beautiful and passable with every new generation.. Just check out eros and there is the proof.. Thanks for the walk down memory lane everyone.....

[chocolate ts freak]

Thats cool Ragen. I bet we both know a few girls from the stroll back then. So Western and Santa Monica is all latino. Where have all the black girls gone? I haven't been out there in over 10 years so I know a lot has changed. Off the subject a little, but could you tell me if two of my old watering holes are still around. Boardner's and the Powerhouse both in Hollywood. Would like to visit those places if they're still around. I also heard another one of my old spots Small's on Melrose is no longer around.

[ragendude]

Yeah I am sure we do know some of the same lovely creatures of the night, as far as the black girls and where they have gone they just moved down the road a bit to Highland & Santa Monica and the few blocks west of highland as well (on SM) but Hglnd/SM is too fucking hot One time is there every time u blink . U know its got that 24hr Del Taco on the otherside but the Sistas hang around the Donut shop and down the next block east by the Taco stand cuz they are all 24/7. The Black girls are plentiful there bro. And re: your clubs Boardners is still kicking ass actually with many different theme nights Saturdays being the Goth S&M night, the other clubs have been shut down for a couple years now. Blacklight is still going, the Spotlight is still the hustler/dope joint somethings never change......for better or worse..Peace

[Fox]

Very interesting. Being born in '84 means I missed out on some good times, it seems.

[aeonflux1964]

Let's bring it back to the East coast for a minute. I remember a great club right near Times Square called Sally's II. It was mostly black and hispanic. This was a classic tgirl hookup spot if there ever was one. It was pretty chill there. You could hangout for hours and nobody messed with you and you could take most of the girls outside or back to their spot for some sweet ass. Lot's of really hot girls there preening and showing out most nights.

Anybody remember this spot, besides me?

[aeonflux1964]

Let's bring it back to the East coast for a minute. I remember a great club right near Times Square called Sally's II. It was mostly black and hispanic. This was a classic tgirl hookup spot if there ever was one. It was pretty chill there. You could hangout for hours and nobody messed with you and you could take most of the girls outside or back to their spot for some sweet ass. Lot's of really hot girls there preening and showing out most nights.

Anybody remember this spot, besides me?

Here is a very detailed history of this historic spot:

"Sally's Hideaway" was a Times Square nightclub located at 264 West 43rd Street, between 7th and 8th Avenues, from 1986 to 1992. It occupied a small, narrow, one-story site that had formerly been the home of "Blue's," itself a Times Square landmark. Blue's was refuge, watering hole, and mecca to its patrons -- purveyors and practitioners of the Times Square sex trade and other various related street business. Blue’s had been managed by a man named "Conrad," the former manager of "The Anvil," a groundbreaking gay club opened in 1974 and located near the waterfront at 10th Avenue and 14th Street, as famous for its graphic onstage shows featuring dildo play and nipple clamps -- usually starring a hunky, square-jawed and macho young man named Toby -- as for its freewheeling backroom action. Felipe Rose, the "Indian" in The Village People, had danced on its bar before his ascent to Village People-fame. The mid-70's roles and playful stereotypes The Village People celebrated were, in fact, typical of the macho gay male ideal of the era -- in fact, "Village" in "Village People" referred directly to that cluster of gay clubs where that macho gay male ideal reigned supreme - aligned along the West Side Highway from 14th to 21st Streets - the Eagle, the Spike, and the Anvil - and south to the piers along the Hudson River and to Christopher Street, historically emblematic of the gay spirit in New York City

Times Square, during those days, in contrast to the Village, was the place where Black and Latin drag queens and hustlers were in their element, where sex was more a business than a form of recreation. The Village, with the exception of a drag/femme queen hustling strip along 14th Street and 9th Avenue stretching over to the Hudson River, was more Caucasian, the sons (mostly) and daughters of the middle class, more educated, generally more privileged and "entitled." This constituted - generally - the racial and economic Divide but as AIDS began to devastate the gay landscape in the early 80's many fell and fell hard - on either side of the Divide. The Anvil, which had opened it doors in September, 1974, on the tide of sexual liberation, after a spectacular 11-year run, was forced to close its doors in November, 1985, as much a casualty of the disease itself as of the homophobic hysteria that began to grip the country. Other businesses closed - either forcibly or voluntarily - including the Mineshaft (around the corner from the Anvil on Washington Street) and the bathhouses - the Everard Baths on 28th Street, the Club Baths and St. Marks Bathhouse, Man's Country Bathhouse on 15th Street, the Barracks. The Cockring, a popular dance club at the corner of Christopher Street and the West Side Highway, was on the ground floor of a building remodeled into a luxury hotel - the River Hotel - in anticipation of the gay boom the late '70's seemed to offer - but both closed as AIDS decimated the culture and the hotel, in a tragically ironic twist, was ultimately converted to an AIDS hospice - Bailey House. That time - the early mid '80's - was a desperate time.

After the closing of the Anvil, Conrad moved on to Blue's, managing it from January of 1986 until later that same year when a man named Sally Maggio took over the space, renaming the bar "Sally's Hideaway." Sally's previous business venture had been the "Greenwich Pub," at 8th Avenue and 13th Street in Greenwich Village, opened in the early 80's. The Greenwich Pub was a popular gathering place for transgender gays and their "admirers." Drag shows and male strip shows constituted the cabaret entertainment and as popular as it was with its colorful clientele, it was Sally's move to Midtown and the opening of "Sally's Hideaway" that solidified Sally's preeminence in the world of pre-op transsexuals, drag queens, cross-dressers, transvestites, male strippers and hustlers of every stripe and hue.

Sally began his show biz career as a manager at the infamous "220 Club," located at 220 West Houston Street, one of the most famous of the transgender/gay nightclubs of the early 1970's, where he met Jesse Torres, an ample-bodied femme queen who also worked at the 220 and who became one of his closest friends and - later - his business partner. It can probably be said that the 220 Club descended directly from the Stonewall Inn and - by extension - the Stonewall riots. The Stonewall Inn was popular with transgender gays and it was their courage that played such an important role in the Stonewall riots of 1969, the beginning of the modern Gay Liberation Movement. The 220 Club was the foremost venue for the transgender crowd in its day, a distinction later shared by the Greenwich Pub, Sally's Hideaway, and, later, Sally's II.

Sally's Hideaway was damaged by fire in 1992 and Sally, undeterred, moved a few doors down the block to 252 West 43rd Street, formerly occupied by an after-hours-style drug den named "Rose Saigon." Renamed "Sally's II," it would thenceforth be known simply as "Sally's." Sally's conveniently connected by way of a catwalk to the lobby of the Carter Hotel (previously known as the Dixie Hotel). The 24-story Carter Hotel towered monumentally over the cityscape, its huge red neon sign visible for miles, a phallus, a temple, its rooms available for the "short stay."

Sally's held a circular bar, two flights above the street, and a small lounge, up another small flight of stairs at the side of the bar. The low-ceilinged lounge area consisted of a dozen small cocktail tables, a pool table, a parquet-tiled open area set aside for the drag shows and go-go boy contests. Behind the bar a wall of doors remained permanently closed until one day Sally discovered that the "Carter Theatre " lay beyond. This large, shabby, unused space - originally the hotel's dining room - contained another long set of doors to the immediate left as you entered the room from the bar area which opened directly into the lobby of the Carter Hotel. This space had apparently once been converted to a 70's-style disco, the mirrored disco ball and strings of flashing lights and spotlights were still in working order around its expansive dance floor. The room bore witness to the hotel's former grandeur, two of its walls still covered with a beautiful hand-painted mural on lacquered canvas, from the 1940's when the space was called the "Plantation Bar & Lounge" and/or the "Plantation Room," replete with genteel antebellum scenarios and depictions of classic Greek architecture. A trompe-d'oeil striped awning was painted onto the upper reaches of this near-15-foot-high mural to a ceiling said to be upholstered in leather hidden behind the dropped ceiling of acoustical tiles. A stage stood at one end of the room, directly in line with the bar, and it was into this space that Sally's II expanded, coming into its own, a venue for numerous drag pageants as well as a number of drag balls hosted-by or in-homage-to the great ballroom legends of the day - including Octavia St. Laurent, Pepper LaBeija, Danielle Revlon, Avis Pendavis. It was here that Paris Dupree's "Paris is Burning" ball - the annual ball from which the documentary, "Paris is Burning," took its name - was held in 1992. Each week, the Wednesday night Go-Go Boy Contests featured a handful to as many as 15 contestants - a mix that included beefy "professional" strippers from the Show Palace on 8th Avenue or the Gaiety Theater (201 West 46th Street) to anorexic Latino Fan Club porn "stars" to a kick boxing champion to a certified porn star to your average-Joe-wandered-in-off-the-street. Their names . . "Lionheart," "Special K," "Kaos," "Doctor Love," "Brown Sugar," "Pretty Boy," "Honey Boy," "Johnny Boy," "Midnight," "Obsession," "Shogun," "David Flex," "Suave," "Mike Love," "Finesse." These shows attracted an audience of admiring "girls" who, otherwise, held sway, here in their brokedown palace. It was in this hallowed place and against these murals that I photographed these . . the Gods of Times Square . . in all their unfettered glory and recorded a last fleeting and - in retrospect - poignant glimpse of an endangered Times Square lifestyle - an endangered species, if you will, now extinct - from 1992 to 1997.

Sally took his emcees - Dorian Corey, Angie Xtravaganza, who was the Mother of the House of Xtravaganza, and the "Amazing, Electrifying Grace" with him from Sally's Hideaway to Sally's II. Another emcee, who died shortly after the move, was the famous Chaka Savalas. Both Dorian and Angie were principals in the film "Paris is Burning," an acclaimed documentary on the drag balls of Harlem released in 1990 and both were considered "Legends" within the drag ball world. It should be noted that - fittingly - the opening and ending sequences of "Paris is Burning" were shot outside Sally's Hideaway.

The "Amazing, Electrifying Grace," the sharp-tongued and quick-witted "diva," was a lip synch performer and comedienne who began her career in the aforementioned Anvil in the late 1970's where she performed on a permanent basis until that club fell victim to the AIDS hysteria and panic that closed it and several other gay businesses in 1984. She went on to emcee and perform at Sally Maggio's Greenwich Pub and later at Midtown 43, a club descended from the Nickel Bar, a black gay bar originally located on West 72nd Street, and which then moved to the basement of the Diplomat Hotel and was renamed "Midtown 43" in 1986 before moving across the street and down the block, where Grace headed a Sunday night drag revue. Midtown 43, a gay disco who's House DJ was the famous Andre Collins (currently of "Warehouse" fame) was, in its final incarnation, located one block east of Sally's Hideaway on 43rd Street, just east of Broadway, directly next to Town Hall and across the street from the Times Square landmark, a cavernous Nathan's Restaurant (of Nathan's Famous Hot Dog), since replaced by an office tower. Midtown 43 closed abruptly in 1989. Grace was working at Sally's Hideaway at that time and when it moved into the Carter Hotel and was renamed Sally's II, Grace was given a steady gig emceeing Sundays and sometimes Monday nights (Talent Night). Grace was loved by many and had a loyal following, especially among the ball house crowd - which consisted mainly of 'butch queens" - who were the predominant patrons of Midtown 43. These same butch queens, for the most part, rarely patronized Sally's Hideaway or Sally's II as Sally's catered pretty exclusively to the working "girls" or "femme queens" and their admirers.

Times Square, during this period, was a hotbed for the drag ball scene. Ball queens/transgender "show girls" supported themselves working in the peep shows - Show Center (on 42nd Street, between 7th and 8th Avenues) or Show World (at the corner of 42nd Street and 8th Avenue). Show Palace, a male burlesque house located on 8th Avenue between 42nd and 43rd Streets, featured male strippers who might, on occasion, "walk the balls" for "Body" or "Realness" or who might show up to compete in the scandalous Wednesday night "Go-Go Boy Contest" at Sally's Hideaway and, later, Sally's II.

Sally Maggio died in October, 1993. His friend and business partner, Jesse Torres, managed the bar following his death. It was during this period that Times Square, under Mayor Rudolph Guliani and the real estate interests, began to undergo re-development, much of the area bought up by the Walt Disney Corporation, driving out the adult businesses, condemning and demolishing the heart and soul of the district, including Show Center and Show Palace. That heart and soul, immortalized so vividly in John Rechy's City of Night, represented a singular American sensibility, one that combined such venerable American traditions as vaudeville, honky-tonk, Barnum and Bailey, the sexual liberation of the 1960's and 1970's. The vibrant street culture - sidewalk preachers, portable photo studios, bangy boys and girls, tourists, hustlers, gawkers of every persuasion, the sexual libertines - was stopped dead in its tracks by power-hungry politicians and greedy corporate entities intent on obliterating Times Square to be remade into its own bland, safe, sanitized, commercialized, cynically re-packaged, contrived, and inauthentic image. The mall-ing of America had finally infected the symbolic heart and soul of the greatest city in the world. Where there once stood real steel and concrete and paint and grit and longing and lust there now stands a plastic theme park far removed from the blood and guts of real life.

Jesse Torres, tragically, died quite unexpectedly while attending the Miss Continental Pageant in Chicago in September, 1996 and Giselle, a long-time Sally's barmaid, was installed as the new manager. Sally's II, however, teetered on, closing off the ballroom space as business waned, sadly relegated to a small alcove area a few steps above the front bar, until it finally closed its doors forever, following a series of Guliani-inspired police busts, in November, 1997. Since then, the management of the Carter Hotel leased out the space, including the ballroom or "Carter Theatre," tearing out and trashing the historic murals, despite efforts by myself to save them. The dreamy and idealized depictions contained in those 1940's murals - a candelabra, a Southern lady and gentleman dining, a violinist, a lady playing a piano, Greek revival architecture - emblematic of the "Southern hospitality" of the original Dixie Hotel - provided a visual counterpoint to the cruder realities of late-20th-century Times Square. Now those backdrops against which so many dramatic lives were lived, just as those who lived them, exist only in photographs taken by myself over a five-year period - 1992 to 1997.

All of Sally's businesses had one thing in common - they were places where the dark and ravishing beauty of those denizens of the City of Night flourished - and it is in a spirit of awe and wonderment at the expression of freedom and the strong, flawed, fearless, tragic, and heroic humanity I found at Sally's Hideaway and all its satellite venues that this site is dedicated to Sally, Dorian, Angie, Grace, Jesse and the very many wonderful, beautiful, inspiring people who passed through those doors.

[aeonflux1964]

Here is a link to some pics from Sally's

http://www.sallys-hideaway.com/A_Pictorial_History.html

[vanished]

[quote="hiwatt1000Sylvia, God bless her soul(who did a couple of porn vids) was one of the nicest girls I ever met. No pretense, no attitude. She just liked sex and weed and having a good time. She could teach the girls today a thing or two about respecting and appreciating men. Hiwatt, do you remember Sylvia and did you ever see her? Just curious.

God, where are these girls today? I remember smoking a nice fat joint with Johanna right in the center booth at Edelweiss on 10th Avenue in NYC and partying with the girls all the time for nothing - it was about good sex, good friendship and good weed/favors. Where are these girls today? Sigh.......Sally's, Vault, Hellfire, and the old Edelweiss. Good times not forgotten.

[chocolate ts freak]

[quote="hiwatt1000Sylvia, God bless her soul(who did a couple of porn vids) was one of the nicest girls I ever met. No pretense, no attitude. She just liked sex and weed and having a good time. She could teach the girls today a thing or two about respecting and appreciating men. Hiwatt, do you remember Sylvia and did you ever see her? Just curious.

God, where are these girls today? I remember smoking a nice fat joint with Johanna right in the center booth at Edelweiss on 10th Avenue in NYC and partying with the girls all the time for nothing - it was about good sex, good friendship and good weed/favors. Where are these girls today? Sigh.......Sally's, Vault, Hellfire, and the old Edelweiss. Good times not forgotten.Sorry to say but those girls and those times have done what your screen name says, VANISHED. Now if your a drug selling weed smoking young latin hood rat, you might still have some action. Btw, which Johanna are you talking about.

[a994]

ragendude, I checked out your site and I am highly impressed with the work you put into your site.

However, I'm surprised nobody mentioned the scene at Andy Warhol's Factory circa 1964-68 which featured several prominent t-ladies and TVs such as Candy Darling and Holly Woodlawn. That was one of the first public venues where transgender and gay people figured heavily in the happenings.

Here's a link to the Wikipedia entry about the Factory:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Factory

[RawNY]

aeonflux1964:
Thanks for your trip downmemory lane. I was one of the white boys hiding in the back at Sallys, lol
NYC was a hot bed for TS in the 70's and into the 80's.
I recall my intro was thorugh pics of several un-named transexuals. However, Screw Magazine was the place to start the process. I recall meeting several T throughout Manhattan and then Queens. The first a beautiful woman with beads in her hair on Columbus Ave., I believe around 72nd Street., then an unreal beauty with whome I fell in love with on the West Side , I think in the Lincoln Center Area. In those days the girls was warm and gracious and did not rush you unless there was another gentleman waiting downstairs.
WHile I wont name names, I fondly recall Sally's, but you forgot one of my favorite places, Trapeeze. Also in TImes Sq., I believe off 7th Avenue about 44th Street. A stage on which rock bands played and straight people danced and found love, a dance floor where everyone mixed with a high wire act overhead and "go go boys and girls". Then there was another room where the crowd was mostly gay , transexual and they had drag shows as well. I would listen to the bands, watch the show, dance, hang out at the bar or in the lounge upstairs over the dance floor. It was Nirvana.
One other place I was privy to was Studio 54. The bathrooms, balcony, downstairs, sex, sweat, poppers and other bodily fluids filled the air. Many transexuals and very beautiful tranvestites were free as a bird and ready for anything hedonistic.
One other place you forgot was the one of a kind Glory Hole. ROoms and Rooms and Rooms with each wall having one or more glory holes. "nough said about that .
I tried to stay away fromt he street walkers in the meat packing district. They were rough and generally ugly and usually dirty.
Over the years I haev lost track of the underground playgrounds. The commercial venues, like Vapor, cater to the curious and the hustlers. I would rather stay home and watch porn, LOL
If you know any places I forgot of, please post them. If you know any places still active and fun, please shoot me an IM.
Thanks,
Peace

[EdelweissFan]

As my screen name suggests, I was a fan of Club Edelweiss, as well as Sally's in the mid 1990s.

Here's a fun fact about Sally's. One of its main performers was a drag queen named Dorian Corey, who had 15 minutes of fame because of her role in the movie, Paris is Burning.

Some weeks after Dorian died of AIDS in 1993, some of her friends went through her closet looking for costumes, and found a body wrapped in a clothing bag, sprinkled with baking soda.

The body had a gun shot wound to the head. The police later determined that the body was at least 20 years old, meaning Dorian had lugged it from apartment to apartment. By the time it was found, the body had turned into a mummy.

A note was found pinned on the body, presumably written by Dorian: "This poor soul broke into my apartment and I was forced to shoot him."

[RawNY]

the Munson Diner? OMG, loved it, quite a bunch of characters as well.

[RawNY]

I Guess I am a bit older than you Arianna,
Alot of shit happened on Jane Street for many years prior to that. I also recall the West Side Piers before the local officials got pressure to clean them up.
Then there was the restaurant on Cannal Street and I think Broadway, which was open 27/7 an da great place to go after being in some downtown venue like the Mudd Club.
We should meet and reminsess, lol

[RawNY]

I Guess I am a bit older than you Arianna,
Alot of shit happened on Jane Street for many years prior to that. I also recall the West Side Piers before the local officials got pressure to clean them up.
Then there was the restaurant on Cannal Street and I think Broadway, which was open 27/7 an da great place to go after being in some downtown venue like the Mudd Club.
We should meet and reminsess, lolOMG! Yes, the Mudd Club had come and gone by the time I was starting to hang out in NY. But I started taking the trains in from NJ by the time I was 13, ran away from home and lived there as a squatter punk by the time I was 16, etc. "Memories,... like the corners where they hooked..." ;-)

Was that YOU? lol we should talk, :wink:

[TJT]

The Mudd Club makes me think of the Ramones.lol

I'm damned old I guess? A cousin of mine worked the pagent scene back in the mid-70's and my family owned gay clubs.The TS/CD thing seemed a bit more blurred then?

There was still a resistance in thinking about being a Transexual. Hell,being gay was still in the med lexicon as mental illness until 1973? The whole Transexual concept was way out there. The medical community was still fighting over it actually existing? Even on the drag circuit in those days the TS concept was controversial.

However,things seemed much more wide-open then both culturally and sexually. Things weren't so puritanical or rigid. Everything but herpes could be cured by going to the doctor and no one really gave a crap what you did,it was your business. It was a great time to be young.

AIDS changed all that. It was like a fucking nuclear bomb going off. Maybe 3 girls I knew then are still alive? Most died from AIDS,several others were murdered in the backlash from AIDS. It's still hard for me to comprehend it all. I try not to think about it.

[RawNY]

The Mudd Club makes me think of the Ramones.lol

Sorry, But Joey and the boys never played there. I don't Steve Maass would have permitted it. But plenty of action in the bathroom, not to mention the cage upstairs.

[TJT]

I don't know about that,but The Ramones refer to the Mudd Club in their song, The Return of Jack and Judy.

"Judy is a punk,Jackie is a skunk
They went down to the Mudd Club
and they both got drunk"

Ever since I heard that song way back when I can't hear the words "Mudd Club' w/o that song popping into my head?

[a994]

I've never been to New York, so I have no firsthand knowledge of the Mudd Club.

But if I were in that place and that time (late '70s-early '80s), I would be much more of a Club 57 guy.

[fitfred]

no mention of angelique? anyone know what happened to her?
ragendude - she doesn't seem to feature on your site either???

[Falrune]

This is a Fantastic Thread... Thanks all!!!

[TsVanessa69]

Here is a link to some pics from Sally's

http://www.sallys-hideaway.com/A_Pictorial_History.html
Wow! That page of pics hold so still famous girls on the NYC scene!
A young Tyra Allure, a retired Monica Mugler who now lives in Puerto-Rico.
a young, dark haired Monica Continental, who is always out and about. A babyfaced Angela Carerra. Wow I know a few of these legends and hear the stories they tell of Sally's. Lionheart is now security at Escuelita. Miss Sylvia Del Rio was very famous here in Chicago before she moved to NYC. In my early stages of transition with dark hair, I bore a striking resemblance to her, and many of her clients came my way. And being very much into the Continental scene and helpg girls who compete, we were stunned whe Jessie died in her hotel room, it also opened my eyes to the dangers of drug usage. Wow to see the pics of what I missed!

[TsVanessa69]

As my screen name suggests, I was a fan of Club Edelweiss, as well as Sally's in the mid 1990s.

Here's a fun fact about Sally's. One of its main performers was a drag queen named Dorian Corey, who had 15 minutes of fame because of her role in the movie, Paris is Burning.

Some weeks after Dorian died of AIDS in 1993, some of her friends went through her closet looking for costumes, and found a body wrapped in a clothing bag, sprinkled with baking soda.

The body had a gun shot wound to the head. The police later determined that the body was at least 20 years old, meaning Dorian had lugged it from apartment to apartment. By the time it was found, the body had turned into a mummy.

A note was found pinned on the body, presumably written by Dorian: "This poor soul broke into my apartment and I was forced to shoot him."
Wow. I'ver heard a few versions of this story, mostly where it was an ex lover who abused her, so thats what really happened!

[TsVanessa69]

I browsed more of that site and came across this page.
It showcases the beauty of my idol Lady cateria reyes, Miss octavia and a black beauty no-one could resist, Miss mercedes!
http://www.sallys-hideaway.com/Portfolio.html

[stan5409]

LOL.... I used to hit those same bars in downtown LA back in the 80's and 90's. I also used to go to the Blacklite on Western Blvd. Yeah, everything you guys say is true. Back then the girls were a lot less money driven, and more about getting with you because they're attracted to you. I had a knack for finding hole in the wall bars that were really trannie bars that not too many knew about. And always was asked if I wanted to go home with them. Not saying I'm Fabio or anything, thats just how it was. There was also a small bar in Hollywood, may have been on Cauhenga between Sunset and Santa Monica. Can't remember the name. And of course the NY scene was just as hot. Sally's when it was on 44th and 8th and right around the corner on 8th was a porno shop with trannies upstairs. About 8 to 10 girls in front of their booths and more inside the peep booth thingy. All kinds of sex went on up their and a lot of drugs. I'll never forget this very attractive black girl who was thick and hung kept pleading with me to meet her after work and go home with her. This was the 80's where I was still curious, but hadn't done the deed with a tgirl. So needless to say, I was nervous. She also lived in Jersey, and I was new to NY, so I didn't take her up on the offer. To this day I still regret that. Thats the way it was though. A lot of sex with no strings attached. Thats why I stay away from the scene today. Like you said Hiwatt, plastic tgirls with plastic attitudes and all thats on their mind is money. They reall don't respect the men like they used to. That nasty term they use "Tranny Chaser" wasn't heard of back then. Girls never said that because they appreciated the fact that men found them attactive and desireable. Sylvia, God bless her soul(who did a couple of porn vids) was one of the nicest girls I ever met. No pretense, no attitude. She just liked sex and weed and having a good time. She could teach the girls today a thing or two about respecting and appreciating men. Hiwatt, do you remember Sylvia and did you ever see her? Just curious.

There was a great jam packed (my first) bar on Cauhenga just north of Hollywood BLVD. It was a long narrow bar and by the time you walked from the entrance to the back you were groped by "girls" a dozen times. I really miss those days and think of them often. Glad I found this site. Oh BTW, the bar was called ( misspelled I'm sure) Da Pauls

[youngblood61]

Great stuff!

[tslvr]

I think the times were better back then simply because every statement you made wasn't over analyzed and scrutinized. The girls knew why you liked hanging out at Eidelweiss or Sally's and most of the time it was fun just to hang out. Today, everything said seems to be misconstrued or you are under a constant hustle, no more just hanging out and having fun. Hope this doesn't offend anyone, this is just an opinion.

[nitron]

I remember a a strictly Dyke Bar, early eighty's , 79. They used to have drag night , once a week, were they would invite a drag queen to lip sink to hitsongs on a stage for an hour, the girls loved it.The performer I saw that one night, was insanely hot and talented ,looked like a better version of Marilyn Monroe, . I only went a few times, just long enough to figure out that the girls who had brought me there wanted me in drag, . Ah, hahaha,
Anyway,the club was named CheMoi, in Hamilton or Toronto, I'm not quite sure.
Back then ,from mid 70's and onward, ,the Lgbdtrans platypus- was aloud to exist ,but not too openly or flamboyantly. They were no spousal benefits, there was no spousal anything.Just allowed to be, but quietly.
Ah,,,the Golden Days....

[jameshargreaves]

Terrific thread.

[handsumjack]

San Francisco 1974 Finocchio's and the Sutro Baths Sex Club.

[zerothehero]

Terrific thread.

I second that. I cannot stop reading this thread which gives wonderful insight into the scene in its early days. Reminds me the reason I join forums in the first place.