35,000 Rally Against U.N./Iran

[White_Male_Canada]

If a large rally is held in New York against Iran, the Star Wars bar

scene aka,the U.N., and the dominant left-leaning media ignore it

does it count ?

[thombergeron]

Wow, 35,000 people rallying in a city of 7 million. I hope they didn't have to re-route traffic. That's, like, almost half as many people as you can find picnicing in Central Park on a Sunday afternoon. I just can't imagine why the pro-Ahmadinejad, anti-Semitic media didn't stop the presses to cover this massive outpouring of public sentiment.

Did you do this photo composite yourself? It's really bad. Next time, use Photoshop.

[thombergeron]

Do you think there are 35,000 people here?

[guyone]

...and they can all be taken out with one of these.

[thombergeron]

It's ironic that you say that, since one of the main reasons Hezbollah was able to bring out 300,000 people that day was the recent aerial bombardment of a civilian population.

Thanks for the thoughtful riposte.

[White_Male_Canada]

It's ironic that you say that, since one of the main reasons Hezbollah was able to bring out 300,000 people that day was the recent aerial bombardment of a civilian population.

Thanks for the thoughtful riposte.

Ironic your support of terrorists when even the majority of Lebanese do not.Good to see the veil slip as we witness just how insane the looney-left is in aligning themselves with butchers and islamofascists:



25 September, 2006
LEBANON
Lebanese Forces and Druze say no to Hezbollah’s demands

Geagea and Jumblatt say a national unity government cannot be created as long as Hezbollah’s is aligned on Syria’s positions. Patriarch Sfeir slams those who place their own partisan interests above those of the nation.


Beirut (AsiaNews) – The Samir Geagea and his Maronite-dominated Lebanese Forces’ and Walid Jumblatt and his predominantly Druze Progressive Socialist Party have said no to Hezbollah leader Hassan Nasrallah’s “victory over Israel” speech in which he demanded a national unity government that would give his party a greater place.

For Samir Geagea, the Lebanese Forces are the real winners because they successfully achieved their goal, which Hezbollah opposed, namely the deployment of Lebanese army troops in southern Lebanon. Druze leader Walid Jumblatt instead rejected any deal with Hezbollah because of the latter’s dependence on Syria.

In this atmosphere of division, Maronite Patriarch Nasrallah Cardinal Sfeir condemned the attitude of those who would prefer to subordinate the good of the nation to its own self-interest. He also demanded that mass rallies “spread love of one’s country” and “bring people together”.

Yesterday’s memorial mass for the “martyrs of the Lebanese Forces”, which saw tens of thousands of people come together at the national Marian shrine in Harissa, came very close to being a response to Hezbollah’s Friday mass rally. Speaking at the religious ceremony, Mr Geagea said, in reply to Hezbollah’s demands, that “[t]here is no national unity government without national unity”. For this to happen, the issue of Hezbollah’s weapons must be solved. “They demand a strong state, but how can a strong state be built with a statelet within its midst?” he said.

In Mukhtara, Druze leader Walid Jumblatt made similar remarks. In his view, the Hezbollah leader’s speech was tantamount to a coup d’état.

http://www.asianews.it/view.php?l=en&art=7307


Anti-Syrian Christian leader Samir Geagea scoffed Sunday at Hizbullah's claims of victory in the war with Israel and avowals that it wanted a strong state in Lebanon. "We are the victors, and yet we do not feel it was victory but rather that a real catastrophe befell our country, and that our fate and destiny are at the mercy of the winds," the Lebanese Forces (LF) leader and member of the "March 14" political group told a rally attended by tens of thousands of supporters.

Crowds flocked to the hilltop Maronite cathedral in Harissa north of Beirut, site of a giant statue of the Virgin Mary, for a mass at the rally, which was staged as a memorial for LF "martyrs" who were killed during the 1975-1990 Civil War.

"We are the victors because it was us who were demanding the [Lebanese] Army's deployment [in South Lebanon], backed by UNIFIL [peacekeepers], while they were opposed," said Geagea.

In a reference to Hizbullah, Geagea said: "Some say that they support the formation of a strong, just and capable state while their acts are hampering the creation of such a state."

"They demand a strong state, but how can a strong state be built with a statelet within its midst? How can it be done with arms and ammunition continuing to flow in, when they force the state to follow their own schedule?" asked Geagea.

"We say to them that once we find a solution to the arms, it will be possible to build a strong state," he said, remaining calm throughout his speech.

"Those tears expressed the exact feelings of the people," he said, referring to Nasrallah's criticism of Premier Fouad Siniora, who wept openly while describing destruction during the war.

It was "out of the question to speak of victory," after more than 1,200 people were killed in Lebanon alone, overwhelmingly civilians, and billions of dollars in damage were inflicted on the country, he said.

The annual event, which was held this year for the first time in 11 years in the presence of the LF leader, came two days after Hizbullah held a giant demonstration in Beirut attended by hundreds of thousands to celebrate what it called a victory in the devastating war with Israel.

For the first time in 12 years, Geagea entered Harissa Cathedral accompanied by his wife, Strida, amid the applause of thousands of LF supporters.

"They said the resistance had protected Lebanon from falling into a civil war ... We say that Lebanese leaders and people are the ones who kept Lebanon away from a civil war," Geagea said. "We are the resistance and we will always be. As we were heroes of the military resistance, we will also be heroes of the peaceful political resistance."

Geagea also said that no weapon would stop his party's calls for Hizbullah to disarm.

"They say that there is no army in the world capable of making them drop their weapons ... We say that there is no weapon that can make us accept this fact," he said.

He added that power could not be measured by the arsenal one had but by unity among all Lebanese parties.

The event drew mainly Christian Lebanese from several regions, notably from the North and Beirut. The crowd chanted: "God, Lebanon, and the doctor [Geagea's nickname] only."

Tens of thousands of supporters blocked the roads to the cathedral. MPs and ministers rode in cable cars to get to the hilltop, with reports that Social Affairs Minister Nayla Mouawad hitched a ride on the back of a motorcycle. Justice Minister Charles Rizk was unable to make it due to the heavy traffic on the roads.

With their white LF flags bearing the cedar tree symbol of Lebanon and their shirts stamped with the sharpened cross of the right-wing party, young supporters chanted slogans against both Hizbullah leader Sayyed Hassan Nasrallah and his ally, General Michel Aoun.

Among the attendees were: Archbishop Roland Abu Jaoude representing Maronite Patriarch Nasrallah Butros Sfeir, as well as Minister of State for Parliamentary Affairs Michel Pharaon and Future Movement MP Riad Rahal representing Prime Minister Fouad Siniora and Speaker Nabih Berri, respectively.
http://www.dailystar.com.lb/article.asp?edition_id=1&categ_id=2&article_id=75687

[guyone]

It's ironic that you say that, since one of the main reasons Hezbollah was able to bring out 300,000 people that day was the recent aerial bombardment of a civilian population.


Eh...Hezbollah is an occupying force largely made up of foreign nationals which uses the local population as human shields. Please don't tell me you actually support cowardly murderers? I don't want to believe that. You really don't believe in the use of children as human shields, do you? Is that what Karl Marx taught you? I don't think so.

[thombergeron]

C’mon you guys. Read a book, for god’s sake. It’s embarrassing.

Unfortunately for both Samir Geagea and Walid Jumblatt, Hezbollah does, in fact, enjoy the support of an overwhelming majority of the Lebanese people. It was nice of the Vatican (aka AsiaNews.it) to publish Jumblatt’s press release, but events on the ground in Lebanon are rapidly eroding the Progressive Socialist Party’s relevance. Geagea is a highly charismatic figure and remains popular among Maronites, but as illustrated by this memorial to Christian militia members killed in the Lebanese Civil War (i.e. 20 years ago), Geagea is increasingly seen as representing the “old” Lebanon.

The inconvenient truth is that Lebanese of all sectarian persuasions have long viewed Hezbollah as a legitimate bulwark against Israeli aggression. And recently, support for Hezbollah has grown, as Party of God is perceived as the Lebanon’s protector in the face of wildly disproportionate Israeli bombardment.

Israeli strikes may boost Hizbullah base
Hizbullah support tops 80 percent among Lebanese factions.
http://www.csmonitor.com/2006/0728/p06s01-wome.html

And guyone, I have to say, in 15 years of academic and policy work, your view of Hezbollah as “occupying force largely made up of foreign nationals” is entirely unique. Hezbollah was founded in Lebanon by Lebanese Shi’ites for the purpose of establishing an Islamic state in Lebanon. Hezbollah’s Secretary General, Sheikh Hassan Nasrallah, was born in Beirut. Hezbollah is a minority partner in the Lebanese government and holds two cabinet positions. Hezbollah has won 14 seats in the Lebanese Parliament. The Lebanese government has formally designated Hezbollah’s military branch as a “legitimate resistance organization.” Hezbollah has the near unanimous support of Lebanese Shi’ites. If Hezbollah is a foreign occupier, it’s done a remarkable job of integrating itself into the local population.

Michael, I know that it’s difficult for you to understand, but there’s a difference between pointing out inconvenient facts and actually “supporting” Hezbollah. The tragedy is that the Lebanese people are in a position in which their hopes and aspirations are placed in an organization that engages in terrorism and crimes against humanity. But that’s where we are, and threatening civilians with strategic weapons systems isn’t going to make militancy less appealing to them. Ask the IDF how that 40 year struggle is going for them.

[guyone]

Using your logic we should have supported the Nazi's because many Germans supported their cause and had a 'legitimate' beef with the jewish population. Unprovoked attacks are acceptable? Israel had giving back much of the disputed territory. Remember seeing all those displaced Israelis leaving their homes?

Are you saying that the proper way of solving a dispute is to kidnap innocent people and launch rockets attacks at populated areas?

If you were walking down the street and someone stopped you and told you not to walk down that street anymore and to get out of town, then to drive home his point socked you in the nose would you stand for that?

You shouldn't solely rely on what you read in books. Use your common sense! It's a question of survival.



(Did I just accidently step into an alternate reality?)

[guyone]

As far as the origins of Hezbollah(from wikipedia):

Hezbollah was largely formed with the aid of the Ayatollah Khomeini's followers in the early eighties in order to spread Islamic revolution.[47] and follows a distinct version of Islamic Shi'a ideology (“Willayat Al-Faqih”) developed by Ayatollah Ruhollah Khomeini, leader of the Islamic Revolution in Iran.[3][10]. Iranian Expediency Council Secretary and former commander of the Revolutionary Guards Mohsen Rezai said in August 2006, "Iran is a model and example for Hizbullah. The Iranian faith, tactics and experience are being put to practice in Lebanon... Hizbullah looks to Iran for tactics and moral [support], and we are proud that our experience [serves] other Muslim countries."

[thombergeron]

God, another Nazi analogy. It’s getting so you can’t hold a mass rally without being compared the Nazis. It’s such tired and lazy rhetoric.

Again, no one here “supports” Hezbollah. What you and I think of Hezbollah is completely irrelevant to the fact that Hezbollah is currently the dominant political and cultural force in Lebanon. And this situation is almost entirely attributable to Hezbollah’s continued and successful military opposition to IDF incursions into Lebanon, as well as Israel’s total failure to deal with Lebanon in any context apart from the military one.

And congratulations on doing some actual research on Hezbollah’s origins. You’re doing better than Michael, who doesn’t even read the stuff he cuts and pastes here. Unfortunately, the Wikipedia article you’ve cited doesn’t actually support your contention that Hezbollah is an “an occupying force largely made up of foreign nationals….” Hezbollah was certainly influenced by Khomeini and the Iranian Revolution. An entire generation of Shi’ites across the Middle East was influenced by Khomeini and the Iranian Revolution. Notably, Islamic al-Dawa Party and the Supreme Council for Islamic Revolution in Iraq, the two main partners in the Iraqi government’s ruling coalition, were influenced by Khomeini and the Iranian Revolution. Nouri al-Maliki, currently Prime Minister of Iraq, spent his exile in Tehran and Damascus. So is Iraq currently under Iranian occupation?

By the way, speaking of logic: On the eve of the Polish invasion, the Wehrmacht had a force strength of about 2 million men. Hezbollah’s military branch numbers between 600 and 1,000 front line fighters, with perhaps 10,000 reserves. Nazi Germany had a population of 69 million and was the dominant industrial power in the world. In 1938-39, its economy was almost entirely focused on rearmament. The Luftwaffe was the most technologically advanced air force on earth. Lebanon has a population of 7 million and possesses almost no modern industrial capacity. Hezbollah is armed with between 12,000 and 20,000 short-range missiles and small arms. It has no armor and no air force.

[guyone]

Yet Hezbollah is still the aggressor. If someone didn't want me to exist I would do my damnedest to survive. They are the one's who launch preemptive strikes. I think they are deplorable in that matter. Israel did pull out of the disputed territory and yet they continue to aggravate the matter, not to fight Israel but to flex their own muscles. To make them look as a protector to the Lebanese people. This is the mask they use to hide from the fact that they are only interested in power for powers sake. This does not make a conducive environment for a peaceful coexistence. Do you agree?

[thombergeron]

I would agree that bombing civilians, whether with F-15s or Katyushas filled with ball bearings, is nonconducive to a peaceful coexistence. Absolutely, both the IDF/IAF and Al-Muqawama al-Islamiyya committed unforgvable and abominable atrocities in the Second Lebanon War.

But do I agree that Hezbollah is nihilistically attacking Israel because "they are only interested in power for powers sake"? No, because that's meaningless. Hezbollah has an agenda, just like any other affinity group. There is essentially no social infrastructure or civil society in southern Lebanon apart from Hezbollah. Hezbollah has established schools, including a school for children with Down's Syndrome, clinics, hospitals. Many of these are staffed almost exclusively by women, many on a volunteer basis. Now, is Hezbollah establishing a social welfare network where none existed before in order to "make them look as a protector to the Lebanese people," and thus, "hide from the fact that they are only interested in power for powers sake"?

To simply say that Hezbollah is the aggressor is just inadequate. Would it be better if Hezbollah had not launched those Katyushas, if it had not initiated the raid on Zar'it and Shtula? Undoubtedly.

But the reality that we all have to deal with here is that the Lebanese people, not just Hezbollah, don't feel that way. A majority of the Lebanese people believe that the only way to liberate Lebanese detainees in Israeli prisons is through the capture of Israeli soldiers and a prisoner swap, as was the case in 2000. The Lebanese people don't believe that that Israel has has pulled out of the disputed territory. The Lebanese government continues to press its claim to the Shebaa Farms.

By relying soley on the military option, Israel bears a high degree of responsibility for this animosity. Israel is a strong, stable, democratic nation. It is not going to be wiped of the map by Hezbollah or Iran or Syria or Hamas or all of them working together. Israel needs to use this position of strength to start coming up with some other solutions. Its been fighting Arab nationalism militarily for 40 years and has made zero progress toward peace.